To think some children are just wired to need / want screen time

[Gagamama2]

All my children’s childhood we have limited screen time. They are generally not allowed any on school weekdays (my partner put this in place years ago and gets angry if I relent). They are allowed it on Saturday and Sunday mornings, and holiday mornings, although partner is always unhappy about this and would like to restrict furthur.

Kids are 10, 8 and 6.

It often causes a lot of grief / anger / upset for 10 and 6 who are both boys undergoing assessment for adhd. They often get upset after school that they aren’t allowed any, and when they are allowed they find it hard to come off. This means they regularly have much too much screen time at the weekend as the fall out of them having to come off the screens is big.

My daughter who is 8 is different. She will happily choose other things to do, even if it is a screen time “time”. What prompted my post is that she has spent this morning reading a graphic novel about dragons, and is now singing along at top volume to the greatest showman soundtrack on Alexa, all of her own accord while her brothers are on screens. She just isn’t that bothered. I was the same compared to my brother who spent most of his childhood playing on either our Amiga or his best friends Amiga 😂.

my brother is now a functional adult - much more functional than me, in fact. He has a very good job, although I do look at him sometimes and wonder if he is ND. My point is the screen time didn’t hold him back.

are we unreasonable limiting children’s screen times (as long as it’s not impacting on school work and friendships etc)? Maybe it’s not actually helpful for some children

Id be inclined to further restrict if they're having tantrums when they come off them.

My brother did a lot of gaming and frankly hasn't done very well (plus ended up with Ricketts from never being outside) BUT the nature of screen time now is very different versus screen time of 20-30 years. It's in kids faces, it's relentless, it's literally designed to be intrusive and move in a way that draws them in and makes them addicted to the next hit / press / scenario. If your boys are on track to an ADHD diagnosis they probably need to be out all the time and moving / playing sports. I would be ruthlessly strict about none during the week and would be struct too about parts of the weekend. Any relaxation of the rules, or excess time, becomes the slippery slope

Of course some kids like it more. There are also kids who like Spider-Man or purple or ballet. I have never been a gamer but my brother and husband and son love video games. My daughter isn’t bothered. I definitely am not bothered.

Your kids struggling to stop is not great. What are they doing on the screens? For my son (9) I very much restrict video games and he has no access to YouTube, but I don’t mind when he watches a nature show and we watch bake off or a movie together etc. But I am sure too many video games affects his mood and probably his brain so he gets 3 hours a week (mostly on weekends as he has clubs most nights)

My DS gets like this too.

Fifty years ago I would have my head buried in a Book.DM would tell me to put it down and go out and play. Now it’s a screen. There is a world of learning available on a screen. It is a great educator. If all you do is play shoot em up that’s different.

I think some children have poorer impulse control, yes. And are less able to entertain themselves without being encouraged in that direction.

That said, I think there is a huge difference between big screens (watching films and tv) and small screens (handheld gaming, YouTube, scrolling).

I had zero limits on what tv I could watch as a child. I had a tv in my bedroom from probably 10. My parents were a bit shit, so I often didn’t go to school and I could spend weeks doing nothing but watching tv 12+ hours a day.

I don’t think it had any negative effects. I’ve been very traditionally successful career wise and in other aspects of life. As an adult, I don’t ever watch tv really, though I do use a computer and phone. I don’t game. I spend a lot of time outdoors and doing active things.

But I have very good impulse control and am very self-regulated. So it’s not so much screens, but how you can manage your own behaviour and I do think certain people are different. I don’t really buy into this whole ADHD thing, but I do think not everyone can cope with modern life as well as others because we aren’t made to be indoors in front of screens from an evolutionary perspective.

Funny how so many of us survived without any screens at all for much or all of our childhoods. There were these quaint old fashioned things called books that we used to enjoy.

Ha ha ha

do you honestly think prior to the turn of the century children were sitting reading most of the time - when they weren’t playing outside in wholesome surroundings that is?

Cone on!

I dont think its a need as such as obviously this type of thing hasnt existed very long in human history. But I do think some children find it more rewarding than others and that reward might be fullfilling a need that could be met other ways with more effort.

A lot of these games are designed to give lots of little dopamine hits and adhd has been described as some people as a dopamine disorder, which could be why some people find it harder than others to regulate. People with asd can enjoy the structure and rules compared to the uncertainty of real games etc.

