To think the most shocking thing about James VDB's death is...

[Hitthebestbooth]

...that a famous actor, recognised worldwide for his role in Dawson's Creek (putting this in the first lines for the benefit of MNetters who love to comment 'who??' on these threads) struggled to pay for his cancer treatment? His death has left his family 'out of funds'.

Now, James Van der Beek had enough fame and affection from fans that a Go Fund Me has raised a lot to support his family already. But there must be countless families across America who are ruined by medical bills - if Dawson couldn't pay for his cancer treatment, how do non-famous people in ordinary jobs cope? What do their families do after they've been crippled by the costs and still lose their loved one along with their homes and security for their children?

As a millennial, I was so sad to read of James' death. I loved Dawson's Creek. But it makes me very afraid for a future where Farage gets his hands on the NHS and we find ourselves in this position too. I have plenty of bad experiences with our healthcare system and am not saying it's perfect. But if I or my husband are diagnosed with cancer tomorrow, we won't have to sell our possessions or ask friends and family for money or risk leaving our kids with no home after treatment costs. There are plenty of wealthy people out there eager to take the NHS apart and sell it off, and for all people say we'd get a European system and it would be improved, it seems far more likely that capitalist greed will win out and we'll actually get an American model.

James Van der Beek's death highlights just how ruinous that model is. He spent his illness selling off memorabilia and trying to raise money. He died knowing his family's finances were left decimated. And he was someone with more resources than most. It's a sobering indictment of how bad things can get, and I am truly afraid that a Reform government would put us all in that dystopian scenario.

There are all kinds of options I could put for a poll but I'm just trying to make it really simple.

YABU - US healthcare is fine
YANBU - US healthcare is a terrifying prospect

There is currently a petition to try and get this debated in parliament. Any support would be appreciated.

Life insurance is unaffordable for many, especially when they have young children to support. Replacing a wage with £350 for just 18 months makes life so much more difficult for the bereaved.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/752501

The pre existing conditions thing is a bit of a red herring. If you have a population of people you will have a range of pre existing conditions and the insurer will provide insurance at a cost which takes account of that.

I’m saying that all employers should provide medical insurance - such as they do in most of Europe - and this ensures the ‘pre existing conditions’ isn’t and issue because it’s averaged out. If insurance had to be bought for one person with pre existing conditions it would be v expensive. If insurance had to be provided for 100 people and some had pre existing conditions and some don’t, the per person insurance would be much cheaper.

I'm guessing that legalising euthanasia in the US would lead to a lot of people opting for that to avoid financial problems for their families. In the UK, certainly where I live, I think that people with cancer and other serious conditions, particularly painful ones, will be opting for euthanasia because it's impossible to get the treatment they need on the NHS, or to get it urgently enough.

The average person in UK pays C£4,500pa towards NHS, now go look up how much a private policy would cost the average person! The NHS is not "free" amazing people think it is. It's actually not fit for pupose any longer.

100% agree. I wonder if the people claiming the NHS is great and cannot be reviewed EVER are actually the people who are paying little in.

Lets have a cross party review and not something that takes years to look at a co payment system. Someone was talking on another thread about what would happen if someone couldnt afford paracetamol (at 35p per box). Those people are very unusual. Not having 35p? Add to that people who cannot budget, never been taught to or have a massive entitlement to get whatever free stuff they can and that might be a better explanation. When I was working in retail during Covid people were stealing the bars of soat and liquid soap. One women came in and cleared the shelf of hand staniser. Dont get me started on the toilet rolls. people were literally pinching that too. I saw the very worst behaviour.

My late Father was always looking for anything that was free and that he was entitled to despite having enough to support himself. Same with a friend's Mum. She is constantly saying why cant she have what her other elderly friend gets. You dont get it just because you are 80 plus.

Apparently 25% of people go on holiday without travel insurance. Que the Crowd Funding and sad faces when something happens. There was a chap a few months ago who got a travel insurance quote with some existing illnesses.

Decided he would take the risk as he didnt want to pay the policy cost and ended up in a coma in Turkey where they refused to let him go until his bill was paid.

Some people constantly have their hands out for handouts whilst doing very little to sort out their own lives. And yes - its not luck that people get ill and no life insurance, income protection etc. Its basic life admin

The US healthcare situation is inexplicable to me. How can such a rich country have such a crap system that leaves so many without cover? This is the real American exceptionalism if you ask me.

Anyone who is paying £80 per MONTH for prescriptions needs to look at a yearly pre payment prescription which is just over £100 per YEAR.

I agree that the US system is awful. But, I think our UK NHS system is no longer fit for purpose or sustainable. It’s costing huge sums of money, which means education and social care can’t be funded adequately either. We’d be better off in many ways with a different funding model, more in line with other European countries. I don’t think Farage is the man to deliver this, though, and no other party will have the guts to do it as people are sentimental about the NHS.

