To think a lot of people don't understand what a depression or anxiety disorder are?

[darkuncertainplace]

I'm writing this out of both frustration and despair. I have felt for a while that a lot of people don't actually understand what it means to have major depressive disorder, or an anxiety disorder.

I have heard so many people say the following in the last few years:

"Everyone gets anxiety/depression"
"You've just got to snap yourself out of it/get on with things"
"Just do things that make you happy and you'll feel better"
"It's normal to be anxious, we all just have to get on with it"

Etc etc. It makes me feel so frustrated. As someone who was diagnosed with major depressive disorder at 18, you cannot just pull yourself out of it. You are in a dark, dark hole and you can't see the beauty or joy in anything. You feel nothing except emptiness and darkness. It's an medical illness, not a mood.

Same for anxiety disorder. My triggers cause me physical symptoms such as panic attacks, consuming feelings of dread and fear, dizziness etc. It is paralysing and has made my life a misery.

They are both disabilities that seriously affect people's lives. I wish there was a different name for these disorders that separate them more clearly from just depression and anxiety.

The difference between temporary depression and long-term clinical depression was explained to me by my GP when I was in a dark place. I went to see him because I had a lot of dark thoughts and was worried that I had post-natal depression a couple of months after the birth of my DC.

After a chat, he explained that yes I was depressed, but that I had a lot to be depressed about. He was not worried about me because he felt that changing my circumstances would alleviate the depression. That talk helped me ernormously as we then moved on to discuss how I could change some of the things that were making me depressed and I learned how to manage my depression.

Those with clinical depression do not have the same level of control. Their depression is not linked to their circumstances and therefore is much harder to manage. It is very different. I have a friend who on the outside is perfect in every way with a lovely life. She is clinically depressed, in and out of the MH unitl. There is no clear reason for her continued depression - that is a long-term serious illness.

We need to help those with both types of depression as those with temporary depression are equally likely to commit suicide, but are much easier to help than those with long-term clinical depression. This may be a very simplified view but it has helped me to understand others better. Unfortunately our MH services are not adequate to help everyone get the right treatment.

@Plumblossomsbloom

"it means learn to live with it, find some way of achieving basic functioning in life in spite of your suffering"

People with these disorders have no choice but to live with it, and often that is all they do...exist. The point of this thread is that when your mental health is so bad that you have one of these disorders, it's impossible to live a normal life with it.

If I get out of bed, brush my teeth, wash, then I am doing very well. Heck, if I can get myself out for a walk, I am winning at life. Doing normal things like that is so hard with these disorders. That's why it's a disability, because it disables you! It is not a choice.

I’m so sorry you experienced that. I’ve had CPTSD and your account of the experiences captures it so very awfully. The feelings of shame and disgust and horror and fear that come back in the present are almost unbearable. It is a truly awful experience.

My parents supported the abuser, a family member and everyone else enabled them so I had a severe mental betrayal trauma to deal with too. It was awful.

I would say that thankfully I’m largely recovered now but it has been an awful process and it made me realise that there are some people like yourself with even more awful histories than mine for whom that battle to process their experiences might not end for a long time but I really do hope it does for you.

I know people who have refused to open the door on their experiences at all and it still has an enormous effect on their lives and on who they become because of that. Processing these experiences gives you the absolute best opportunity to pull these traumatised parts and help them to heal and integrate them but it is such a brave battle.

Life can be so utterly awful sometimes. I wish you the absolute best 💐

I do think the lack access to first line mental health services in the UK allows slight depression to spiral quickly into a much worse mental health problem. Here you have to wait a minimum of 3 years to get a CAMHS appointment for either anxiety or low mood. That is just criminal. By the time the young person is finally seen the problem is often much worse, and
much harder to treat.

Maybe at your school no one ever had a panic attack, but a girl at my school went through hell with them. (1980s, so nothing to do with social media or copycatting, it was because unbeknown to anyone at the time she was being sexually abused by her father.) Guess what? She was told she was just doing it for attention and to get a grip. Not just by classmates but by some of the teachers. She couldn't, and because times were less enlightened I don't think she ever got the help she needed.

It's an absolute myth that anxiety and depression were less prevalent in previous decades. Sufferers were simply expected to keep quiet and pull themselves together, as happened to me when I experienced severe depression in my teens. And although I was never suicidal, I don't like to think about how many people might have killed themselves in less enlightened times because the only 'help' they received was being barked at to get a grip.

If a person can manage to drag themselves out of whatever they are experiencing mental health-wise, that's great but it doesn't mean everyone can. It simply means that person was more mildly affected in the first place. And there is a massive difference between 'wallowing' and being so crushed by depression or anxiety that functioning becomes impossible. Yes, human nature being what it is, some people probably do put it on or exaggerate for attention - but it's offensive to tar real, crushing, crippling and potentially fatal mental health issues with the same brush.

