To dob in family member - benefits

[Dragonsfoot]

I have a relative that does have health problems. They went to tribunal and were awarded higher rate PIP and have a motorbility car apparently supported by a Rottweiler of an advocate. I have no gripe that they deserve something - occasional falls, mild mental health problems, physical health problems that require monitoring and support and mild difficulties dressing themselves due to joint problems but don’t actually need to be helped. They do have a disability.

However, they are able to walk miles most of the time, decorate their home, complete domestic tasks and attend social activities on a very regular basis on foot. Morally torn. They probably will struggle without the money. Would DWP even do anything kind of thing. Either way I feel a bad person.

What does that have to do with my post? It does not change the fact that PIP is not an out of work benefit, it is awarded based on need, not on employment status so the percentage of PIP claimants who work is not applicable to my post, which was merely pointing out the non-means tested nature of PIP.

Roughly 17% of those claiming PIP work full time, but this can fluctuate to as high as 27% because movement in and out of work is frequent. It’s estimated that 41% of new claims are made by those in work.

Not sure what this has to do with the discussion here to be honest. PIP is not an out of work benefit, not means tested, and doesn’t assess the ability to work. The number of people claiming PIP while in work fluctuates because the ability to work is linked to overall health so people move in and out of work - it can be as high as 27% at any one time and it’s been estimated that currently 41% of new claims are from those in work.

You'd have to be cynical in the extreme to imagine that the pp was indulging in a bit of dog whistling, thinking they were cleverly insinuating that disabled people are unwilling to work without having to openly say it.

For any posters on here indignant at the idea of someone working and receiving PIP, allow me to share my personal circumstances.
Since I am totally blind I require a range of adaptive technology, specialist equipment and personal support to allow me to carry out basic tasks that most people take for granted. Without expensive specially designed phones and scanners, screen-readers, documents in braille, talking kitchen devices, personal assistance and many other adaptations I would be unable to function day to day, let alone get to and remain in work. My workplace covers some of the adaptations I require at work but all the adjustments I require outside of work are entirely funded by me. Without PIP it is likely that I would no longer be able to afford these necessities and I would lose my job as a result, ironically costing the 'hard-working tax payers', of whom I am, in fact, one, lots more cash! My PIP does not come close to covering the many extra costs I incur each month, purely due to my disability, though it does help. As I have to cover a large proportion of the extra costs from my wages I am considerably worse off than someone without my disability earning the same wage, I hope this is a comfort to the posters on here seething in impotent rage at the thought of all us feckless, lazy disabled scroungers living tax-payer funded lives of luxury!

Bloody hell. Given all those crying “spite” and “jealousy” over the suggestion to report what looks like an exaggerated claim, it’s no wonder the spending is out of control and genuine claimants suffer.

OP's relative has gone through a tribunal to be awarded PIP. What makes you think that anything OP says is truthful? Yet you, and others, seem to think that medical professionals are wrong.

No I don’t @UserFront242, stop making things up.

My point is that the unnecessary and defensive pile on to the OP here perfectly demonstrates why people are reluctant to report suspected abuses. Hence the ever rising and unaffordable costs.

It is necessary, actually to point out to the OP that she might not be in full knowledge of the reasons why her relative is receiving PIP. They have been assessed, and awarded, and yet she is questioning if he should be getting it, based on what she thinks she knows about his disability, nothing else.

OP says her relative is on PIP. They have been assessed as being eligible after a tribunal.
OP then says her relative is not really eligible for it, and is committing fraud.

Why are people believing the second statement, but not the former?

There's no need for anyone to jealous of the money my friend gets. All they need to do is get a chainsaw hack off their own legs and they too could claim the same amount.

It went to Tribunal and still the Op thinks she knows better!

Why do you think there’s a correlation between rising costs and fraud ? The reason PIP costs have been rising is that unlike it’s predecessor, DLA, it’s open to claims on mental health grounds, which have risen hugely since Covid.

No prejudice here.

When it comes to benefits, any type of benefits, not just PIP, there are some that shouldn’t be on them and play the system.

Anyway, if you can’t prove I’m wrong in what I’m saying, then stop replying with stupid remarks.

What is it with people resorting to personal abuse instead of calmly defending their points?

