Struggling with response to friend re circumcision

[cultureclash]

A close friend of mine gave birth a week ago and she messaged me yesterday to tell me that her son has just been circumcised with crying faces and that she is an emotional wreck. I was shocked at this as it’s not something we have ever spoke about before so I enquired as to is her son ok and did he have some medical issues and she said no, cultural reasons. I kept the responses short and factual but Aibu that I struggled to show any compassion or empathy for her that she has just paid over £200 to have bits chopped off her precious newborn baby and she is more upset for herself than the pain that she has just put her newborn infant through. I am suprised at how strongly I have reacted to this, I just cannot imagine doing this to my baby. Aibu to feel like this? I obviously would never voice my opinions to her and cause upset but I am struggling with my own emotions around this.

Yeah that’s exactly what I’m saying whether it’s right or wrong is up for debate but certain religions and in the USA it’s just a normal thing, someone non religious in the uk doing it to their kid makes me think they’re basing their decision on American porn videos and what they think is attractive. Very weird

I don't think you need to do anything, unless you think she is being coerced to hurt her child against her wishes.

Not as horrible as paying someone to hurt your newborn for no good reason.

I know two non-Jewish women married to Jewish men who agreed to having their baby boys circumcised, and both were upset about it afterwards. Both had more than one boy, and both told me if they had another boy they would refuse to go along with it again. Both nice non-abusive men and happy marriages, it was just very important to the dads to have their sons circumcised. I didn’t offer an opinion, and it didn’t cross my mind to end the friendships. I think just work through your own feelings about it on your own for now, and if she brings it up again later, it’s fine to tell her you find it upsetting.

Is there? I only asked as OP
said there was a queue of people waiting to have their children circumcised….I
just wondered how you would know what all these babies, in a run of a mill hospital waiting, were there for 🤷🏼‍♀️ which is why I asked if there was some special clinic you had to go to…

Apparently it was done at a gp surgery

It’s 100% abnormal - it causes DS pain and he has been under a pediatric urologist for years. You can clearly see that the foreskin is too tight. He’s had repeat uti’s and manages to pee in about 27 different directions at once. (He’s a dab hand with a Dettol wipe, luckily!)

It’s not that I regret not having him circumcised - I was clear with DH that I didn’t agree to that being done. But with lovely 20/20 hindsight, it would have been far easier if I had done it at birth. If DS needs a procedure to fix it, which seems highly likely, it’s going to be riskier and more painful. (Plus DS is autistic and had to be incapacitated with Entenox and then given a GA just for a CT scan with contrast - fuck knows how they’d even get his consent). But obviously I didn’t know any of that at the time.

The lovely Jewish man who circumcises all the consultants’ boys in our local area (Jewish and Muslim) - and asks for a donation to a charity organisation in the ME in return - would probably not be the first person I would regard as a “child abuser”. It’s difficult for those of us with no faith (I include myself) to understand the significance of these practices to those that do.

Circumcision for non medical reasons is child abuse and should be outlawed.

I was leaning toward pressured/coerced by dad; and regretting allowing it to be done.

No where near as bad as child abuse. Sickening

You seem quite upset about the circumcision, and obviously she is too. Ask her to say more about why she finds it so distressing. Acknowledge her feelings without judgement. “This has been really hard on you.” “You seem really burdened by this.” That sort of thing. Now that the baby is circumcised there is no going back. What would you expect her to do about it? You don’t have all the details about it. She trusted you enough to be vulnerable. This situation is not about what YOUR decision would have been. She’s hurting. Be kind.

Does it really matter

What a lovely, xenophobic comment. "Civilised" ffs....

Circumcision is downtrending in the US, by the way. It's now estimated that just under 50% of newborn boys are circumcised. I hope you view that as a satisfactory improvement.

Probably not hurting as much as her baby is.

Cruel and barbaric. If it upset her so much she should have forbidden it.

He’s already over it. Maybe you should be too.

Absolutely well said! I don't believe in cultural specificity, child abuse is child abuse, full stop and should always be called out and objected to. It's the thin end of the wedge to allow it to continue out of some misguided deference to cultural/religious rites. I've been an atheist since I declined to take my Holy Communion at age 7 but I'm fine with people having strong religious convictions so long as they don't use it to abuse animals or children.

Makes me think of Peter Tatchell's letter to the Guardian in 1997 where he used the Sambia tribe, of Papua New Guinea, as an example of "consenting inter-generational sex" being "considered normal, beneficial and enjoyable by old and young alike." (a practice which has subsequently been recognised as abhorrent and banished by the Sambian people). Or in other words, it's ok to rape a child if you're from another culture or the child really wants it. Give me a break.

Isn't it a kind of inverted, patronising racism to hold people of different ethnicities and cultures to a lower standard than you would hold yourself?

AIBU to be deeply offended?
I lost my partner last October. His best friend ( let's call him Fred) has taken it very hard. I invited him to speak at the funeral which he did beautifully. I've seen him and his wife 3 times since, the last being when I invited them to mine to stay over (so they could visit a sick parent locally) and have dinner with me.
Whilst they were here there was a card from another female friend on a table which had a long note inside about her husband's recent ( and very intimate) surgery. When we were eating dinner Fred asked about the surgery...which meant he'd read all the writing in the card, despite it being addressed to me and clearly not being a simple greeting only.
Fred has met this couple, but they are only acquainted through me and my late partner so his concern about the husband having surgery seemed insincere.
I was nonplussed, I think it is really rude to effectively read personal correspondence, but I didn't want to say that over a dinner I'd just bothered to cook for them.
Am I the idiot for leaving the card out, or should he have realised it was a personal dialogue not addressed to him and even if he had read it, been embarrassed enough to say no more?
This small event is making me feel much less generous towards him and his wife, I've noticed other minor lapses of 'manners' like not saying thank you...
Or should I invite them again and leave out another card with a long message that ends with 'mind your own business Fred and don't read other people's correspondence '?

did you mean this as a comment on another post or its own post?

Yes, but it's not just little boys that are sold down the river by people who value their perceived social piety above the safeguarding of children.

Just look at the fact that in this country there have only been two successful prosecutions for female genital mutilation and none before 2019!

Also look at the horrific rape gang scandal that has unfolded where working class female children were utterly sacrificed at the altar of cultural deference and the current onslaught against female children where trans rights have trumped girl's safety for approaching a decade.

But male circumcision needs to be called male genital mutilation, let's not dress it up as a religious rite of passage.

Good
So it should

I think that the civilisation of a people can be judged on their elected leaders actually

Trump is a convicted rapist and felon and admits to sexually assaulting women. And they love him

Oops! How do I delete?

My partner and his brothers all had it. No cultural reasons. Just because

A lot of US men are protesting this though.

Is it an African culture?