"Not all men” replies are ridiculous

[GarlicFound]

Generalisations exist for a reason. There's no need to point out that there are exceptions. When you want to highlight that your comment's universal, you say "All children", for instance. Generalising to "Children" implies "Children in general, for the most part, usually".

Everybody knows this. So there's no need to specify "NOT ALL MEN" each and every time anyone makes a general observation about men, goddamit!

You don't say "Not all dogs [have four legs]" or "Not all ice-cream [is cold]".

Having a penis doesn't make you especially vulnerable to generalisations. So grow up, please, and accept that YOU or your DH are not "all men" - general comments aren't intended to single you out. And if you feel like they are, you're a bit thick, not to mention narcissistic.

I’m not talking about making ‘fair and accurate judgments’. I’m talking about about making generalisations in the absence of more information or knowledge of the people than the broad description given.

I would still generalise that child molesters are much more likely to be men.
I wouldn’t be generalising that men are child molesters.

A generalisation needs to nod towards the majority. The majority of men are NOT child molesters.
But, the majority of child molesters are men.

It is REALLY important to differentiate between the two.

I don’t understand what is complicated about this!

And often they are there to protect people.

The only generalisation that are bad are incorrect stereotypes such as fat people are lazy. Which is blatantly untrue.

However men pose a risk to women that women don’t pose to women. It is a useful, accurate and important generalisation.

When biology text talk about women’s reproductive cycle they don’t then go into a whole new sentence about how not all women get periods.

Men's generalisations have resulted in patriarchy, oppression, and abuse. Women's generalisations have resulted in....?

So how on earth would generalising about men make women worse than men?

Because it’s unnecessary and done in bad faith.
Women understand the damage it has done (and still does) when false generalisations are made about them.
Doing the same back is just vengeful and unnecessary, and actually undermines the women’s cause.

Yes, it's terrible when an oppressed demographic generalises about the oppressor class. It's so dreadfully damaging and vengeful, and totally undermines their expectation of having equitable rights 🙄 It totally makes the oppressed class worse than their oppressors.

You sound ridiculous.

That is fine if the generalisation is blatantly untrue. We use the categories men and women in categories for good reason.

Such as
Women shouldn’t run in marathons because their uterus’s will fall out.
Blatantly untrue.

But...
Women face more barriers to sport due to their menstrual cycle
True and fine generalisation even though many women don’t get periods and young female runners may not yet have periods and older women the same. But we understand the generalisation. I don’t hear men shouting not all women have periods…...

Men’s mental health and well being is in decline.
True and fine generalisation. We know the sentence is referring generally to men, not all men but more men than women are facing mental health crisis and we also know it’s a minority. Nevertheless we generalise because women aren’t suffering to the same degree.

We have a problem with men raping and being violent towards women.

Not all men!!!!!!!

No not all men but ONLY men rape women and it’s prevalent. 1 in 4.

I don’t like sweeping statements of any kind.

There's nothing at all complicated about it. Pretty much everybody who can read and understand stats is in agreement that it's not all men but its nearly always men.
The reason this basic truth becomes complicated, is that some people are unable to accept it. Either because they don't like it, or because they don't understand it.
Yet they are unable to argue against it because there is too mych evidence to refute. So instead, they try to divert attention from it by creating straw men, arguing its not all men, when no one said it is.
Its not 'really important' to state not all men are child molesters, rapists and murderers. Because no one in their right mind thinks this. To tell people something so obvious is irritating and distracting.

Some people on this thread are really getting on their knees for the men folk aren't they.

They aren't going to save you and they don't give a shit you're here defending them. They are statistically more likely to walk on by if you're getting assaulted.

This. I never understand why women work so hard to defend men in conversations like this.

They're likely not here to read it so their feelings aren't getting hurt, they probably wouldn't care if they did read it (a decent man would likely wince, shrug and say 'fair enough', and a shitty man deserves the generalisation), and they're not going to think any better of a woman who goes out of her way to defend their 'honour' (in fact the shitty ones would probably laugh, and think, 'dumb bitch').

It's such an Aunt Lydia thing to do - a collaborator, hoping to curry favour with their masters by showing what a good and faithful servant they are.

??? 1 in 4 men are rapists?!

I think we’re allowed to disagree.
I don’t think you sound ridiculous. I just disagree with you.

Intelligent people recognise their biases, check them and use them in ways that benefit others.
eg. Poor children do worse at school - pupil premium. Not all children need it. But we do it anyway.do you see why your argument isn’t landing?
But that is the problem, people don't recognise their biases or check them. They use generalisations to apply to individuals even when they are no signs that it applies to that person.