😂

I’m assuming you meant to be funny!

Read back your posts; no points being defended, just personal attacks.

I mean you say stuff, you deny saying it, it's pointed out by others that you've said it, you ignore that... Waste of everyone's time.

If you think disabled people are prone to lying, exaggerating and committing fraud, nobody is going to persuade you otherwise. It's too tedious to continue engaging with you so please, get your last word in and this boring exercise in futility can end.

You twist everything for a reaction.

Maybe its time to stop the dry January? Withdrawal seems to be making you irritable.

😂

What a horrible thing to consider doing as they clearly do struggle at times and not all disabilities are black and white.
I have a friend who has a lifelong autoimmune disease and they receive PIP even though they work as much as they can and are generally quite active. The PIP covers treatments which they need and helps to make up for lost work days when they are having a flare up. PIP is not an easy thing to claim and up to date medical records are needed to claim and for any reviews.
Because I actually love and care about my friend, I’m so pleased that they get the support they do from the government as living with a long-term illness or disability is not nice so any extra help for them is great in my opinion.
I cannot fathom what type of person you must be to begrudge this help aiding your own family member. Shame on you.

The poster has a point. In your reply to my post you said that you are not anti PIP. But in that same post you demonstrated that you know absolutely nothing about the application process, because you asked me whether l had attempted to verify information my clients were providing.

Despite me telling you that’s not the remit of agencies assisting in form filling, and explaining that your assumption that of PIP as an entirely self reporting process is not correct, you seem to be clinging to that assumption.

There have been some quite detailed explanations of the processes involved and the need for evidence and assessment, provided by those who work within the system. Only the initial stages of the application are self reported - to be awarded benefit there has to be tangible evidence of disability either provided by the claimant via their own health care providers, or via an assessment with a DWP appointed assessor, who is a healthcare professional and trained in disability assessment.

And that evidence has to meet strict eligibility thresholds, as well as being correct in law. In the absence of any in depth knowledge of what disability means, or the processes involved in assessment for disability benefits, your assertion seems to be that benefit fraud is rife because assessors are not doing their jobs properly and aren’t capable of recognising when someone is cheating.

It might interest you to know that the person carrying out the assessment does not make the actual decision on whether benefit is awarded - that’s down to the DWP case manager who receives a report from the assessor and considers it alongside any other evidence submitted or requested from other agencies.

The number of decisions made in which benefit is denied which are then overturned in favour of the client at tribunal, indicates that one of the major factors in the huge rise in expenditure is not down to fraud, but is actually attributable to the fact that so many claimants are forced to go to very expensive tribunal to obtain a fair decision. This is because the assessment system itself is flawed - it’s actually designed to doubt what claimants are saying at every stage and to deny benefit wherever possible, not to just blithely accept whatever they say as the truth.

Assessors and decision makers have to work within this system and many have voiced opinions that it’s unfair, but at the moment it’s all we have. Of course bad decisions will be made - no system is foolproof, but current information suggests that the number of incorrect decisions denying benefit to genuine claimants, far outweighs that of fraud and error in their favour.

@Dragonsfoot and above is your answer. Don’t dob in your relatives as they have been legitimately rewarded their PIP despite what you may think.

This! At last.

I’m going a bit from memory here, but when DLA was first introduced it was basically known as the breathing/limbs benefit. Sickness and Incapacity benefits (out of work benefits) covered other things but DLA didn’t really, other than a few exceptions.

(Disability Living Allowance (DLA) was introduced in the UK in
April 1992, replacing the previous Mobility Allowance (MobA) and Attendance Allowance (AA) to provide a single benefit for disabled people under 65, helping with extra costs for care and mobility.)

Since then, the eligibility criteria has massively increased, and now covers mental health, addictions, ND etc

There were years of arguments about Fibromyalgia, ME and CFS because doctors were insisting that they were psychological, and that “getting on with life” was the best idea. That ethos doesn’t exist now.

So, yes, the numbers claiming has increased a lot - but the system has changed under various governments.

But, the fact that it includes so many things now doesn’t make it fraud.

Every reform, to cut costs, introduced by any government, has ended up with more people claiming.

If people have a problem with the criteria, then best contact your MP. DWP workers, assessors and claimants are just acting within the rules. 🤷‍♀️