Daughter starting nursery job, expected unpaid early starts and late finishes

[Nurserynewby12]

My daughter is looking forward to beginning a new job this week in childcare. She interviewed really well and will be studying for a qualification too. This all seems great. I work in accounts so do not know much about nursery care work but she has told me she has to start fifteen minutes early every day and will have to stay later than her finish time if parents are late or cleaning needs to be done. Both of these early and late instances will apparantly be unpaid. I do not know about nursery things much but did think this is unpaid work and not legal? Is there different rules for nurseries? I think if this happens all time she is being exploited whether she gets a qualification or not? She does not know as she is new to this area of work. I want to protect her from being exploited but need views from childcare/employment lawyers? Anyone around from employment law or a nursery manager to advise?

It always used to be the case that you had a set up shift
One person each day came in early to set the place up and everybody else walked in at the same time as the parents

That sounds totally reasonable especially as number of carers have to be on at any one time.

Useful Links :

Young Women’s Trust

YOUNG WOMEN'S TRUST
We champion young women aged 18 to 30 on low or no pay. We’re here to create a more equal world of work and raise young women’s incomes.
www.youngwomenstrust.org

I worked in a private nursery several years ago. Opening times were 8 am to 6 pm.
The manager was there before everyone else in the mornings, I started at 8.
Cleaning was done during the last hour of the day. After 5.00, there weren't many children left so they just got moved around the rooms as they were cleaned. If any children were late being collected, the manager stayed with them and we went home. We never worked unpaid.
That's two and a half hours free labour they're getting out of your daughter per week- 10 hours a month. Which equates to quite a bit of money over time!

Actually in work and working 15 minutes before the start time, or are they telling her to arrive 15 minutes before start time so she has bag/coat/lunch etc put away and is ready to start on time? Because the latter is pretty normal. Otherwise they'd get people turning up 'on time' then doing personal related stuff on work time instead of their own.
Staying late when she's waiting for other people and not being paid for it is a different kettle of fish imo.

Nobody gets paid for arriving and getting settled or packing up and leaving. That’s the reality of the world of work.

I assume your daughter is on a probation period so I’d advise treading carefully.

I started working in nurseries 9 years ago, I've worked at 3 different ones and when I started staff meetings were unpaid, you had to start 15 minutes early unpaid, first aid course on the weekend was unpaid. The nursery I worked at slowly started to change and all of these hours were paid / given back in lieu by the time I left there. Times are changing and this nursery is well behind. It's definitely not legal. However it's very difficult to change this as a new member of staff.

And nor should you.

Many many moons ago I worked at John Lewis. Store closed at 6pm, partners were paid until 6.10pm - if you have to do it, it's work

This is outrageous and illegal.

I've never heard of this before?

Approximately two thirds of UNISON is female.

That is the life of a nursery. If you open the doors at 08:00 you need to be there 15 minutes before to get yourself ready and the room ready, If you close at 18:00 you will be there later because you can't chuck the children out of the room, pick up you coat and walk out. Day care providers have been getting away with free labour for the last half century.
I demanded and got my 2.5 hours paid. The bosses asked me not to tell the other staff i was given this money, so of course i told the rest of the staff and they were all given the same pay.

I mean specific examples of boys getting paid more than girls.(apologies for calling them boys and girls...just to differentiate between the established worker).

My daughter works in a nursery and has done for the past 3 years, she loves it, and yes she has to sometimes work a little later to finish the cleaning of the room she works in, or to wait for a parent to collect one of the children she is responsible for. However this is not every day more like once every couple of weeks and it is for no longer than 15 mins. It's part of the job for her.

This is fairly standard in lots of jobs. They get a 10-15 mins tea break instead that makes up the time.

If it is her first job she should show a great work ethic.

After proving herself she could then fairly ask for small breaks during the day to compensate. But working an extra fifteen minutes is expected in many sectors.

A great work ethic includes knowing your basic rights and getting paid legally.

I find it bizarre that anyone would happily give their employer unpaid time on a daily basis. It might be unavoidable in some jobs, but that doesn't mean to say people should act like it's fine and dandy.

I worked in nurseries about 15 years ago. We were expected to be in at least 20 minutes early if we were on the first shift to set up for the day and if on the last shift we couldn't leave until the cleaning was done, although this rarely meant working later as cleaning would start before the end of the day and children were often all picked up before the end of the day. Luckily things have improved to ensure minimum wage is paid but when I was an apprentice I was on the flat rate of about £84 a week and always did extra hours if staff were off sick or on leave, sometimes working 50 hours pw.
I think they get away with it because it's generally a lot if young people who don't challenge.

I've never used a nursery but always assumed that the late pick up fees covered staff wages! Seemingly not.

The women pay their union dues but will the unions represent her? Unions wouldn't represent the Darlington nurses.

Can we stop dragging trans into every unrelated thread, you have the feminist forum to complain about trans people.

Well, logically, everyone needs to be at their place of work before their start time. Whether thats to stow away belongings, log in to a computer system etc so thats not unusual. Equally, if the work isnt finished by the finish time, she stays late to ensure it is surely?

Hi. Any time at work needs to be paid. That's why we work. End of. They are taking the mick

Do you not see the difference between a couple of minutes early to stow your bag away and 15 minutes early to set up the room, carry out checks, get breakfast ready (often called working)?

If the work isn't finished by finish time then either there is too much work, or not enough time. Both of these are management issues that should not be solved by making the employee work for free.

So she’ll still be training? I worked every hour god sent when training paid or unpaid, I didn’t care. Once fully qualified I demanded top dollar for every minute of my time.

Minimum wage isn't 'top dollar' 😂