To not get the visceral levels of hatred people have for Keir Starmer

[LastChristmasigaveyousomesocks]

I’m not suggesting he’s the greatest prime minister ever. I’m not even suggesting he’s good at all. But some people really, really passionately hate him.

He is a bit insipid and doesn’t have much charisma but overall he seems like a decent enough bloke who perhaps lacks the political skill and acumen he needs. He’s out of his depth basically.

But that’s not a reason to actually despise someone is it?

When did we get to a point where we can’t just disagree without painting the other person as the devil incarnate?

Immigration, both legal and illegal is number one or number two priority of voters in most polls. So on the basis smashing the gangs hasn't worked Labour need to do something radical. It will probably end up being off-shore processing. I see Rwanda are suing the UK for millions because Keir Starmer didnt bother to let them know he had cancelled the Rwanda arrangement so maybe he could cut our losses and start that up again.

Your human rights do not depend on the ECHR. I doubt more than a few thousand hardcore middle-class leftish voters care about the ECHR. And they’re almost all too stupid or lazy to bother finding out about the way that Strasbourg court works and why lots of signatory countries have had enough.

It’s yet another left-wing shibboleth.

This seems an extreme reason to want those particular men here.

Yes, whipped up by the right wing press. People should address how dumbed down they want to get, maybe have some self-reflection and be a bit curious and question things. Read a book perhaps. Do we really want to end up like the current U.S. If you are going to engage in the democratic process, you need to be an intellectually free agent and make informed decisions as it is your civic duty to do so!

I think unless you live in a bubble or somewhere particularly refined, most people can just look around and see what the issue is regarding illegal immigration. People can trust their own eyes and make their own decisions. They just happen to disagree with what you think. That's democracy for you!

There's an interesting investigation by the Telegraph (who are doing sterling work at the moment delving into Labour and Keir Starmer) regarding the fact that KS when practising as a QC working with Phil Shiner wanted to bring the ECHR onto the battlefield to prosecute British soldiers. Erroneously as they were innocent. And advised on this on a pro bono basis due to his keen interest in this issue.

As a result there are obvious questions as to his suitability to be in charge of the armed forces. It comes as little surprise I have to say. He was Corbyn's man after all and I remember our secret services were rather concerned about Corbyn becoming PM.

Can someone so fundamentaly change their views once becoming Pm? Question for the day. It seems to have happened with his approach to China. Human rights now seem so very unimportant.

You don't need the ECHR and the HRA and a foreign court. We can have our own bill of rights to ascertain what we want to protect in society.

We need to just ignore the ECHR and do what we want.

I think you are getting illegal immigration and legal mixed up

Both need drastic reduction.

This seems to be the latest reform sound bite
Spoon fed to you by gb news etc
I'll look at more reliable sources
Interesting that you mentioned people changing their views over time. Nigels mentioned a good few controversial viewpoints in his time...what do you think of them?

Why would you think that I think that?

Maybe. But many of the so called views, priorities and opinions you state, are talking about one or the other
Nigel likes to mix up (mis)information about them both
And you lap it up

The Telegraph is still pretty reliable.

And its only reporting the facts which are on record?

Some very stupid people expected him to fix all the country's problems in his first six months in post and now they hate him because he hasn't.

Now then. Let's look at a calender and see how many months are between January 2026 and July 2024. Im fairly sure it's not 6 but am happy to be corrected.

Your line "most people look around them and see the impact of illegal immigration ". They dont
They see the impact of immigration perhaps

Yes you're right to pick me up on that.

Calendar
Yes but many reform voters, as seen on this thread, bang on about 2 years in power. Funny that

Oh do you think the PP who thought Labour has been in power for 6 months is a Reform voter? I dont generally presume these things but perhaps you are right.

What?

It’s closer to 2 years than 6 months as claimed by pp.

You’re also likely to be using reform voter for anyone not pro Labour.

It is closer agreed
My point is that people quote all sorts of crap about timeliness
It weakens all arguments

No, my commas made this clear

I wish it were true about the Telegraph, but sadly no..
What were your views on if past views should impact everyone's position as PM? Or does that only apply to KS?

He was actually doing this pro bono? So its actions as well as views. Judge a man by what he does etc...