Lucy Letby case expert witness was under fitness to practise investigation

[ITMA2000]

Wow! Pot, kettle, black? Need a new investigation?
Lucy Letby case expert witness was under fitness to practise investigation during trial | Lucy Letby | The Guardian

I am sure that those parents would not want an innocent person jailed

There was a couple who came on the news also talking about something Letby done to their child but it was never pursued by the authorities- I can’t remember what happened though

Some of the parents have talked about the appeals. They're not a monolith. I won't pretend to know what I'd do in that situation, but can see why those who haven't spoken out might want to keep a low profile.

I still can't imagine any parent who had doubts, but part of them was still convinced ever saying the doubts out loud and potentially lending weight to a campaign to get her out.

Equally they wouldn’t say that they have no doubts and how upsetting they are finding all the media circus

True, so perhaps best we don't make any assumptions about their current positions at all unless they've been specific.

No assumptions here - they said it

They didn't all, and we don't know whether those positions remain current.

I think citing public statements by identifiable parents with the rough date is fine, and the best way if people want to bring it up. It means they aren't being treated as a bloc and avoids confusion about who's meant.

This is a mumsnet thread general discussion - not Scotland Yard!

stop policing everyone

You think that en masse the members of the RSS decided that LL is innocent, so they decided to discredit the statistics used to sway opinion by demanding facts? This is quite some take…

Could it not be that they saw or heard the stats being mangled and spoke up?

Telling someone to stop doing something is in itself policing.

And the Scotland Yard comment is a very odd response to someone wanting you to take care you dont wrongly attribute a view to a bereaved parent they haven't expressed.

They can't have everyone thinking the parents aren't in any doubt as to her guilt.

Yes I disagree with the PP about the usefulness of AI. We’re not a hive mind.

But if you make a claim you can reasonably be expected to back it up or be disbelieved.

I disagree, but we will have to agree to disagree on that.

She killed so many poor babies it's quite hard to keep track. And AE has been the focus despite the fact she used other methods. But thank you for reminding me of yet another way she tortured and killed babies 😥

Neonates receiving breathing assistance often get air in their stomach and intestines. Google “CPAP belly” for any number of scholarly articles. This is problematic, but not life threatening.

And you think no one ever thought of that explanation? All the armchair experts so sure they've solved the case because everyone involved in it are complete simpletons that have no idea what CPAP belly is 🙄

Obviously you wouldn't have any ulterior motive for wanting it not to be clear which parents haven't said anything about the appeals.

You're going to have quite the dilemma if any of them do ever publicly express doubts.

Yes I remember them if we're thinking about the same family but I believe that had been in 2013.

There was also the couple in the conviction documentary where they spoke to parents who said they thought she had harmed their baby, but the mother said she veers from guilty to not guilty, their son also found out about that they thought LL might have tried to kill him and when she was convicted the boy said 'that's the nurse isn't it?', so this boy is aware of that even though the mother isn't convinced, she just believes that something happened at that hospital, maybe she would have her answers if the COCH and these collapses had been investigated properly and thoroughly.

I have no idea why Evans decided that air down a NG tube was a cause of death. Do you?

Actual experts have pointed out it wasn’t feasible. Evans has changed his mind post-verdict anyway. What does that tell you?

Going by their testimonies and reports they seem to have missed many obvious explanations.

Don't blame us if they come across as simpletons!

It was this one most likely-

They brought it up way before she was even found guilty IIRC as well. I dismissed them then. Much to my regret.

That mother basically caught her in the act.

It’s not a question of no one having thought of that explanation. It’s a fact that babies often get far more air in the stomach and intestines from being on CPAP than would be possible to inject down a nasogastric tube. They don’t die. Injection of air via NG tube is not a way to kill or harm a baby. It’s a ludicrous idea. Evans admitted in court that no cases of this have ever been recorded. He literally made it up. After the trial he recanted his evidence that this had been a method of harm. Anyone with a functioning brain cell and a passing interest in reality could quite easily read this for themselves. HTH. 🙄

Lots of people did indeed think of that. That's why neonatologists were contacting the defence during the trial and the media afterwards.

@Firefly1987 The police seem to have dismissed them too.
I am guessing that this wasn't one of the babies in the second file the police sent to the CPS or these parents might have done another interview.

Perhaps it was the same staff looking after their baby who had been involved in the care of Baby Noah in early 2014 following a catalogue of blunders, staff shortages meaning blood tests and xrays weren't assessed for 7 hours, one doctor splitting his time between the neonatal ward and the childrens ward and who died after a breathing tube was put into his gullet when it should have gone into his trachea. They also ignored warning signs from xrays and other equipment thinking it was faulty.

Recording a verdict of misadventure, coroner Nicholas Rheinberg told the inquest in Chester in February 2015: ‘There were very considerable signs [the tube was incorrectly positioned] and I find it surprising these signs were not realised.’
He said an assumption that equipment was faulty was ‘extraordinary’.
‘Shouldn’t the first assumption be the tube is in the wrong place, or that’s a strong possibility?’ he asked.
‘It’s like flying an aeroplane and seeing the oil gauge come on and you assume the gauge must be wrong, rather than the oil pressure is low.’

Ignoring the obvious explanations, Now what does that remind you of?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4518212/Baby-deaths-Countess-Chester-Hospital-probed.html

Does anyone know which doctor this was??

This was Doctor V or Doctor B - she is called V at Thirlwall and B at the trial. She was the consultant in charge the week the two triplets died.

I wonder if she was the same one who kept going outside for a smoke and sneezing and coughing into her hand then going to babies without washing her hands.

That was a nurse called Nicky according to the New Yorker, well they didn't say anything about smoking but that she was sneezing and coughing and putting her hands in the incubator.
She also "To top it off, whilst Nicky was in the room, the doctor, who was seeing another baby, asked Nicky if she was full of a cold, to which she said, ‘Yeah, I’ve been full of it for days.’ So even the doctors were aware and didn’t do anything."