To think the age of consent should be raised to 18 if there is a significant age gap?

[Waitingforthesunnydays]

Watched a documentary recently where a 16-year-old girl was preyed on by a 24-year-old man online. He was controlling and abusive and convinced her to move hundreds of miles away from her family with him. Obviously, being 16, she thought she was in love and didn’t see the abuse for what it was. Her mum and the police could do nothing about it cos she was 16. Made me think, AIBU to think the age of consent should be 18 if one of the people involved is more than 4 or 5 years older than the other? Makes sense to me. Lots of 16 year olds are so naive and inexperienced and have no idea how to spot abusive behaviour. Many have a romanised idea of love and think the behaviour is a sign of being in love rather than control & abuse

That could be another option, it being 18 across the board. Obviously most teenagers are going to have sex before 18 but, as with teenagers who have sex before 16 now, the law turns a blind eye if it’s with someone a similar age. At least that’d mean full grown men who know women their own age won’t put up with their controlling, abusive behaviour, so look to date naive 16 year olds instead, could be much more easily prosecuted than they would be if it was legal and they were trying to prosecute for the behaviour alone

To be honest if a 16 year old is that naive at 16 will much have changed by 18?
I was fairly immature at 16 AND at 18.

Don’t know what point you’re trying to make. I said it’s been raised to 18 in England and Wales, not the whole of the UK. And in Scotland they’re currently in discussions about raising it to 18. Do you think a 30-year-old man marrying a 16 year old girl is a good thing then?

I can understand the idea behind it, and I agree that there is often a power imbalance even if not out & out abuse with even a 5 year age gap at 16 & 21 compared to say 25 & 30, but I’m not sure that it would make legal sense.

You either believe you can consent, or not. You can’t really say you can consent at 16 to sex with another 16 year old, but not a 19 year old. And what would the line be? What is “okay”? 16 & 18 okay, 16 & 19 not okay?

You’ve got to draw the line somewhere though. 18 at least means you have two more years of being an “adult”. You’re not in school anymore, might have had a bit of experience of working, met a much bigger cross section of people, are more likely to have had at least one relationship. You couldn’t really make the age any older than 18

But a 30 year old marrying an 18 year old isn't that much different?
To be honest I don't think it happens that much.

In England there is the vague "education or training" until 18 so English society is still wanting to treat many 18 years as "school children".
If the age of consent was moved to 18 you will still the potential of having "school girls" being targeted by older men.
So what next....move it to 20? 21?

One of my DD’s 18yo female friends is being preyed on by a bloke 5 yrs older at the moment. Very difficult to sort out.

He’s “only” 22/23 but known as a predator (my ds is almost 20 and has seen this guy always with a different girl 4-5 years younger. They all consider him an exploitative paedo).

I think perhaps the law could state that teenagers aged 16-19 should only be having sex with someone less than 18 months different in age. And call it “teenage protection rule” or something.

For me personally I’d say the better step would be education, in schools, in homes, with parents- start young, it is definitely a “bigger picture” thing and not an overnight thing but that would be much more useful.

Make sure that young people have the skills, knowledge and support to identify these things BEFORE they fall into a pattern.

Teach children about healthy relationships, consent, boundaries, spotting red flags like control, jealousy, silent treatment, teach children that leaving a relationship is absolutely okay. This could be done in schools in an age appropriate way and not just as a one off class but ongoing, and it also needs to be done at home. How many posts do we see on here from people in abusive relationships whether it is financially, emotionally, physically or otherwise, who “stay for the children”? Kids learn about what healthy relationships look like primarily from their parents. We need a system that better supports women (and men) in leaving abusers, child maintenance using powers more as just one example, support for women to report- it is estimated that 75% of domestic abuse goes unreported- we NEED to change that. Children who grow up seeing what healthy looks like, and what SHOULD be done when a relationship is not healthy, are far less likely to fall victim
to abuse. If a girl grows up seeing dad shout at mum, or refuse to speak to mum, or God forbid hit mum, and mum stays, that child is more likely to end up in a similar situation because in their mind that is what “love” looks like.

There’s work to be done at individual levels in young people too. If young people had the support and resources to work on regulating their own emotions, communication etc then they are less likely to become wither abusers or victims of DA. Young people who have already experienced or witnessed DA need support to stop that pattern in its tracks, that support should be widely and easily available and known about- it just isn’t currently, like lots of other things it is lacking and what services do exist are underfunded or overwhelmed.

These things would be far more useful that telling a 16 year old girl she can have sex with a 17 year old but can’t have sex with a 20 year old.

Exactly.

And Macron married his teacher.
I don't think we can draw that many conclusions from things that happened in the past.

How is it anymore unenforceable & unworkable that the current law is? (Which does frequently catch men having sexual conversations with 14 & 15 year olds or arranging to meet for sex). At least, as a parent, if you know your 15 yo daughter is in a relationship with a 27 year old man you can report it and he will be arrested and the relationship will stop. How would it be unenforceable if you had a 16 yo daughter in a relationship with 27 yo man and you reported it? The exact same thing would happen. Whether you agree with it or not, I don’t see how it would be any more unenforceable than the current law because the age has changed

Dont the netherlands have a similar thing. Like not prosectuing a pair of consenting 15 year olds but its a bigger deal if one partner much older

The thing is, as a policy choice, how practical is it really? And does it make sense? If it was done as you suggest then it would potentially turn lots of people in perfectly normal and healthy relationships into serious sex offenders. Do you really think a 20 year old in a relationship with a 16 year old, that is healthy, should be automatically placed into the same category legally as a rapist?

There are already laws and protections in place for abusive relationships, and for those in positions of trust/power.

Im not sure i knew ANYONE who was still a virgin at 18. Quite a few people i knew we married by then

This is the problem with the argument. Where does it stop? 21? 25?
Is a 20 year old worldly enough? Probably not really, but the line has to be drawn somewhere.

Why?

"You’re not in school anymore"

Eh? I know some people go to college, but you can also stay at school for sixth form and it's more and more common to stay on at school, surely?

A lot of countries have so-called Romeo and Juliet clauses.

Because anyone younger than 18 is a minor. The age of consent being lower than the age of majority is outright wrong.

Except that at 17 you can live independently, work a full time job, drive a car and consent to your own medical treatments… but if you had it your way you could do all of that but not decide who you have sex with?

Raising the age of consent isn't going to stop teenagers having sex. It's just going to criminalise them.

So its a case of now criminalizing the majority of teenagers if you do that.

I’m not here to deny your experience or tell you your relationship was in any way abusive because I don’t know and it’s your relationship and your story.

But, I cannot and will not ever believe that a relationship between a 17 year old and someone ten years older is ok.

I would always be worried about a teenager dating someone 3 years off 30.

27 and 37= fine probably. Both adults, both had some life experience and whilst they are at different stages I’d be less concerned.

I had a couple of age gap relationships and at the time would have fought and argued to defend them but as an adult, I know they were unhealthy and wrong. The men had absolutely no business having sex with a teenager and pretending this was all normal and grown up. It wasn’t and I’m furious that I and many other teen girls were not protected and safeguarded because ‘it was a different time’ and it was apparently ok for adult men to fuck teenagers.

I’m not sure if changing the age of consent is the answer but I do think some kind of nuance in legislation would probably be helpful. I really don’t know what the answer is so reading with interest.