AIBU to not rent a house to our relative?

[NewNameForThisWWYD]

We have some properties that we rent out. A couple of relatives have always had a problem with this and have taken every opportunity to tell us that we are terrible for adding to the issues with housing.

Now one of these relatives has split from her partner and is looking for a house to rent. She has asked us if she can rent from us and asked if she can do so at a cheaper rate or free to help her out. We have a property empty currently as we are having some work done on it. It will be ready in a couple of months so this relative could in theory move in then. Other relatives are putting pressure on us to help her, one even said we should let her stay in the house for free and completely ignoring the fact that this woman has been horrible to us over the years.

I want to say no. It’s a relative on my husband’s side and he is happy to say no but doesn’t care either way. Neither of us like this relative very much, she is very opinionated and has picked the fight about landlords with us many times at family events making a scene. Every time we see her she makes digs and negative comments. She has also made it known that she disapproves of other choices we’ve made and is generally just very judgemental. We see her at family events to keep the peace in the wider family but really wouldn’t care if she wasn’t in our lives.

She works in a career that pays well above average wage and has 2 children. The house she wants to rent from us has 4 bedrooms.

What would you do? Say no? Rent to her at market rate? Rent to her at a lower rate? Obviously my preference is to say no but I think this will cause issues with some other family members.

Fair enough.

Some points about her,

She is a good mum and I respect that.
I believe she would pay the rent as she very straight about money.
I don’t believe for a second she would damage the property.

I wrote what I thought was relevant. It is relevant that she’s been horrible to us as it shows the relationship between us which could cause issues if we rent to her and I was honest about begrudging renting to someone who has been an arsehole to us in the past. I mentioned her earning a decent wage because it’s not like she will struggle to afford a house.

I have no desire for anyone to validate me if they think I’m being unfair. I wanted genuine opinions, and tbh, I’m shocked more people haven’t said to help her out as she is family and she has children. Although I don’t want to help her, a part of me feels like I should for the children as they are our family, have had their life blown up by their selfish father and are completely innocent in all of this. I also feel for her being cheated on. It doesn’t feel clear cut to me due to all of this which is why I asked here.

Definitely a No

Under the Renters Rights Act you eoukd struggle to get her out except to sell it especially if you agree a low rent or no rent!

Just say the mortgage (even if there isn't one) precludes renting to family. This is entirely usual.

You know at some stage she will simply stop paying rent because she will assume you won't evict because she is family.

It's just not worth the hassle.

Do not in a million years let this woman move in!!!

she is already asking to live there for free - presumably you are paying a buy to let mortgage. She will not pay you rent and will not pay bill, I think you know this.

why is she also cutting her nose to spite her face by waiting for months for you to finish working on the property. Has she even bothered looking for a property in the area? Of course not! She has no intention to and she could. As awful as it sounds her kids are her responsibility and she is foisting that on you.

get your husband to say no and ideally get the relative working on the house to keep quiet!

OP you may as well give her the house as once she’s in you’ll never get her out/money from her or maintenance done. She doesn’t like you and wants to use you. Don’t guilt trip yourself about the kids, they have a dad, although he’s a cheat surely he will house them if she’s on the street?
you have investment plans for your DCs and that includes the rental income on this house.
if she can’t have a cup of tea with you without being unpleasant how can a LL Tenant position ever work? It’s madness and going to cost you more than the house is with in potential solicitors fees and wear and tear

No way! I was put in a similar situation similar years ago. A close relative constantly bullying me and putting me down. Funnily enough she didn't seem to have a problem with me owning a second property when she wanted to move in rent free. I said no. I knew that even if I said yes, I would still be the bad guy somehow, and I'd never get rid of her.

You cannot win in this situation, but you can in a way lose less by saying no to your relative.

We rent out properties and had a similar situation a few years back.

Anybody saying we should rent to her for free, I’d look confused and say “But that would cost us £800 a month? Are you asking us to lose £800 a month from our income?” They can’t quite see that the rent is our income, they just think it’s free money. I was always politely baffled at the suggestion that we should
lose £800 a month, and would ask helpful questions for clarification, like “so are you giving her £800 a month to cover bills and groceries? No? But then why would we give her £800 a month when you’re not?”

Suggestions of “mates rates” were met with “So you want us to give her £100 a month? By losing £100 a month of our normal income, we’d be giving her £100 a month? Are you also going to give her money?” Etc etc.

