To think parents en masse should have tried to hold the line and not give under-16s social media?

[Carla786]

I'm Gen Z and was not allowed a smartphone until I was 16 (primarily because my mother was worried her estranged & abusive ex would use it to stalk me) I was furious with her about this for ages & it did cause some difficulties but ultimately I'm grateful I didn't have one. A lot of drama & upset at my school seemed to be fuelled by WhatsApp, among other issues I've seen SM cause among my friends and wider peer group.

I know it's extremely hard especially when all other children have them...what was needed was a collective effort. If smartphones had never been allowed for under 16s, I think the current explosion in mental health issues, and related issues like online misogyny and ROGD would be far weaker.

I think banning it is a daft idea

and them hand it over at age 16 during their gcse year when hormones are high

it would be much harder parenting a 16 year old through the pitfalls of social media than a 13 yr old that’s for sure

and if they are determined they will find a way

plus you can block anything you like on their phone, set time limits, deactivate it for bedtime hours - the tools are all there for parents to effectively ban this already

teenagers need guiding through the sludge that is online not waiting for the government to do it for them

our teens can spit an AI video better than me!

and it’s so hypocritical how many adults are addicted to their phones and influenced by what they see online without giving it any deep thought, posting pictures of their kids whilst then telling the kids they can’t post pictures of themselves?

it feels like a get out of jail free card for the platforms who host this nonsense

our teens have great fun with WhatsApp and YouTube they also know not to expect anal sex and choking when they get to that stage - those were fun conversations!

they need guidance through this not for it to be swept under the carpet

if your child is being affected by their smart phone use then do something about it

Is it the smartphone or the content?
I believe there needs to be tighter controls on content; misinformation, and sexually explicit material for example.
because it’s not cooking videos or Lego building that’s problematic.

Its both. It’s partly the content obviously and the more damaging content should be regulated. For me though the worst aspect is the addictive nature of the way we interact with smartphones and digital devices. The way we default to them at the first sign of boredom or anxiety. Thats the part that in my view does the most lasting harm.

This tech is very, very new in the grand scheme of things. I might have done things differently when DD2 in particular was 11 or 12, with a good deal of hindsight, but I was brought up to learn about and embrace tech in the 1980s and that's how I decided to be with my kids and DH felt the same.

Gaming and phones were also a lifeline for DDs in 2020/21 when they couldn't see their friends in real life. And parents had to keep working in difficult circumstances. And it's not just all about parents, tech companies have had to be kicked and kicked to take any responsibility.

And schools have actually made it so that young people need their own device and to use the very thing that distracts them to do homework and school work.

All their crying about banning phones now seems like bullshit to me after having several years of requiring multiple apps to do the most basic things and entrenching inequality by requiring parents to buy all this stuff and rely on them being tech savvy.

And then they just use the Internet enabled laptop - which they need to complete homework to go on these Web sites.
I work and am not home to police my secondary age children unfortunately. I can put restrictions on devices but they are far more savvy than me and can get around them without me knowing.....all you have to do is Google how!!!

I wish our kids didn't have them. I wish they weren't there but they are.

I agree the massive mental health crisis has been fuelled by this. I also think the explosion of behaviour issues are linked to screens. I feel they should be banned for young children full stop. -- but then lock down has a ton to answer for because all of a sudden we were shoving our young children in front of screens to learn and being told that was a good thing. They learnt that. It's hard to argue against it once it has happened.

Agree. Ours had a phone at 11 which was bad enough. But we restricted screentime heavily til 16 and the battles over it ruined our relationship.

I read an article interviewing some Australian kids and they said they had found a way around the ban. Which just makes it even harder for parents to monitor their child’s phone use, when its driven underground. So I don’t think an outright ban is the answer.

How was she paying for it? Data / sim I mean? You don't just get a handset and there you go.

I left teaching three years ago,

my school had just introduced compulsory laptops for everyone and was moving to timetables and homework on apps on their phones.

so

a) it’s not just parents
b) a lot of wider society bought into it as well. Eg you need a smartphone for your bus pass to get you to secondary school these days
c) nobody really knew.

