So upset about ICE killings in Minnesota

[Allotmentblackfly]

So upset about the killings. No investigation and victim blaming from the Trump administration. I see no hope for America. Trump will cancel the midterms possibly elections or will rig them. The most powerful western country - one we thought was our friend is dying
im so sad for the bereaved and do sad for the country

You are promoting an untruth.

No, but people carry guns if they are prepared to use them. Same as with knives. Try telling a British policeman, judge or jury that you are carrying a knife for self defence...

I have family (in a different country) who habitually carry guns. Two family members there have been shot, one died. I've been held at gunpoint twice elsewhere (!!) so I do understand that argument, but if you can't have them you can't use them.

And the U.K. has to work hand in glove with the US; and many of our British and European ancestors descendants are involved. We share a great deal of culture in common as well as our language.

This is not the case in Iran however true it is that an unbelievably dreadful regime is in power there, and that a thread could be started for discussing it.

It’s like that scene in The Handmaids Tale where they flashback to a protest attended by June and her friend and the police draw machine guns and start spraying the crowd. It’s the look of sheer disbelief on their faces that this could happen.

It’s chilling.

Its actually worse than that - we didn't want a woman so both times we voted for the most awful man because we thought that would be better than either of 2 intelligent women.

Elon runs them in practice.

“And then he [Musk] journeyed to Pennsylvania, where he spent like a month and a half campaigning for me in Pennsylvania, And he’s a popular guy. And he was very effective. And he knows those computers better than anybody. All those computers, Those vote counting computers. And we ended up winning Pennsylvania like in a landslide. So it was pretty good. It’s pretty good.”

Some people got a power kick out of turning in their neighbours. In Rwanda, people literally massacred their neighbours.

They're not. This didn't happen. The orange baboon is a liar.

It’s horrifying to see what is going on. The mass protests happening now on the streets are being ignored by the media too which doesn’t help.

Having a gun on him didn't protect Alex.

The only way to reduce the number of deaths due to gun violence is to reduce the number of guns, particularly those in the hands of people who have no business handling lethal weapons. ICE for instance.

ICE have been equipped not only with the handguns and non-lethal weapons commonly issued to police forces around the world, but they also have their hands on military grade weapons. Contrast with the UK where some of our police officers are armed but (to the best of my knowledge) not one immigration officer is. Immigration officers have no business holding weapons, if they are doing a raid considered to be dangerous then they should work in cooperation with the police.

Police standards in the US need raising, more than a thousand people per year are killed (lawfully or otherwise) by police officers in the US. In the UK the number shot last year was two. Yes, there are substantial differences that mean that the US rate will never quite be as low, but they could do a lot more to descalate.

the officer who fired the gun was CBP and they really do need firearms due to cartel violence (and they are not afraid to use them, as you seen. Incidentally the guy who killed the Uvalde elementary school shooter was CBP, local cops didn’t dare intervene, to great tragedy. Maybe says something about the CBP)

Maybe they should not have been reassigned to Minneapolis. But ICE needs to be able to safely do their job, and the Minnesota PD don’t really assist properly. All of the protesters should have been arrested and charged with obstruction from the beginning, to ensure public safety. It is a mistake from Noem. She cannot expect ICE to do detainments as well as crowd control. CBP are perhaps not the right fit to be assisting

oh dont be ridiculous.
Noem needs sacking or worse for her perpetual lies and victim blaming. She couldn't lie straight in bed and anyone who believes her nonsense is a fool frankly.

It shows how very quickly the decent into facism happens. I find it terrifying in the light of reform’s polling. We are so much more in danger than may people realise. Democracy is not the obvious order for things- dictatorship and loss of freedom is. We worked so hard over centuries and many people died to win us democracy in the west. We mustn’t allow facism to take over like it did in Germany and has begun to in America.

Why are these fools there, do they not have jobs or families to take care of or better ways to spend time than looking for trouble and get on the way of armed officers doing their job?

I think Homan would have been a better choice but Trump unfortunately has a thing for overpromoting women. Bondi has also been a huge disappointment too, as well as Chavez.

Tbh it would have been better to just arrest protestors and put them in federal lockup. Safer for everyone.

A few hundred protestors obstructing ICE operations in Minneapolis do not overrule the vote of 77 million Americans. They have zero right to interfere with ICE operations. I put them in the same category of ‘protestors’ harassing women at abortion clinic. Your personal morals do not entitle you to interfere in this manner.

I do feel for Alex because he didn’t do anything. (Renee though caused her own death through her own negligence)

What I don’t understand is that ICE have been operating continuously in many states for years and years and no one has been coming out to protest. They are operating in many states now and nothing is happening. Deportations during Clinton and Obama’s terms were massive but no one came out to protest . I am sad people are getting hurt- America is just an immensely trigger happy place but am baffled why it is such an issue in Minneapolis . Many people are happy with what ICE are doing. One of the net effects in some areas where there have been big raids is there are many more jobs for teenagers and young people as those low paid roles were the ones taken by the illegal immigrants.

No. She didnt.

how is this a descent into facism?. The majority of Americans are happy with this . They voted for it and he is enacting what they wanted. the government is enforcing its laws just as they should be for all laws on the statute book. People aren’t allowed to be in the country illegally, just as they aren’t allowed to assault people or shoplift. I do find that if anyone disagrees with the government they roll out the ‘fascist’ card but this is absolutely the opposite.

I’m glad some trump supporters are on this thread as it shows their thinking.
It’s not very smart thinking but this is what we’re up against as the masses decide to hold their noses and allow the state to act unlawfully because they think they’re going to get what they want in the end.
I suppose there were some people who had a great time in Nazi Germany and ISIS controlled Syria.
The people around Trump are certainly making a lot of money out of his tenure.

For what it’s worth I do agree that in general law enforcement operatives deserve to be able to do their jobs without fear of violence. In return they adhere to a professional standard, are auditable and their actions are transparent and can withstand scrutiny. Are you Trump supporters really suggesting these over emotional trigger happy masked men in jeans are operating in an acceptable manner?

Well I’m certainly not a trump supporter nor any political supporter of either side in the US.

You have to remember that the US always had had a very different standard when it comes to guns than in the UK. In the very rare event in the Uk if there is a police shooting there is a massive investigation into but in the US it has always been the case since time began that the benefit of the doubt will always go to the officials doing their jobs.

If someone has a gun for ‘protection’ they will naturally use it if threatened. That threat might actually be tiny but our fight or flight reflex is to fire first, ask questions later. It is a very human response. People in the US know this and know if they put themselves up against any officials that they may come out on the wrong side. Doesn’t make it right but this is a very known fact.

That is why we don’t have guns in the Uk and very very few police are armed and those that are have to go through extreme vetting and training to get one because it is a slippery slope once they start expanding their use.

The only solution is for a sound opposition to emerge. The problem isn't so much swinging from one party to the other every four years, it's the fact that one of them is so far gone it's no longer an option. Democracy can only survive when there are viable alternatives to the party in power. We now have the exact same issue by the way, engineered by the people who pushed brexit, Maga and all the populists out there.

Painfully short-sighted not to be concerned about state-sanctioned murders in the most poweful country in the world

The man who shot Alex is a longtime CBP. They are very professional and are trained to deal with things like cartel violence.

They are not trained to deal with hapless protestors. That was where Minneapolis PD should have stepped up and arrested them for obstruction.

This is why two protestors are dead in Minneapolis and nowhere else.

He was stood recording them? He was helping a woman they'd thrown to the ground and then sprayed in the face?