Theres a guy, tj power, who is a neuroscientist. He goes into schools to talk about the DOSE effect ( dopamine, oxytocin, serotonin and endophins) and ways to digitally detox and balance those things in other ways. Its very interesting.

Yes I agree with you OP. Looking back I think my sister and I reading obsessively was a version of screen time in that we could block out the world and be lost in an absorbing activity. Now as parents we notice that her son is similarly wired and needs / obsesses over screen time whereas my DD just isnt bothered. She’s NT, he’s ND with autism.

Just because your boys would prefer more screen time, doesn't mean they're wired towards it. I would actually be limiting it further as it seems they are likely to become dependent on it. I see it time and time again with my kids - when they have no screens, they find something interesting and creative to do.

No 🤣🤣🤣

No kid needs screens but they might want them!

Theres been several studies from Japan recently showing that longer daily screen exposure as a child is a significant factor in increased ADHD symptoms two years later!

I was referring to my own era of childhood - 50s and 60s, not to much more recent decades. We didn’t have a TV until I was 11 - not unusual then.

I don't think humans can be wired to need screens in the sense that screens are not natural. (Eg. I think people can be wired to need peace and quiet or wired to need adrenaline rushes, but not screens specifically.)

When it comes to your children though you might find that you have made screens like forbidden fruit with what seems like arbitrary rules to them.

My child has ADHD, I don't limit screen time except for he's not allowed after he's had dinner, so we can practice good sleep hygiene for his evening routine (he struggles to wind down and get to sleep) so we have bath books and bed, no screens in the evening and this is a rule he can understand and the reason why. Rest of the time he can go on minecraft etc.. whenever he wants but it's naturally limited by weekend plans, school, hobby clubs to the point he's only really got a couple of hours per day anyway, and some days where he has school followed by swimming followed by dinner, there's no opportunity at all.

Some people are more hooked on junk food than other people and the companies are very good at adjusting the contents to make both more and more addictive.

We are all different in terms of our susceptibility to things, some people can manage them in a healthy way, some feel a consumption to consume in excess - we see that with alcohol, gambling and even some sports, as well as foods and electronics. We protect children from the former but the latter are trickier to handle.

Does every behavioural thread here have to have something to do with ADHD?😴

Respectfully, this is ridiculous. Nobody is wired to NEED screen time.

Because people are different and this applies to screens. Some people like music. Others like art. Some kids do a lot of sport. Others do none.

Screens are no different - you are looking for an ‘excuse’ to give in to more screen time.

The isn’t biological proof and frankly it so a bit crazy to think so.

We have non Internet enabled games consoles they get to play like PS2/PS3 and Game Cube etc. I let them watch YouTube but they have timers set for this and need to come off when that time is up. And find something else to do.

Screens are just the easiest, most passive way to get a dopamine hit. That's what some kids are wired for - especially those with ADHD.

I do think you need to restrict them to a set time at the weekend and stick to it - remind them in a positive way 10 and 5 minutes before it's time to come off. Perhaps to make the transition easier for them you could get them learning some coding - so they're still on a screen for a while longer - but they're actually learning.

They may have used Scratch at school and it's perfect for this age IMO. It's where DS started (also ND) and he's now working as a software engineer. Maybe spend some time on there with them, helping them learn how to use it and suggesting things they could do. They could then have 20 minutes every weekend after their gaming to do some Scratch and hopefully calm the transition. The 10 year old can then move on to Python once he is a pro at Scratch - it is a jump but Python is fantastic because it can be learnt as a beginner but is also used a lot in workplaces. DS uses Python a lot and is still his fave language.

This from Google:
Screens can offer temporary regulation for kids with ADHD through high stimulation and dopamine hits, making them engaging and sometimes reducing immediate symptoms, but this often leads to worse long-term regulation, hyperfocus, emotional meltdowns when stopping, and can exacerbate core ADHD issues like impulsivity and difficulty with transitions, making healthy habits crucial. While screens can be a useful reward or instructional tool in moderation, overuse often hinders development and worsens symptoms, creating a cycle of dependency.

No but this one does because the kids are being assessed for it and it's highly relevant. If you know nothing about it or have nothing useful to say though, then feel free not to comment.

Op has said that her children have adhd

No need to go back 1000's of years, a mere 50 (or fewer) will do.

No, of course not. You seem to be suggesting their tantrums mean they should have more screen time rather than less. If they kick off about turning it off they need a proper break from it. It’s fine to be disappointed but they need to respect the limits you put in place, explain and enforce or they’re not mature enough to use screens for entertainment.