To be confused by 'high earners' complaining about taxes?

[tutuland]

So high earners pay lots of tax. The top 20% pay for 70% or whatever the numbers are.

But (beyond printing more money) isn't the money there high income people make just coming from the paying public? No matter who you work for, your company's profit is just an accumulation of normal people paying for things.

So ultimately, isn't it all our money anyway? Just beacuse the game is rigged and you get paid 400K for management whatever, it doesn't mean you're more deserving of that money than anyone.

Yes and they do it and get paid for it.

without the govt, capitalism would be victorian england with the vast many very poor and only a few mega rich so would you prefer that model instead ?

It is nothing to do with skill.
It is the fact that the people at the top of companies only earn their £££££ because of the people at the very bottom.

Do you think Jeff Bezos (Amazon) would be so successful now if he was still working from his garage (or whatever his humble beginnings were)?
He is super rich because there are people working all hours in shit conditions and on shit pay doing the shit work for him.

@ForestFlowerFairy This is a side topic but you are probably entitled to both New Style ESA and PIP. They are not means tested. Have you checked? Many hospitals offer Macmillan caseworkers to help you check eligibility.

It's all to do with skill. Jeff Bezos is the reason many people have a living and can pay their bills and look after family. He creates employment and jobs. He ran the business well, did good decisions to make it the tech titan it is today.

A relative of mine is a SWE at Amazon. They get paid very well.

but then how many businesses have amazon put out of business etc

No it's not a unique skill, but its an essential part of the process nonetheless. Its not about the individual person being indispensable. It's the role that's important. Just because many people could operate a machine to make a product, doesn't mean the machine operator role isn't a vital part of the process that generates profit because without the machine operator there'd be no product and no profit.

High earners pay more in taxes, but in return they get to live in a safe, stable, and well-run society that protects their wealth and quality of life. They have more assets to protect and often rely on workforces to run their businesses.

Money is an imaginary. You can hack a bank and transfer the imaginary to a different account and zero goods and services move, although it makes the banks v sad.😢

However, goods and services are real. And the value of them is decided by what people will give for them. Willing to hand over better compensation for a surgeon with 20 years’ experience and a stellar reputation instead of a freshly minted junior? Well probably yes. You pay people for the years and years of learning how to deal with whatever comes up.

So no, all skills are not worth the same amount of sheep or money or seashells or whatever.

So the question is, how are the highly skilled and therefore relatively scarce resources like excellent surgery divided between the much larger pool of people who need them?

The metric we currently use is money, but it could be anything. We don’t all have rights to somebody else’s expert labour or knowledge because it isn’t an infinite resource that comes from the sky it’s tied to people - so highest bidder wins.

Because Amazon outcompeted them by having better service at a lower cost?

I assume you mean Software Engineer by SWE? Cushy office job.

Talk to the people who work in the warehouse. The staff who have a high turnover rate because of the shit conditions. There is an Amazon warehouse in my town, and you don't even need an interview to get a job there. That is a such a huge red flag.

You said your DH earns £200k+, and fair play to him. I bet he earned it. What job do YOU do? What is YOUR tax contribution?

on slave labour wages

Okay

im sure they never used cheap labour or underhand tatics etc

Ah yes

I hear if you head out East you can get away with not paying your domestic help a fair wage. In fact, it's almost rude not to get a couple of live-ins!

In the USA people who cant afford healthcare are left to die.

In the USA health charges are not regulated and insurance companies treat healthcare like a market commodity rather than a public good.

I am not sure what point you are trying to make.

Corporates rule in the US leaving the poor to fall through the cracks. Not sure we are far off that here tbh. But If we brought in private health care it would be end up being a similar system to the US rather than the system our neighbours in France benefit from. Planning, negotiation and intervention are not skills I would associate with our government, whoever is in power.

SWE - needs a stem degree, maths knowledge, coding knowledge. Requires skill and brain power.

As you said the warehouse job doesn't need any interview, no special skills required. Just go and you get the job. People are doing this voluntarily right?

DH works very hard. I have an admin job in a GP's surgery. What do you do? (Since you asked me)

Yes, but their pay has to be set at a level that allows for non producers to profit.
For example, Joe owns three care homes. He lives off the profit he makes because the cost to him of providing his service is less than he is paid to deliver it. He makes it so by charging high rates for care, and paying the carers NMW.
Because if he paid them more he wouldn't make enough money to spend his days on the golf course.
His carers can't raise their families and pay their rent on NNW, so the tax payer tops their money up for them via benefits.
So not only does the labour of the carers keep Joe in his lifestyle, the tax payer contributes indirectly too. And that's without the tax payers money that goes to Joe to pay for the care of the residents.
But Joe pays 'a lot of tax'. So that's OK.

I meant that each US state does healthcare differently. And yes I'd rather a European system than the us system.

How much tax does Jeff evade in the UK? They make excessive profit and leave the UK employees and UK tax payers to pick up the tab, in addition to killing competition.

Thanks for clarifying.

When the bar is set that low, I don't really think the differences by state mean that much.

No, not needing an interview is a massive red flag. People going for a job like that are desperate. And the workplace has a high turnover of staff because they leave or end up sick (or dead.... people have died in Amazon warehouses).

If everyone could treat their own medical issues, then you would be out of a job. So you actually rely on people needed medical care for you to be employed.

Saying he knows python and java is not as special as you think. In a few years, he'll be completely replaced by a software.

You're defending something that's not even yours.

If your marriage ever breaks up, he takes his successful salary with him. He could decided to relocate to 0% tax land without you. They cant even force him to pay maintenance from out there sweetie. Then no money for you.

I think your role working admin at a GP's office is just as valuable to society as your husband who knows how to code.

Businesses are designed to kill competition, its how they grow.

Agreee with you on the tax thing.