It’s very strange - they just saw it as “free house that relative can have!” And didn’t see it as an asset that we had a mortgage on, and had invested money and time into doing up, and that we needed the income it produced! So we had to be really clear about what they were actually asking us to do.

I wouldn’t. I wouldn’t mix business with pleasure. I’d make some cock and bull story up about it needing loads more work because of damp / subsidence and say it won’t be ready in time.

I would also in future play your cards closer to your chest. Widet family don’t need to know about rental properties. They don’t realise the hassle involved. Your CF relative is just seeing it as a free, empty house.

Why would you do a favour for someone you don't like, and who takes every opportunity to criticise you about, well, anything and everything? Hard NO.

A definite and very hard no to this cheeky person!

I would also add that no good deed ever goes unpunished
I allowed a friend’s husband to live in our property for literally what it was costing me to pay the mortgage
Moved and lived there for three years happily everything was fine asked him to leave and he started sending me documentation around. Had I protected his deposit?
What fucking deposit you didn’t pay one?
I was very lucky he did in fact leave but he definitely had me over a barrel

There is simply no version of "the other side of the story" or the relative's perspective that would persuade me to rent to her. Even if she was a good tenant, hadn't been a total bitch to the OP previously and was willing to pay full market rent then I still would say don't ever do business with friends or family.

Why do you assume they would take good care if the property? I assume they would be the nightmare tenant bothering the landlord over the slightest thing purely because they have such an openly anti Landlord stance. They wouldn't see it as a favour to them but their right!

Just straight out No.

Hell would freeze over before I allowed her to rent a property of mine.

Given how she has continuously slated you and your DH over the years for being Landlords, and her general opinion of the life you have built together, keep her as far away as you possibly can.

She can find somewhere else to live - and if other family members say anything, tell them she is not your problem and you owe her absolutely nothing.

Her hypocrisy is off the scale. It be a hard no from me - not least because she'll probably default on the rent, then guilt trip you into not pursuing it because she's "family".

It's not up to you to provide a roof over the heads of her children (although I do understand your wobble). This is down to her and her husband to arrange between themselves, as they would have to do if they didn't have a landlord relative with a conveniently empty property.

Even if you like her and get on well it's very unwise to rent to a friend or relative.

Keep everything professional.

Fuck NO!! With the renters reform coming in it will be so difficult to evict and she could (and probably would) make your life very difficult.

I would be on the “I have learnt lessons from renting to family/friends and decided that it muddies the waters when renting to family/friends so we won’t be doing it again”.

@NewNameForThisWWYD I would say no, but if you do end up renting to her do it the same way you would with a stranger. Full rent, with deposit, if you usually use an agency then let them deal with it all. Just because she is family doesn't mean she won't get difficult when she owes rent etc

Fuck no. Why would you accept a financial hit for her benefit? She absolutely wouldn’t do the same for you. Also, she would be very difficult to get rid of if you needed to.

No. No. No. See also lending money to relatives. It never goes well.

If you're still desperate to rent to her despite everyone telling you it's a terrible idea, go through an agency and get the best landlord insurance you can buy.

This is an enormous consideration. just say no and stop engaging

This was why we always had agents manage our rental properties.

Keep saying no, you’d never get rid of the CF.

No way. She’s been an arsehole to you. You may never get her out, especially if you undercharge or don’t charge at all.

No no no. She'll never pay a penny and you'll never, ever get her out. Not without evicting her - in which case you'll be the evil monsters who made the poor single mother homeless etc. You'd be mad to consider it. Do this and I guarantee you'll be expected to provide free housing for her DC when they're adults. Do not go down this road.

No.

But not for the reasons that you don't like her etc or how she has behaved.

She sounds like she would not be a good tenant at all, and what happens if she trashes the place or does not pay rent (Because not only are you family, so should not expect her to, but also you are greedy landlords and owe her a house).

Never, but never, mix business and family IMO. i would say that it's never a good idea to do so and that you are worried about a possible rupture in wider family relations if one of you ends up having a grievance against the other.

(With a side order of no, no, no and no again).

Is she hoping to claim benefits for rent? If so it cannot be a contrived tenancy, you would need a proper agreement and near market rent. Agree with others doing them a favour may well backfire.

NO!

Never, EVER, mix business with relationships.

That's why I'd refuse her request. The potential for a family fued and bad feelings are too much.