It’s nuanced. We got my son a phone at 11, his Dad’s old phone, but he didn’t have any social media on it. In fact we didn’t load WhatsApp and Instagram until he was 16. It helped that his school had a strict policy about this and would regularly remind parents about it; they also required phones to be in bags/ lockers all day so they acted like a “no phones” school. He also never had his phone in his bedroom overnight until he was doing A levels and even then he used to largely ignore it - he likes his sleep and couldn’t fathom others being up messaging until the early hours.

However. DS was home during COVID and he had a decent PC for gaming. The school did a fab job of lessons during the day but he also used Discord a lot to video chat to his mates, whom he couldn’t see any other way. We had a lot of talks about chat rooms and strangers and he assured us they all knew the dangers (probably better than us).

Now he’s an adult with an iPhone he uses it like we do, largely - looks at Insta as brain candy floss when he’s tired and has a WhatsApp with his various mates and groups. It seems pretty healthy. (Maybe there’s porn use in there, how do I know, I don’t want to think about it but he is a young man so 😬).

I think a lot of it comes down to talking about it and explaining why you want to restrict it. We also talked a lot about sleep and how important it is, which I think is a huge factor. We can’t put the genie back in the bottle but we can manage it. It’s the same as not letting them watch 18 rated films when they’re 12 etc.

We're in Australia- the ban is a red herring i think - DS 15 (not particularly techy) found a way round it immediately (tbh i don't know how!) - they'd tried banning phones in schools before- it wasn't enforced- locking them in pouches- took seconds for the kids to work out how to break in to them- minutes for everyone in the school to know how. Parents won't stop their kids taking phones to school as the children may need them to get home etc...

I think the biggest hindrance is the role models-how to tell a child to get off a phone when the parents are on it constantly

I think all you can do is monitor usage/limit time when possible and educate

Well I think YABU. My DC needs their phones to interact with the world as much as I do. My child's school updates for kids and their weekly changing timetable is on an app. Without their phone how do they check it last minute? It often has clubs cancelled that day on it. Their homework is set on a different update. The school only posts photos of school events on Twitter, not even on their website. All social interaction outside of school is arranged by the kids via apps. Even all the arrangements for brownies and guides is via a WhatsApp group. Their train and bus tickets need to be bought on an app, and if there's a problem customer service is on WhatsApp. One generation of parents hasn't failed, the world has changed due to technology in a generation and we are frantically trying to keep up. I'm the last person to adopt new tech but without a smart phone I'd be totally lost and so would my DC. It's necessary now. It's the internet that needs making safer, the companies need to make their apps safer, not stopping kids interacting with the world.

With all of those piling on with the judgement, please remember the pandemic in all of this. My kids were year 6 and 7 when this hit (so age 11 and 12). The were barely allowed to socialise with their peers for 2 years. Social media was even more of a lifeline at this point. Both my kids have grown up to be resilient, intelligent, sociable beings! I admit they don’t read books much but that wasn’t for lack of trying - I read to or with them every night for years and we have a huge book collection. But like everything, I don’t think access to smartphones is bad for all children. I think parents just need to supervise/police it .

Parents are addicted to their kids having phones, believing it makes them "safer". Tracking, messaging etc. Things like bus pass apps, payment apps etc don't help either.

DDs school is no phones during the day. Then they come out... face glued to the screen... nearly walking under cars. I have actually had one walk into my (stationary) car (because I had stopped realising the teen walking down the middle of the road hadn't seen the big red car, despite other teens shouting!)

But enough parents insist they are essential.

I have taken the view that the most important thing is to keep things open with your teen so they are happy to show and share with you what they are doing.

Forbidding and banning things makes them more attractive.

WiFi is everywhere?

This

Are we banning social media’s for under 16s then ? Because I am all for it ! It’s so damaging and they’re exposed to so much.

I don’t think a total ban on phones and social media for under 16s is a good idea. Going from nothing to full social media access at 16 is a recipe for disaster. The reality is that phones and social are a part of everyday life now and it may be wiser to introduce these things more slowly, and with controls, and for adults to show them how to use phones and social media safely. The children who have the most issues seem to be those whose parents who have just let them loose on their phones with little restrictions.