The current Labour government is the first one ever to bring private healthcare providers to the table in procurement discussions - that's far more terrifying than what any future government may or may not do because this is happening now.

If this was the first time I’d heard “Politician X will sell off the NHS to US insurance companies,” I might think that at least you believe it.

Sorry, but you are the one with the grift. The scare tactic. The conspiracy theory that somehow never happens, but that’s because it’s really Politician X + 1 who’s going to sell it off. Honest.

And you’ll do anything to sell your grift, including the OP piggybacking on some poor soul in the US who fell foul of their not-fit-for-purpose system. And you and your predecessors have been on this same grift since Nigel Farage was a bloody teenager. The only thing that’s changed is the name of the politician.

“Politician X will sell off the NHS to US insurance companies,” is a scam. That’s what I learnt. The hard way.

I'm glad you posted this OP as was thinking the exact same thing - how fucked is healthcare in the US that a wealthy man has to crowdfund to pay for his cancer treatment? I hope to god that we don't get a Reform government that kills the NHS.

It should be a priority IMO - over holidays, meals out, etc.
My parents died within 18mths of one another when I was technically an adult but still far too young. The only thing that made it bare-able is that they didn't leave me penniless and homeless!

Life insurance in your 20’s should be very affordable. We have £750k of second death insurance for £65 a month and we are in our 50’s.

I can’t recall a single party in the last couple of decades who haven’t said there are issues with the NHS. The fact that every government coming to power decides to do some kind of reform in the NHS would confirm everyone has been clear there are problems within it. However, a health service that is free at the point of use, for anyone who needs it, should be protected at all costs. When you look at the plummeting standards of oral health since the drop off of low cost NHS dentistry, where people can’t afford to go private, it’s not a stretch to assume the UK’s general health would suffer if a model for insurance came in.

We can say we’d prefer a half and half scenario but other nations who have this actually spend more per capita on healthcare than we do, and yet still our performance is ranked 4th overall.

The biggest problem is one nobody can solve without a major change, and that’s the ageing population. Ironically, that has happened because of the success of the NHS.

OP whilst I agree with your point in general, I don’t think James van der Beek is a great example to use to make it. “Recognised worldwide for his role in Dawson’s Creek” - yes exactly, he probably didn’t get paid all that much back then as an unknown teenager starring in a show on a network that no-one watched, and it was 25 years ago and he’s barely done anything since. People who are gainfully employed would usually get insurance included as part of their remuneration package, but James was not. I suspect there are huge numbers of non-celebrity people who are better off than he was, and I’m talking about before he became ill.

But some people don’t have holidays or meals out because they can’t afford those either!

Your insurance is also cheaper than it would be for many, if you have any health issues the premiums increase greatly. I pay more than you for a third of the cover, policy was taken out in my thirties.

Exactly this; we won't have a choice of systems.

hmmm... a user with a single post bashing reform?

100 % agree

Who?

It’s shocking OP - did you know each ear around half a million people file for bankruptcy due to medical bills in the US? So in answer to your question, this is what happens to ordinary people - they get seriously sick, often they go bankrupt, and when they die the bereaved families are left with the debt. It’s completely inhumane.

I do fear an American type system, and share the concerns that Reform would lean more towards that than a European model. The latter is something a more moderate party (or even better, cross-party collaboration) could have been working towards, but the political difficulties of addressing this have made it impossible, so they've all carried on with the 'envy of the world' nonsense.

Op I agree with you. I've been scooped up by the NHS nicely this week. GP appointment yesterday led to blood tests and was then swiftly followed by issuing new medication and a referral to the hospital. I've been there all morning, had ECG, yet more bloods and whizzed by amazing porters to and from x ray and CT and back. No idea how much that little lot would cost if I had to pay, or if I'd only pick the very cheapest tests or what.

It's obvious from things Farage has said that the US model is the one he intends for the NHS. This was what Thatcher intended as well, and amazingly was stopped by Tories (who knew it was the vote loser of all time). But privatization is what many want. They see no value in a healthy population that has the health care it needs and a public health system (this is different from the NHS btw) that works to keep water clean etc. We vote Reform at our peril.

Lots of people with chronic conditions are uninsurable.

I have had a serious autoimmune disease since my teens. When I tried to get life insurance when I was in my early 20s when I bought a house no company would insure me.

I now have a very expensive policy that will pay when I spend time in hospital but only pays 40k if I die. That isn't enough to help DH afford our life without me.

The only reason I have this is because a friend is a financial advisor and looked for the policy for free. Any other time I had enquired FAs heard my list of conditions and would not look into it any further as there were no suitable policies.

A family member with the same condition died at 40, their widow was left with no payout as again he was not able to be insured.

Not everyone is reckless about insurance, it is not available to all.

I’m currently navigating cancer treatment on the NHS, so sick of people saying how bad it is, the care I have received has been incredible