British Couple Sentenced To 10 Years For Spying In Iran.

[WhatSharonSaidNext]

Year after year we see high profile campaigns to release prisoners in Iran on spurious charges. Family members petition and lobby the Foreign Office to intervene as the years slip by. You would have to be living under a rock somewhere not to know that Iran is not a safe country for westerners to travel through and that if you do decide to go against advice and common sense you may not be coming home any time soon.

In the past the Foreign Office have specifically warned British citizens not to travel there. Yet still we have these stupid people who continue to go there risking their own safety expecting the foreign office to spend tax payers money bailing them out when it all goes wrong. I wonder how much of that gets paid back when they eventually get released and sell their stories? Seriously, what on earth is wrong with these people? Why do they think they are so important? Can’t possibly avoid one of the most corrupt countries on the planet, oh no, let’s just drive straight through it. What could possibly go wrong? …

Am I really being unreasonable to think these people are being more than a little bit irresponsible to put themselves in these situations and then expect that just because they are British they have some sort of immunity from anything happening to them?

Is it honestly reasonable for a retired British couple to travel through one of the most politically dangerous countries on earth as part of a nice biking tour, thinking it would be a good idea?

And rather than just clicking you are being unreasonable for the sake of it, could people explain why they think it is a perfectly reasonable thing to do please? Why it’s reasonable for a retired British couple to risk their own safety travelling to a country where everyone knows it is complete madness for a British citizen to travel and why it’s reasonable to expect the Government to sort your own stupidity out afterwards at the cost of tens of thousands of pounds, in a country that despises Britain and is widely known to routinely detain British nationals to use as political pawns?

https://news.sky.com/story/british-couple-sentenced-to-10-years-in-prison-in-iran-family-say-13503275

What kind of charity work can they realistically expect to do (whilst stopping off on a round the world motorbike tour) in Iran? Do they speak fluent Farsi? Have local or international connections to an NGO/recognised charity and or journalist connections? Even if you are a medic you can’t just turn up to a country in civil conflict and start administering medical care like some sort of saviour.
What a couple of entitled, deluded idiots on a mid-life adventure (probably bored of their comfortable life).

I agree. While on one hand I feel extremely sorry for them,I do struggle to get my head around why someone would think that this is a sensible thing to do.

I’m not talking about Iran’s justice system. I’m talking about them ‘deserving’ the consequences of their stupidity/arrogance/whatever. If they’d spent an uncomfortable few hours being questioned by the police before being deported I’d probably be on board with the majority view that they ought to have known better and I couldn’t care too much.

As it is, the consequences so hugely outweigh all the stuff that has earned them the annoyance of MN that I do have sympathy to spare.

Morons doing moronic things.

Lindsey Foreman was due to make a presentation in Australia at a wellbeing conference six months after they started their journey. She was travelling through various countries asking, 'What makes a good life?'. She filmed people in Iran answering her questions. She also put several photos on Instagram whilst still in Iran. It was purely a personal project.

I think she felt that if she included people who lived under oppressive regimes it would somehow show that there is 'good' everywhere and also make her project more noticeable. I believe she was disappointed that the conference only gave her poster space for her findings, rather than an actual talk / presentation.

In her interview with ITV last week she said she still wants to help others and has created a wall of positive quotes inside the prison for everyone to read! I get the feeling that at the moment she still wants to put a positive spin on things (good for her, maybe it keeps her going in awful conditions) and will want to 'use' the experience when she is released. I'm not sure that would be such a good idea given how much her imprisonment will cause the UK tax payer!

When detained they were on their final day in Iran and intending going on to Pakistan.

Nobody is pretending that Iran is a reasonable country. That is the whole point. It isn't.

That is why they were told not to go there. But still they did 🙄 And she posted about their decision on Instagram, literally saying they were ignoring the advice of everyone who had told them not to go through Iran.

Fuckwits.

This thread is surprising to me bcz... most of what thread is saying were my first thoughts, too, about the motorbike couple.

"Really sorry this is happening to you but you could not have been insured, you were taking a big risk, there are other land routes across Asia, you are so much better off than indigs. population in prison & will get out much sooner and get to finish your days somewhere outside Iran."

I don't see a lot of parallel with Ratcliffe partly because many Iranian citizens who live outside Iran go back & forth to the country often without problem incidents. NZR had close family living in Iran who she wanted to see. NZR was a token prosecution to scare all the others.

That sounds like a vanity project to me.
Did they really consider the risks to the people they would be interviewing - could they offer support and protection for speaking to visiting Westerners?

As I’ve said in another post, one person’s living trauma is another’s “once in a lifetime gap year experience”.
Oblivious of the resources they divert and waste.

This bit from the BBC article astounds me. Did she honestly think writing to the Iranian government criticising them for being meanies and for their unfair justice system was going to win her brownie points?

