Benefits explosion- where will it end?

[TheBlueKoala]

"PIP benefits explosion: Anxiety and depression handouts have nearly TRIPLED to £4.3bn since Covid - with autism and ADHD bill hitting £2.2bn and 'back pain' £1.6bn"

Something is not right here. When I have written before on here telling about people I know who claim for anxiety although they have rich social lives (funded by 440£ extra per month from PIP) I've had many people telling me that it's not possible etc. It sure is. How many 16 year olds are claiming PIP for anxiety?

Instead of benefits why not pay for therapy- invest massively in the NHS mental health support so that people with anxiety, adhd and autism can see a therapist regularly to help them. This would make a difference for tje individual and the society. Throwing out money won't.

AINBU- I agree with about
AIBU- No, extra money is always useful

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15510221/PIP-benefits-anxiety-depression-austism-ADHD-pain-Covid-Labour.html

Unkind

Why use a daily mail article to back up an argument when the daily mail is KNOWN to engage in bullshit to shape public opinion and prejudice of some of the the most vulnerable in society? They’ve been doing this for years with their shitty tactics. Every once in a while the same shite pops up in it. Just attacking low hanging fruit. I’m fed up of it.

People who have never experienced the actual illnesses of depression and anxiety often assume it's the same as their own situational feelings of sadness or anxiety. Constant, debilitating panic attacks are not the same as feeling anxious about anxiety-inducing things, but people who have felt anxious about something in the past feel qualified to pronounce that these illnesses are not severe enough to need benefits. They don't know what they're talking about. My early adulthood was utterly blighted by them, and I still have to be careful. Never been on benefits for these illnesses myself but I can absolutely see situations where someone might have to be.

The real problem with the UK is its appallingly low productivity levels. We are as a nation inefficient and lazy at work.

How are employers going to employ anyone when the costs of hiring employees keep rising?

Ok 🤷‍♀️

The government could mandate local authorities and the NHS to ensure that all jobs are:

• flexible by default
• part-time or full-time
• onsite or at home

At the moment almost all NHS jobs are advertised as full-time and in the office. The pandemic proved that this was not necessary.

If a job is advertised as full-time and office-based then it should need to be justified, the way that we have e.g. for when jobs require a single-sex person in position.

This would help disabled people enormously, as well as other groups e.g. veterans, parents of young children, carers.

The NEET figures for 16-24yr olds is largely down to the loss of jobs since Brexit went into effect. The mental illness follows on from not being able to find work or an apprenticeship, living in poverty and then getting depressed, feeling hopeless and like there is no future.

Agreed. This can be seen in the % of net taxpayers (how much tax they pay vs the benefits and services they receive) from ONS data.

1979: 29.5% of working age taxpayers were not net taxpayers.

2025: 47% of working age taxpayers are not net taxpayers.

Too many people on low/middle incomes in the UK are paying very little tax vs the benefits and services that they consume.

The result of that trend is much lower levels of productive investment. The cummulative effect of that is a deteriorating infrastructure with poor productivity.

The result of "even more welfare" is precisely that.

NI policy and other Labour policies won’t help. Current job losses are going up for graduates and non graduates.

So are there any jobs that he/ you think he at any point he will be able to do and is he getting any help with that? Do you think it would help if as part of the assessment there was an offer of a program that could help him progress to employment eg Princes Trust I know have really helped a lot of young people ?

I do think there should be for a taper for PIP/DLA - indeed any benefits - based on income/earnings, as there is for child benefit. Incomes above £60,000 receive a reduced amount, while those earning £80,000 don't receive any Child Benefit. This balances support while addressing higher income levels and I think should apply to all in work benefits.

I am taking this thread off track a bit, but given my experience and the experience of ny friends that have somehow emerged through the process, I can tell you it is (unfairly and insanely) difficult to get these benefits.
I have copious amounts of medical evidence and when I first went to claim, I was fucking shocked to discover the reality of documents mysteriously getting lost in the post. When I day that, I mean the DWP/PIP deliberately stating that they hadn't received it and my good old mate told me to ensure that it was sent tracked and had the most amount spent on the postage as possible.

I am already at a disadvantage with my memory issues and organisational failure and then I am met with an underhand system.
Surely the good old UK wouldn't let that happen, right???! Yeh.
And that's before the other unfair and degrading treatment that occurs in the assessment room where assessors distract you and don't ask many questions about your day to day life reality and if they do, the questions are phrased in an unfair manner.
I was raised in a family with much ignorance and a superiority complex to disabled people and now it is me who has to claim.
I'm quite horrified really.
Understand both sides of the coin before you make sweeping statements.
There will be people, as in one poster on here whose son claimed with not much effort and doesn't suffer hugely.
By the law of averages, that will happen (I honestly don't know how!), but it is not the average experience by far: I have friends that have successfully claimed after tribunal and the stories they told me immediately before I began applying were alarmingly scary.
They told tales of becoming homeless in the process because they had no stipend before they applied, they told me they couldn't leave the house for months because they could afford to (been there!)
For disheartened people claiming/beginning the process for the first time: before court tribunal is a rough ride, but keep submitting evidence and attend the assessments however degrading, contest the zero/low points (assuming they are marked too low in terms of your reality), insist on court tribunal (more fair and impartial) if that is the only option.
I am writing that assuming the claimant is honest and I haven't encouraged any one to be untruthful.
It is possible to complain to the assessment provider if you very thr opinion that the assessment and assessor was guilty of malpractice and it is a real possibility that the complaint may reach the body that can fine them.
When I make my next claim, I am taking it to my local law clinic.

