To not get the visceral levels of hatred people have for Keir Starmer

[LastChristmasigaveyousomesocks]

I’m not suggesting he’s the greatest prime minister ever. I’m not even suggesting he’s good at all. But some people really, really passionately hate him.

He is a bit insipid and doesn’t have much charisma but overall he seems like a decent enough bloke who perhaps lacks the political skill and acumen he needs. He’s out of his depth basically.

But that’s not a reason to actually despise someone is it?

When did we get to a point where we can’t just disagree without painting the other person as the devil incarnate?

I was just thinking the other day about how he's quite boring really. That's how I like my politicians. Nice and boring. Better than having a complete maniac in charge

Indeed. And to make matters worse, the Labour government didn’t even do their admin properly. So now we’re being sued by Rwanda.

Rwanda is suing Britain after Labour abandoned the former government’s asylum deal with the country.
The decision to abandon the plan was one of Sir Keir Starmer’s first acts in office, just days before the first plane was due to leave the UK for Kigali.

I think about the SAs it may have prevented. The safety it would have created.

It was for 250 people, and the agreement we would take a similar number of the most vulnerable refugees in Rwanda. It was a very expensive nonsense.

Same. Rwanda had said they’d take in all of the refugees.

I think the main thing (that no parties will do) is leave echr, scrap hra and just don't allow them in. The US does this now and just refused to hear claims. We need to step up and protect the border and just not let them in.

I get where you are coming from OP and I am more blah about him and wouldn't describe myself as hating him.

But I have talked to people who don't think his blandness is a kind of incompetent goodwill, but see him as having quite deliberately and cynically lied, saying what people wanted to hear, throughout the leadership contest and then throughout the election. All while claiming the moral high ground.

So that is a rather more negative picture.

The greens aren't in power and the right-wing press are trying to eviscerate their leader too.

The people joining the green party are mostly younger so pay less attention to newspapers. The people who support reform are mostly older.

I don't know what it is about Labour, butt hey seem to struggle with understanding voters in general. It's very weird. But if you can't understand the voters you aren't going to put out messages they find compelling.

Lets ignore the last 4 years - Covid and Ukraine, a bad set of external pressures for anyone....

To only be able to come out with, after 10 years..... "Online services (very debatable)" and "energy mix" is, to put it frankly, pathetic, bear in mind Tories banned On-Shore Wind....

Especially as, even before Ukraine, we had some of Europes highest energy costs, due to never having built or even planned Nuclear power stations, whilst decommissioning the ones we did have.

Fibre roll out is around 70%, in France its approx 90% across many areas, UK is also a low connection country, just 37% have taken advantage of fibre, due to cost.... & our MB networks one of the worst in Europe.

On that treasury note, if you believe it to be true (it wasn't) with debt to gdp of 65% in 2010.... what do you think of Reeves having to deal with debt to gdp of 100%?

Online services did drastically improve. The energy mix is a lot better. I like offshore wind. On-shore wind has blight issues which the rural Tory communities would not have liked. If things should have been different on nuclear so be it. I'm happy we have more renewables in the system. Data shows the support from wind and the reduction in reliance from fossil fuels pushed bills down.

Tory policy still drastically improved broadband rollout. Maybe not as good as France. But better from the past.

Rachel from accounts has produced 2 horrendous budgets.

To be fair to man of the people Sir Keir, it’s not just him. It’s Socialist governments. See Spain here as another example. look at all the ladies in that queue. Funny how Spain wanted all the tourists chucked out (frankly who could blame them, on occasion), but 500,000 undocumented (mostly male) immigrants are ok.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15512575/Huge-numbers-migrants-queue-street-collect-paperwork-socialist-Spain-announced-grant-legal-status-500-000-sparking-row-PM-Elon-Musk-rigging-elections.html#

No parties will do this because it would be insane, impossible and wouldn’t solve any problems the country is actually having.
Maybe consider that if you hold an opinion that no expert in any political grouping shares, you may be missing something?

I can’t see how we could not let in people arriving here on dinghies, stowed away in lorries and so on.

But leaving the ECHR and repealing the HRA are not only obviously not ‘insane’ but may well become Labour policy before too long.

When a former Supreme Court Justice (and the most highly rated of all of them in his time) and a former Labour Lord Chancellor take against the ECHR I think we can safely say that it’s a mainstream view.

Tories and reform have commited to leaving the ECHR. We need to stop the boats and the people on them coming here. They are not welcome.

Leaving the ECHr won’t help with refugees. How do you propose stopping them?
Not responding to the other poster who quoted me because it’s proved pointless in the past

Edit: nit welcome with you, you mean? I don’t have a problem with desperate people being helped.

Even the ECHR realise they have to change or they’re at risk of people leaving.

Not responding to the other poster who quoted me because it’s proved pointless in the past

I don’t want or need a response from you. Correct statements like mine can stand perfectly happily without more. 👍

COMPLETELY disagree with this - I wouldn't pee on Trump if he was on fire.

The image that has raised in my head....😱😱😱

Are you saying it’s ok if the rapists among the asylum seekers rape Rwandan women & girls ?

Why would it “prevent SA” - would it not just displace it to a victim in Rwanda ?

Do not allow them to stay here. As with other illegal immigrants send them back to their country of origin. Remove all pull factors, do not offer any assistance. Tories didn't do this, labour still won't. I even doubt Reform tbf.

I'd rather them just not be here.

I agree and actually don't know anyone, friends and colleagues that feel so strongly about this.

No thanks, I want my human rights protected and I'm a member of the public. I don't hear this from anyone I know and Labour needs to understand that this isn't something they should pursue if they want to keep on the side of many of their voters.