"Lindsay said hours before this was handed down that she and her husband had sent a letter to the Iranian authorities to complain about their treatment in what she described as a "desperate attempt" to seek justice.
"We have done what we can to be respectful of their system, to be patient with the legal process and believing that our innocence will prevail but it doesn't seem to be the case," she said.
Lindsay added that they wanted to "exercise their right to be heard" and use Iran's legal system to show what it was doing to them was "unfair and unjust".
She said she told them: "Even in your own system, your own judicial system, you're in violation of the laws." "

Same as smuggling drugs in or out of a country with the death penalty then whinging about it afterwards

You are in a country you follow their rules or dont go how hard is it to understand

Very sad for their children. They were taking a huge risk and people had tried to warn them.

It is not reassuring to me. I would leave them there. They should not have gone, they should not have been doing interviews. Actions have consequences and Britain should concede fuck all to rescue idiots like this.

When I worked in travel insurance Iran was a country we wouldn’t provide cover for, North Korea was another on the underwriter’s naughty list. I remember a few instances where customers asked me about some dangerous rogue state or another and the moment I entered it into the system it was an immediate ‘computer says no’.
I would say that I don’t know what sort of people go somewhere like that and do what they did, but unfortunately I do. They think that everything will be fine for them because if they have an issue with the authorities/armed bandits/insurgents then they’ll be all relaxed, smiley and reasonable and everything will be fine ‘These are just good people facing difficult times, we understand, we empathise and recognise our shared humanity. We’re just here to experience their beautiful culture. This is all a simple mistake…’

To be harsh, I always want to slap people like that with a wet fish. 🐟

Well since you put it like that I think I might look at a North Korea tour. While I’m there I’ll interview some local people about what living under a repressive regime is like. What could possibly go wrong?

When you're finished there then jet over to Afghanistan and write the Taliban a nice letter detailing all the things that the silly Billy's are getting wrong. Maybe encourage them to harness the power of positive thoughts and meditation. They'll love that.

because if it truly was espionage then id guess they presumed there missions were for the greater good, @WhatSharonSaidNext

They do seem a bit old for that. It's forgivable in young gap year backpackers, by the time you're in your 50s you should have learned a bit more about how the world works.

But they're British citizens. No point in having a state if it doesn't protect you.

Most tourists are fine, but tourists are absolutely tracked and watched, and if it suited them they wouldn't have any qualms about detaining them.

This used to happen all the time to visitors to the USSR. It still does to tourists in parts of China and some of the '-stan' countries. If you go to North Korea, your guides control your every move in case your foreign foolishness leads to the smallest of actions which might embarrass the leadership.

Considering the Foremans' next destination, Pakistan, is in active warfare and punitively intolerant of uppity women, it might be as well they were detained in Iran. I agree they've been stupid, with the arrogance of privilege, and it is indeed annoying that we have to pay to try and rescue them.

It was different for Nazaneen and Anousheh, who had clarified their reasons for visiting and weren't going off-piste. The fact that they were imprisoned should've been enough to warn this pair of dipshits.

The British state advises UK citizens not to travel to Iran.

And one of the reasons is that - the UK state cannot protect them if when it all goes wrong.

One or two PP have indicated that travel to Iran was quite safe some years back. I travelled there alone back in the 1990s and had no problems - other than the odd room boy trying it on a bit. It was in the early days when full hijab was required and I made sure I was always covered up with no hair showing. I was extremely careful what I discussed with people I met, kept away from politics and photographing public buildings. I also travelled to Syria alone before the civil war. would not dare to go back now. As I understand it this couple were talking to people and posting on their blog as they travelled. Not a good idea. It would have been better to keep the film until they left the country. Iran is a stunning country with friendly people and some wonderful cities. I was there back in the 1970s when the Shah was in power and wanted to see how things had changed under the Islamic Republic.

It's not just that they ignored FCO advice. I've biked across the world, and they absolutely would have been on biking/van online communities, for advice about routes, visas and importing a vehicle. They would have been overwhelmingly told on those not to do this, as people always are. Then again, there are always people popping up who plan to cycle in Afghanistan and Iraq, or travel across the Darien Gap. They all have the same privileged, childish attitude, that their desire to travel wherever they want trumps everything else. Complete idiocy, and to film along the way as well, utter morons.

@Friendlygingercat

One or two PP have indicated that travel to Iran was quite safe some years back.

It's not that long ago either. To give some idea of how recently things have really gone downhill BA operated London/Tehran during the last period when sanctions were lifted, 2016 -2018....

If one thing is for sure, it's that they're not going to be reading Mumsnet in an Iranian prison 🙄.

Hopefully this will deter any other intrepid retirees from doing anything so fucking stupid!

An update on this couple held in Iran

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c204k4km5pxo#:~:text=Lindsay%20and%20Craig%20Foreman%2C%20both,espionage%20charges%2C%20which%20they%20deny.