This is totally different to using statistics to form policies to benefit specific groups.

And often they are there to protect people
Whilst harming others! Assumptions that are made on you, especially when these involve you putting someone in danger, based only on stereotypes and generalisations which has nothing to do with you as person does do emotional harming in the long term.

Generalisations are really important actually.
They are not sweeping statements.

To understand risk and make safety improvements we have to generalise.

Statement - Women take longer to go to the toilet than men.
This is a generalisation and has been used to increase provision in women’s toilets to reduce queues. It is a sweeping statement because not all women take longer.

Statement- Women are shorter than men.
From this statement we could petition to get every day furniture and car seat belts o be made to fit our general height as opposed to men’s. Of course you won’t hear people argue but not all women are shorter than men.

Statement- We have a problem with male violence against women and girls in the UK.
We can generalise about the men as a sex class using accurate from data and facts such as rape stats and highlight the problems they are causing to women and girls. The male sex class has a massive impact on women’s freedoms to go about their day without being catcalled, attacked, flashed at, or even use the internet without receiving rape threats for having an opinion etc. This is a male sex class problem, not a known individual who could be called out individually.

If men don’t like it they should start calling misogyny out because then no one would making these statements cause they wouldn’t exist.

No as has been stated 1 in 4 WOMEN will be raped in their lifetime.

You have ben on this thread for a while maybe you haven’t read any of the stats?

All policies started because people started talking about an issue.

I'm some cases yes. But they tend to be cases where the group being generalised about holds low levels of power and so are at risk that the generalisations made about them will translate to detriment towards them (discrimination is prejudice PLUS power. Without the power the prejudice/generalisation is toothless).
Men are not a powerless group in our society. So even if most women made generalisations about them, so what, really?
Are they suddenly going to become less safe on the streets and in their homes? Earn less than us? Be demoted from their positions of authority and influence? Basically what harm do men specifically suffer if some women generalise about their behaviour?
Because ime there tends to be two responses from men to these discussions. Either they agree, because they've seen the stats, they've observed the behaviour and they know that while it's not all men it's male patterned behaviour. Or they dismiss it. We're crazy man haters, bitter feminists who they can ignore. And they do.
What I've never come across is a man psychologically, socially or practically harmed by the acknowledgement that some behaviours are displayed almost exclusively by men and a lot of men display them.
The good ones know it doesn't include them. The bad ones excuse and defend. And those in the middle don't give it anywhere near as much headspace as their female defenders do.

@depacked

If men don’t like it they should start calling misogyny out because then no one would making these statements cause they wouldn’t exist.

Could not agree more!

👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

Men are not a powerless group in our society. So even if most women made generalisations about them, so what, really?
Actually young men are feeling very powerless. They dint say things because they fear assumptions will drawn about them, not vases on them but the generalisations that are made about men in general, which might not apply to them at all.

So what really? Because men have been in power for ages, the solutuons is to do the same to them and make them feel powerless so women can finally have their turn in power?

That's not my vision of a healthy and productive future.

How do you decide what to wear each day?

Generally, the winter is cold and the summer is warm. Do you wear a big coat in the winter but not in the summer.

That doesn't mean all winter days are freezing or that all summer days are hot. But it's a generalisation that gets you through the year without finding yourself in the middle of winter wearing a sundress outside.

Because men have been in power for ages, the solutuons is to do the same to them and make them feel powerless so women can finally have their turn in power?

And no one has ever said that either

Agree.

And also, it IS all men.

Or at least, all men benefit from the limits placed on women's agency by the fact that women can never know what kind of man they're dealing with until it's too late.

They dont say things. Bless them. Feeling a bit silenced are they? Is that necessarily a bad thing that women are calling them what they are if they express sexist views?

what man decides what to wear, where to go, who to go with etc knowing if something happens people probably won’t believe them and talk about what they were wearing while the man will get away with it? Gay ones maybe - but the enemy is still the same. Men.

im sorry the little snowflakes can’t cope with accountability.

and my answer? Opt out. Unless you are actively fighting for or protecting my rights, including calling out your sexist bros and refusing to watch porn, I’m avoiding you. Prove to me you’re not that type of guy. Why do I need to do the work of assessing you first when the facts speak for themselves?

I will continue to say not all men. I have a young adult son. I will continue to say it because you carnt tar all men with the same brush, especially when you including my son as all men.