Whereas when I suffered depressive episodes the thing that accelerated it every time was having to continue going to work. I didn't know getting signed off sick was a thing. I didn't know benefits were a thing. I didn't have a diagnosis at the time because I didn't see a doctor. I used to quit my job, recover at home then go get another job in a few months, living on savings in the meantime. I didn't know why I was like this, I only knew it wasn't my fault, wasn't a laziness thing because that's not who I am.

At home, I wasn't wallowing in my own misery, I was taking care of myself and my home. Slept when I could because denying myself sleep during the day because I was at work, in a misguided attempt to force sleep to come at night, never worked and made everything worse. Taking the pressure off, not having to arrive at work an hour late with some excuse and face and angry boss because I couldn't get out of bed for ages, with no breakfast because I'd got up late, tired and disheveled because I'd had no time to wash and had had to run to the train station so as not to miss that later train. Being at work trying to hide anything is wrong, crying in the toilet with tissue clamped between my lashes so my eyes wouldn't swell up too much from the tears, none of that was helpful. Fake-it-til-you-make-it made me suicidal.

Being at home was what I needed, so I could take care of myself, force myself to do all those basic things necessary for life slowly throughout the day. Giving myself that break from work was necessary to help me improve.

Work helped you and that's great, but the attitude that working always helps is damaging. I do agree about the day care centres though.

You misunderstand me. I don't think it's a choice and didn't say that.

I totally agree with what you've said here. I didn't say you'd be able to live a normal life, just that you have to find a way to live ("exist" if you prefer to call it that, fair enough) with the illness. And I do believe mental illness in a lot of cases does constitute a disability and that if people can't work they shouldn't have people trying to force them to do so. I have no problem with the mentally ill claiming benefits either.

The point of this thread is "people don't understand", yes, ok, I get that. My point in response to you is "you're being unreasonable to expect them to". It's the same with physical illness or disability, people don't understand that either. Only people who've been there understands it.

So if you talk to them about it, you're likely to get the responses you've posted about, responses which don't help you and make you feel worse. That's my point. That you have to learn to get on with it without burdening everyone around you IRL, because they can't help you for the most part. They don't understand so there's nothing useful they can say. If it's unbearable you need professional help. My advice is to try to enjoy, as much as possible, your time with friends and family instead of discussing your health.

In latter years the diagnosis of ‘manic depressive’ was dropped in favour of ‘bipolar disorder’ and then to ‘borderline personality disorder’ different label, same horrible illness.

Just a note that EUPD/BPD is a completely different condition to Bipolar disorder. Autistic women have been misdiagnosed with the former for years and there is no drug treatment, bipolar is a mood disorder which can be helped with medication.

Have you tried anything like Escitalopram? It's helped me a lot. I'm sorry you're struggling so much.

Crikey i think I must have this - could have written your first paragraph word for word, i also wake up with a feeling of dread although that dissipates and I often lie in bed and worry I am going to die in my sleep. Or worry when say we are about to go out for the day that we will be in a crash and die, especially if it's just me and the husband and the teenager at school so she'd be left without parents. Is that proper anxiety rather than me just being a bit odd?

And then a couple of times I have had to present to a lot of people I have what you've described. Well this is an eye opener, thought i was quite well adjusted - I have quite a senior role at work.

I suppose though I was quite astounded when my other half went to the doctors and described feelings of dread, anger and had increased blood pressure and they gave him beta blockers which I then googled and they seem to be the holy grail for some , well a lot of people and I did think good grief I should have gone to the doctors , he's had these symptoms for a few months and I've had them all my life!

So in your view, what is the difference between ‘ordinary’ anxiety and some version of it that needs to be taken seriously?

i’m presuming you think that somebody who needs treatment from a psychiatrist has ‘proper’ anxiety that should be taken seriously. What about somebody who gets standard anxiety medication from a GP and has counselling?

The 100mph thought patterns and dissecting a problem from every angle and once your brain is satisfied with that well here's another conundrum to be getting on with.
Repeating yourself to a partner with the ins and outs of a problem for days.
Withdrawal from life
Sleeping excessively .
On high dose of anti Depp..my own 150 mg sertraline.
This is not a life that anyone would choose.

Yep. I’m diagnosed with CPTSD which is mostly manageable, but have experienced 3 episodes of severe depression in my life. They all lasted about 6 months. Each time it floored me in different ways. 1st time I went back to work quite quickly and although exhausted felt like I needed the routine. 3rd time I couldn’t work for two months - I could barely sleep or leave the house. Luckily I was doing a role where I could take some time off.

I think because it can affect people so differently it’s hard for people who’ve never experienced it to understand how debilitating it is. Even the name is misleading - I didn’t feel sad, I felt terrified and exhausted. I had recurring suicide ideation and it was terrifying. Even though logically I knew I wouldn’t hurt myself it felt like my mind was slipping away from me. I was literally counting the hours until the anti depressants would work - and thankfully they always have after about 5-6 weeks in. Each episode seemed to arrive out of the blue too. I would not wish it on my worst enemy!

hopefully threads like this can help spread awareness- thanks for raising it OP.