My Child is autistic and can’t even say his own name properly so I dont think therapy would be much use for him but I do have anxiety, depression and OCD and therapy has helped me loads over the years it’s not gone away but I feel better able to cope with the bad days. I do work and don’t claim pip, I find being at home makes my anxiety worse but getting out of the house I have to really push myself especially if I’ve had a bad morning to get my son into school so I keep myself busy and also volunteer in my spare time as well as having 3 children in total. I find volunteering boosts my mood and it makes me feel valued when I feel I’m helping others so I feel if someone struggles to hold down a full time job maybe if they had therapy, got into a volunteering scheme where there’s less pressure and ease them into work that could be a good way to help many people who claim pip for anxiety depression etc. taking away all benefits is cruel and would certainly cost lives but with a kind well planned safety net to support those people I’m sure there would be ways to help rather than give people money to stay at home and spiral.
I do hope one day my son will get a job of sorts and he’s very keen too although it’s unlikely without lots of support in place.

It cant just be that

We have to accept that there are also charlatans out there diagnosing people for money, and or people are being exploited by so many social media posts/ads overmedicalising everything.

I dont have ADHD, my nephew is diagnosed with it and my sister suspects she has it but holds down a job as a nurse.

This morning I was flicking through Instagram, at least 6 posts TOLD me I had ADHD, I sleep a certain way its ADHD, I cant be bothered to get off my phone..ADHD...cant be arsed to meal prep...ADHD

These are not ADHD problems.

Being unable to self regulate, having to go food shopping for one meal at a time because you cant focus further than that etc etc I recognise these symptoms

But the things I see online, appear to be symptoms of being online too much

Why is it odd? She is very similar to many other teenagers with ADHD. In fact, she brought 5 of her friends to stay recently and they were all like copy-and-paste of each other. I had to practically beg them all to shower and change their clothes after 3 days.

She doesn't typically go about describing herself in reference to the PIP descriptors. Actually, she presents as a very capable and ambitious young woman with a very bright future. But she (and her Mum who I suspect is the driving force behind the claim) know what the criteria are and how she can be described as fitting into it.

Imo the PIP form should ask you to explain what additional costs your disability brings to your life.

The biggest rate of benefit fraud is for perfectly healthy UC claimants. Disability fraud is a teeny tiny fraction.

You’re describing a very small percentage of people with autism. It’s a complex condition and no two people with autism have the same needs or same level of needs

You tell us where all the jobs and 'support' are going to come from for all the long term unemployed disabled people.
Which employers are going to take them on, and how are they going to magically be made better by having cbt therapy beforehand.
Let's assume that all the claims are genuine, how do you decide who gets money and who doesn't.

I can and do work. But I have to work for myself, because I fuck up more often than other people. And I'm often slower and less efficient than other people on a lot of the time. And I can't do things that even the least capable NT person can do in the most menial job, like keep track of time. Which means when I do make mistakes, they are always deemed to be from carelessness and laziness. I'm also annoying and not very likeable. And that means I don't get anywhere near the grace someone who is likeable gets.

I also have really amazing ideas and improve productively massively sometimes. And sometimes I'm way better and faster than other people. I'm capable of those things on my good days. But that''s never OK. No employer is prepared to absorb that, although they do from people that they perceive cannot do better. I AM NOT SAYING THEY SHOULD. I'm just saying that's actually what I need to be in work, where I actually perform pretty averagely. But people never look at it like that. They just think I should make more effort. And that leaves you burnt out at 40.

I'm rambling a bit. Everyone's happy to take the upside of ND. But often no-one but the ND person themselves absorbs the downside (Yes. It absolutely does impact on things we like. I'm now incapable of planning a holiday. Not the logistics, I've the mental capacity to do it (probably. There's a higher than average chance I'll miss or forget something important. But most things are salvagable) I'll never do it. It takes all my determination to get through the day to day. I even can't think about a time when a holiday feels within my capacity.

What gifts to corporations?

corps pay no tax- that is a product of international tax laws. If we could solve the issue of big corporations paying little to no tax do you not think the government would have by now? It is both on impossible to stop big companies moving their money around. Every single country in the world would have to align its tax laws to solve the problem. It’s horrible but a sad fact.

benefits to support poorly paid work - take them away then. A couple earning NMW should be able to live a modest lifestyle. Often the benefits are topping them up because they have children but we could definitely go to a system where the state stops subsiding couples who can’t afford families if you want

HS2 was abandoned as the government ran out of money to complete. That’s the point.

I'm just speaking for myself here but watching my partner (who was a doctor) and two good friends (nurses) die due to the utter shambles of how COVID was managed fucked my mental health up. Not to mention my mum getting COVID and spending nearly three months in ICU, and being left severely disabled due to it (with multiple emergency admissions to hospital) which has left me with PTSD, panic disorder and severe anxiety.

Oh and being assaulted while at work by a very large angry man who was pissed off that he couldn't do exactly as he wanted so decided to punch me so badly I was left with a broken eye socket and cheekbone.

COVID has left a deep scar on our society that's not even close to being addressed.

That’s possible when you have mild or inactive depression, not so much when it is severe or you’re actively in a depressive relapse.

She made a choice

But posts on threads like this also never explain how to get disabled people capable of work into work if no one wants to hire them?

The same people are saying that the country can't afford disability benefits but are usually also saying that companies aren't charities and will want to hire those who don't need regular time off, multiple reasonable adjustments etc.

So what are disabled people supposed to do?