To take child out of nursery?

[AleaEim]

Hi,

Looking for advice, enlightenment, help!!

My dd, 14 months has been sick back to back for the last 5 weeks since starting nursery. She goes there two days a week and is supposed to be going to a childminder 3 days a week but hasn’t managed to complete her settling in sessions with the CM as she’s been sick every single week. On mat leave, I took her to baby groups/ soft play/ playgrounds every day and she only had a couple of coughs and colds the whole year, I’m not a germaphobe, I frequently forgot to wash her hands and often met up with other parents who’s babies had runny noses etc so I know she is quite resilient when it comes to illnesses (until now). I’m very close to just taking her out of nursery and switching to childminder full time (she’s told me she has a full time place), I realise it’s not guaranteed that she won’t pick up things there but surely it won’t be as bad as the CM only has 2-3 other children (all over the age of 2.5) whereas the nursery has 10-15 babies under 16 months all in one room.

DH thinks we should wait until the end of the month to see if things improve (that means she’d go in this Thurs/fri and next) as we have paid them until then, I think sending her in to a cesspool of germs is just going to lead to another two weeks of illnesses when she could start with the CM straight away and let this hell end.

We are both in two minds about taking her out of nursery and switching to CM, the nursery is outstanding rated in Ofsted whereas the CM is rated good. The nursery give the children two hours outdoor time a day in all weather (they really do), it’s family run, they host nice things that have dazzled us such as Mother’s Day parties/ stay and plays etc, they have forest school, baby ballet, toddler football. It feels wrong to just pull her out because they offer so much and dh thinks they have better facilities/ space/ resources than the CM. I think he’s right but also from a developmental POV, the CM will be better for attachment, consistency and her physical well-being if she gets less ill. But why can’t I just throw the towel in and tell the nursery she’s not going back? It’s almost like we have a FOMO.

Its been extremely stressful these past few weeks and I don’t know how we can go on, on top of that we’re both catching things from dd as well and I started back to work feeling dreadful last week and dh has been battling with flu symptoms for two weeks now, it’s put such a strain on us. I’ve also missed two days of work already including my first day, I have to be off today as well as dd is unwell again, another virus! It’s harder for DH to take days off as I’m on a doctorate course so won’t get penalised as much for taking days off but still I have a lot of work to do and need to start getting into a routine now or things will never be done. DH also has an awful boss and the company he works for is not family friendly at all. I’m with the NHS so they’re more understanding.

Part of me thinks we’re mad to just send her back info nursery this week as we could just have the CM if we wanted and it might be much better for us.

Not sure what I’m asking but just wish we could make a bloody decision.

This wins the award for the most loony
post I’ve read on MN all day - and I’ve read some nut job threads today.

100% agree with this. It can be damaging for babies/toddlers to have illnesses too young (eg if a child gets an ear infection when they are under age 2 and ear is still developing, they will then get significantly more ear infections throughout their lifetime as ear gets weakened by the infection).

It's much better for kids and their long term health to get ill aged 5 than age 1.

Definitely go for the childminder imo

Please can you site the factual evidence for this?

Absolute rubbish. Where are your facts? My dd was constantly ill with coughs, colds and ear infections when she first started nursery. I was so worried we ended up getting a referral to ENT where the consultant (you know, a trained medical professional) told me it was completely normal and would have no lasting effects.

The level of privilege on this thread is astonishing. I can only assume that posters like this have a very high earning dh and don’t understand what it’s like to have to actually work for a living while also raising kids. Your ignorance is embarrassing.

Nope- just shows how brainwashed many now are that nursery is beneficial and the best option. It is not for babies/toddlers, benefits only kick in for children over 3, and even then it’s still unnecessary.

I would go for the childminder, OP. Take the pressure off yourself for now and worry about future bugs if and when they happen!

I had a year off each time I went on maternity leave and so mine were always over 1 (accounting for the annual leave to be added on) before we required any childcare, but they all went to a CM initially then when they turned 3, I incorporated some sessions at the nursery attached to their primary school as preparation for reception and that worked really well.

I went for this combination because I know the CM really well and she has a great set up (big purpose built extension) and she’s near our house and so when they did nursery at 3 and reception they transitioned to partial wraparound some days and holiday cover (as we stretched the hours) and so I already had childcare in place which is another consideration as when kids start school depending on the local provision, a childminder already in situ is a godsend as generally they give priority to people already on their books.

My kids had bugs and coughs and colds and other the CM too it’s not just a nursery thing.

if a combination of settings is works for you then I’d bare with it, but have a think about it what you’ll do when they’re 3 too if there is a school nursery as 3 settings is a lot to deal with.

Also check your contract with the nursery as often you can’t just leave, there is a notice period for this.

You lost all credibility (and you had very little) when you suggested nursery was only of benefit to children who are being abused.

Child minder. Consistent more peaceful care with a smaller germ soup.
Your child is very small ... she does not need all this frantic over activity and stimulation.
Nurseries vie with each other to do endless stuff when small children need gentleness, security and consistency.
You need to work so cannot provide this yourself so need to make sure she gets this elsewhere.