As an example, mine had What’s App in around year 5. It was used for family chats and a handful of close friends who we knew. They did then have a couple of group chats from year 7, but I was checking their phones daily for anything inappropriate. Predictably, there were some (minor) issues with a group of two, so we talked to them about it and explained why we needed to block certain people etc. They did join instagram when they were mid teens, but again with restrictions as teen accounts. They use it for sensible things, like following pages on sport etc. They know they are not allowed to have people they don’t know as followers etc. My children have said they don’t want Tik Tok or Snapchat as they’ve seen the issues it causes. They manage perfectly well without these things.

I do think a few things have helped massively. They didn’t have phones or tablets as young children. Screens weren’t the default entertainment. They didn’t use screens as entertainment in the car, or on holiday or in restaurants etc. I’m still strict on no screens when we are eating, at home or out. Few children at our primary had phones. It wasn’t the norm. Our chosen secondary school introduced a strict phone ban years ago (before my children joined and before it was discussed in the media). My children are very busy with homework, extra curricular activities music etc. They don’t have time to waste hours on social media. They do have their phones available in their spare time, and do use iPads for games etc.

I’m not saying I have the answer, and I don’t think there’s a perfect solution. However, I think introducing social media slowly and safely, with restrictions is a good way of teaching them how to use it safely. Keeping children occupied with other things also helps as they simply don’t have time to become too obsessed with social media.

My daughter is 9, Y5 and the only one in her class without a smartphone. I was really, really shocked by this. We had several weeks of serious meltdowns over it - I was so angry because she’s usually so well behaved and I felt it was ruining my relationship with her. Eventually I gave her an ancient iPod touch. The screen has several big splotches, it’s not connected to the internet- but it looks the part and she’s happy for now (she takes photos, writes notes and uses the stopwatch).

I’m pretty pissed off with all the other parents to be honest. They’re allowed to bring phones to school but must be turned off and kept in bags. I’m in the smartphone free WhatsApp group but there are very few parents in it from my area. Seems to work better in very naice areas!

I have a five year old and a baby and I read the threads on here with horror at times. People posting about their 13 year olds sending photos and god know what else. Young teenagers just aren’t mature enough to handle social media and smartphones. I’m glad the tide is turning.

Nope, I never trust anything where a blanket rule is applied because it doesn’t allow for individuality.

It’s like those lazy managers that send out work emails to all staff instead of dealing with the culprit directly. Nothing gets resolved!

My teen DS has thrived using technology and he’d be struggling without it. We live very rurally surrounded by fields. Nearest town is 6 miles away by bus. He has no real friends but has interests that benefit from access to technology. He doesn’t use Snapchat and has never played Fortnite. He has taught himself several languages via Duolingo.

I’m a millennial and I got a smartphone as soon as they were introduced, I was about 14 ish and I also had social media from the minute that was introduced, again when I was about 13 for MySpace and Bebo. I don’t think it did anything negative for my development. I actually have fond memories of MySpace in particular and also MSN. Never really got into YouTube but lots of friends sunk time into that and this is obviously going back nearly 20 years.

My DC have smartphones, have since they were 11 when they started walking home alone and I wanted them to be contactable (2.5 mile walk). I won’t allow TikTok which has caused issues but they have private instagrams and Snapchat. They don’t post anything, they use Snapchat to keep up streaks with friends but that’s it and follow some k pop idols and such on insta.

I think as parents the onus is on you to monitor and limit screen time too but I don’t agree that outright bans are necessary.

Unfortunately there are a large number of parents out there who don't see the dangers. I teach infants and the number of 5 year olds who are already completely addicted to screens is scary. One boy walked in the classroom demanding 'I want my tablet'
They can all recognise 'Like and subscribe ' even when they can't yet read a simple book.
When they grow up with parents constantly on their phones, they see it as normal.

So with social media loads of parents will allow/enable children to get accounts when they are under 16. And tech savvy teens will find a way round a ban too. My 15 found a way round the parental control settings on his phone and he's not that savvy. He has WhatsApp but no Insta/Snap and recently banned from tiktok when I found out he was speending 3 hours a day on it.

I don't think a ban will help much because those that want their kids to have access will still do so, and it's practically impossible to enforce. Plus there are plenty of reasons why kids might have a genuine reason for using social media eg communicate with others with a niche interest/medical condition/etc. At the end of the day parents have to try to be in control but life is busy and we can all drop the ball. Plus all the parents who don't care are out there.