I don't disagree that MH issues are inherited. A great uncle who was a talented draughtsman and water colourist, was medicated from the 1940s for the rest of his life. His very clever wife decided they would have a sweet shop to earn their living, from about 1958 until 1976 approximately, when they retired. But I don't think he or she ever resorted to hand outs from the public purse. They did not have much money, but they didn't take expect much support either.

This is happening. We have friends working quite high up in the field saying they’re seeing people in inpatient who are there because treatable MH problems were left to get so much worse. It’s terrifying for those of us battling for care for our young people. It makes me so angry too.

You're describing intrusive thoughts and anxiety or panic symptoms especially during the presentation. The thing with having it all your life is you don't realise anything is wrong because to you it's normal. I used to think everyone felt this way when they got scared or bothered by something. You can still go to the doctor's now if you wanted or get therapy privately, both can help. It doesn't matter that you've put up with it upto now. I was diagnosed in middle age. Beta blockers deal with the physical symptoms only, they are blood pressure drugs sometimes prescribed for anxiety. They won't deal with the mental symptoms unless you're primarily panicking about the physical symptoms and stuck in a vicious circle, for the mental symptoms you'll need a psychiatric drug, doctors generally start with an SSRI and see how you go, lots have a sedative effect that will help you sleep.

Some of which is of dubious veracity and wide open to being twisted to suit people's personal agendas.

I think people will never ever know until it hits them. Then they’ll say ‘I didn’t realise’ and be embarrassed.I used to always try to cheer people up until I get hit with depression and realised I couldn’t get/ make myself happy.

Oh 100%

People love to tell me anxiety and depression didn't exist in "their day"

And yet, aged 12, not only was I experiencing depression, I was also self harming and suicidal. And no, we don't have the internet back in 1999 (well certainly not like we do now).

In fact I first found out what the word "depression" meant as I was, as I sually did every braktime, hiding from the bullies in the library. It was there I found a science book on "depression". I remember reading it and thinking "oh shit, this is exactly how I feel 🙃"

Ironically if anyone in my school year thinks back they will remember someone who had panic attacks....it was me. Me who repeatedly had to leave the classroom due to them. Me who was specifically sat at the back of every exam room in case I had one and needed to get out.

It 100% existed. We just didn't talk about it.

Even when I was applying to uni circa 2005, I was specifically told DO NOT TELL THEM YOU ARE MENTALLY ILL (because they might reject you etc)"

Back more to the OP, I sadly don't think many people who haven't personally experienced it, truly understand how debilitating or disabling it can honestly be. I lost all of my teens and most of my twenties to it (and sadly on numerous occasions also almost my life ). It's a battle I've now been fighting for 29 years. 😫☹️ I've spent more of my life mentally ill than not. I can't even remember what it feels like to feel "normal"

I'm glad they worked for you. Treatment made my CPTSD much worse. But everyone is different and I think people should try various treatments. With luck and patience, some of them may help alleviate symptoms.

I'm adding this because the general public often assumes that because there are treatments for X and some people improve, everyone with X condition will improve with treatment and just needs to get on with it.

What a sensible GP and very true. If depression/anxiety can be resolved by change in lifestyle why get someone hooked on medication.

I hope all is well with you now.

@Bluecrystal2 Thank you I am much better now. I do however remember those days vividly. The days I just couldn't stop crying, the days when I felt so helpless I couldn't get out of bed, couldn't eat or do anything. The day I walked out and left my house and my crying baby alone because I wasn't coping as a single mother with no help. A kind stranger found me crying and in a bad way and took me to the local doctor's surgery.

The sympathetic non-judgemental GP and a lovely local childminder he found for me helped me to get to a position where I could go back to work which was a huge turning point. I started to feel human again although I will always feel guilty about how I neglected my baby (DC was absolutely fine and is now an adult and doing well at life with DCs of her own).

It sounds so simple now, but despite being generally an intelligent person, at the time I just couldn't work it out for myself.

I wasn't in the UK at that time so had no family and very few friends around. I have ASD which back then I didn't know about or understand at all. It has impacted my life in so many ways but now it explains so much, particularly my levels of anxiety. Just having that understanding of why I do what I do has allowed me to develop better coping strategies. I do still suffer from bad days, days when I can't leave the house due to anxiety, but I now have the ability to not let it spiral. I may wallow for a couple of days, but at some point I am able to get myself out of it by doing something, however small, that starts to get me back on track. Knowing when to ask someone for help and that doing so is a sign of courage rather than failure is also really important.

You've really been through a hard time and am so pleased you are doing well.

Be selfish and don't allow stress or toxic people into your life. . Modern life is all about displaying the perfect life where money and looks are everything. A simple life is best. Stay strong.

I think people just actually don’t really want to get into discussing it, the comments are ways to wind up the conversation.

People have compassion fatigue since covid.

What do you want them to say? I think most people are acting kinddly