Nope, the current false narrative is that nursery is superior to under 3s being cared for by their mothers. The only rare circumstances that may be preferable is if the parents are abusive. A mother, or failing that a father, always provides by far the most superior care (meeting inherent attachment needs, health needs, loving and bonding them- paid workers do not love your child!) than a big, busy, unhygienic, often unsafe nursery ever could.

The fact that even needs stating or is seen as controversial shows how misguided our society is about what babies and young children actually NEED.

If someone genuinely believes nursery only benefits children who are being abused, they’ve demonstrated such a profound misunderstanding of child development, socialisation, and early education that it’s hard to take anything else they say on the subject seriously.

In my experience it can take 4 months. My eldest was sick on and off for 4 months and now she’s about to finish nursery and she’s rarely properly sick (yes she gets a runny nose etc, but not enough to be off or feel ill)

Feeling like absolute shit for sending my child to nursery after this thread. No option as can’t afford to lose my job. @ThankYouNigel

Don’t. That’s their intention. But it’s just one lunatic. You are doing nothing wrong.

If you read some of my previous posts, I’m on the side of those who have no choice not to send them. You should never be in that position. It is a national disgrace if a family cannot survive financially on one income during these few short years, it used to be the norm. I really feel for you. The government needs to sort out the cost of living crisis, start giving proper financial incentives to parents and quite frankly start showing some proper respect to parents of young children and the unique and irreplaceable role they play in the lives of their own children. They need to stop lying to parents and putting them under so much financial pressure.

You are extremely rude, and I will report you. I am not a lunatic, far from it. I have a double first class degree from Cambridge and have studied early childhood extensively at Masters level there. I have over a decade of experience teaching Early Years, moderating schools across the County, monitoring nurseries across the County and advising other schools. Hence why I know a great deal and fully understood exactly why there was nobody better than me to care for my own children!

Studies consistently conclude that Nursery is harmful in terms of heightened cortisol, which interferes with immature brain development for under 2s, ambiguous/neutral for 2-3s, and some positives for over 3s. The longer the hours spent there the more damaging it is, the higher the staff turnover also the more damaging it is. Babies and toddlers thrive when they form an intimate, gentle, nurturing, loving and responsive attachment to one key adult, Mum best suited to this, if not Dad or a Grandparent who actually loves the child. You can’t buy love!

Don’t even get me started on poor little ones trying to meet their nap needs or dietary needs, horrific incidents of choking due to not enough adults properly supervising. Not risks I’d ever entertain with the most precious people in my life!

And what about dad? Or are you one of those people who think childcare is women’s work?

Anyway, surely it’s best for children to have a roof over their heads and food in their bellies, even if it doesn’t meet with your approval over using childcare.

Dad is not as good as Mum initially no quite frankly, especially if Mum is breast feeding. Babies often make it very clear they prefer Mum, that’s nature!

Dad IS preferable to anyone else if Mum dies or leaves, of course. Also if Mum is ill herself or in hospital, then of course Dad is preferable.

This is such a fraught topic for parents who have to work. Every parent who loves their child wants the best for them and has to balance this with the need to pay the mortgage/rent/bills.

I am absolutely clear that a gentle nurturing environment with a few known adults is the ideal for a child under 3; and I do agree that it is pretty poor that our welfare system does not recognise that and seek to optimise this opportunity for this for all children.

Where parents have to return to work there is a lot to be said for a child minder or a nanny as this is more child-scale and gentler on the developing brain. The frenetic milieu of a nursery is not normal for a child. I say this gently with an awareness that many parents have no choice, especially those raising children on their own. It is a rock and a hard place for many.

I was lucky enough to be able to take 5 years off when my children were small - though the financial hit was hard and enduring - and they each went to nurseries or playgroups after the age of about 3.5 when I returned to work part time. I recognise that I was privileged to be able to do this and wish that the government could make this possible for all.

Single age environments are so far from the natural order of things and this applies also to the elderly who, like children in nursery/school, are often put together in a distorted milieu of one age group. Lots of studies have shown the mutual benefits of child care facilities being linked to elderly care homes. It takes a village and all that - where can you find a village full of children with just a few overseeing adults around?

To the OP I would say - go for the childminder.

But it is helpful to tell us all this when we have no choice? I feel even worse now as it seems you are a highly qualified professional telling me I am failing my child.

You sympathising and saying it’s a systemic problem is all well and good, but I’m still going to have added worry and anxiety about this now, and I can do nothing about it.

Just to say @OneKitten, my daughter had a childminder looking after only her. Her socialising was playgroups and the like.
She caught a virus when she was 3 and went on to develop type 1.

Her immune system wasn't overloaded, she was rarely ill - it's the physiological response to the virus that results in the diabetes (the white blood cells attacking the beta cells in the pancreas), not the virus itself.

As a mum who experienced the same issue as you, with all due respect, your post came across a little as scaremongering.

@ThankYouNigel perhaps you could provide some mitigation strategies we can use when nursery is an essential to ensure the best outcomes for our children in that circumstance?

This is a very important point.

Keep in mind if you are swapping providers at this point in the term you may not be able to get funding/full funding with the CM until April. If that would impact your finances.