For speaking to my adult dd about her fiancé ?

[Anonyalphamom]

Dd is 25. Been with her bf for about four years , they met in covid . He was the first boy she had ever dated. She has social anxiety ( though much better now than she was ) and very low self esteem. We have never really warmed to him, it’s very hard to find the words to explain but he is an odd amalgam of device obsessed teenager and a 70 year old man that’s very set in his ways . On paper it’s a great relationship. She lives about two hours away , finishing up
her studies and he moved jobs to be with her. They have a rented house that’s really nice and a very quiet life of the odd Indian meal out and trips to the retail park or a stately home type outing ( dd doesn’t drink and he rarely does ) .
her brothers don’t like him as they don’t like him watching football on his phone at family gatherings and feel he puts her down and doesn’t help her self confidence. Having said that he is always made welcome here and we are nothing but nice to him and I never say anything to dd.
this time , before they came for Xmas, dd messaged me the previous days to say that he had gone out to his works Xmas do , got really drunk , managed to work the next day but then basically spent three days in bed. She sounded exasperated with him , for the first time ever.
they came home on Tuesday and we have hardly seen him , he will eat a meal with us then just disappear upstairs. On Xmas day , they went to his parents for the day , got home about 8.30 and he went straight to bed, didn’t even say hello.
tonight we were playing a board game and he just got up and went upstairs mid game , and didn’t reappear.
god sorry this is so long but gist is , is now a time to say something to dd ? I don’t want her to feel trapped into staying with him. I want to
offer to support her financially if needs be , pay his share of the rent etc so she knows she has options , but should I just not interfere ?

I understand you didn't want to embarrass her but it's also normalising his bad behaviour. She's had four years of his conditioning and might be confused as to what's normal and acceptable.

I'd start gently challenging his odd and rude behaviour, obviously not everything all at once as there seems to be so much!
Pick something that might be particularly frustrating to your dd and it might give her an opportunity to express her feelings to you.

That’s bizarre then. He should have said where he was going.

Although in my family after that amount of time we would have asked the boyfriend where on earth he was!

How much of this is actually damaging to a relationship though? It sounds like he's ignoring arbitrary social rules more than doing anything he shouldn't that really matters. OP might feel personally ill-treated by his rudeness, but if DD doesn't, is any of it really a problem?

I think the fact you know him from before and have seen a shift in his behaviour gives you a way in to the conversation. You can remark he seems different, and see what she says.

If you live in a yurt on a remote island and knit your own underpants out of hemp then ignoring 'arbitrary social rules' is fine. If you live amongst other people and wish to be served in shops/cafes/ see a doctor/ have some sort of employment then you need to accept that social rules as simple as ' I'm really tired, I'm going to go to bed' are basic and necessary.

Whatever you choose to say; dont attack him, dont focus your words on how horrid, rude, and annoying he is - it'll push her to defend her relationship, him and her choices.

Focus any words of support on her, what she deserves, what she should be expecting, what she should strive for, what she should expect.

I think the DD does though. Or why text him- she could have gone and shouted upstairs where have you gone?! So it seems to me she sounds embarrassed.

Perhaps I’ve read it wrong but putting aside the fact that both OP’s daughter and her boyfriend appear to be ND what I took from her post is that her daughter doesn’t seem to be as happy in the relationship as she once was.
Apart from the fact her daughter had already mentioned her frustration over his behaviour after his work Christmas night out the fact that they came in after spending Christmas Day with his family and went straight up to bed without so much of an hello we’re back would lead me to wonder why she at least didn’t feel able to have a quick chat about the day. Similarly her texting, rather than going up to make sure he was OK after he abruptly left the family board game.
Perhaps I’m adding 2 and 2 up to make 5 but even allowing for his and her’s possible ND alarm bells about the future for this relationship would definitely be ringing for me.
My children are young and I have no real advice as to what OP can do to try and help her daughter for whatever the future might bring relationship wise but based on what she’s said as a first step I’d probably try and start a discussion along the lines of I’d noticed that he didn’t appear to be himself and see where that led.

Did something happen at the Xmas do? Is he ill? It reads like maybe he isn’t feeling well as you have previously got on fine with him. Or something else is off?

Sounds like my ex bil, who would pull all sorts of rude shit when visiting. No nd, no social anxiety, no mh problems. He was just a cunt.

Whether his behaviour is a result of ND or not is irrelevant really. We’re not obligated to tolerate someone because their behaviour is likely down to autism. If this man is not capable of making this young lady happy, as the OP fears, then shouldn’t she move on, irrespective of the reasons?

My brother is autistic. I don’t have any contact with him, because his behaviour makes me fearful and miserable. He can’t help it, but that doesn’t make me less fearful or miserable.

Sounds a lot like my ex, I got with him at 19 and my parents were never his biggest fans - my Dad was especially hostile towards him but only communicated this openly once I eventually left him as my ex would otherwise have cut me off from the family which would have destroyed my Mum. On family occasions with my side of the family he made sure I never left his side and if his working patterns meant he couldn't attend a family gathering with me I wasn't allowed to go either - it changed somewhat when we had children and I eventually started attending more family events without him. There were times I wasn't allowed to see my Mum and Dad unless he was present but this gradually settled down. My parents wouldn't say anything or ask questions in case it caused upset or my ex laid down the law, but always told me when he wasn't present or in earshot that I was always welcome to move back home - I know my Mum would tear her hair out with worry that I wasn't being treated right and wanted me to stay close. I always thought that my parents would make me feel like a failure if I left home and came back to them, or that nobody else would want me.

Yes, but this time they really really do......

Is he not just autistic? From how you describe him it sounds like he can't handle spending the entire time around people. I'm not neurodiverse and would struggle being sat with my in-laws with no escapefor days on end, when I first started going out with my husband (we were 21) I'd disappear for a breather from them, it's hard work.

Going out getting drunk on his works do is neither here nor there, he's young and has no ties. Watching football on his phone, he's probably just bored. Also it's completely normal for brothers to not like their sister's first boyfriend, she isn't bringing round a mate for them. My husband is polar opposite to my brother, they'd never be mates if they met oneanother separately, there's nothing wrong with my husband though, they are just different people. My brother did used to act weird about my first boyfriend's when I was much younger he hated every single one, but had no real reason to.

I'm sure your daughter has similar struggles around his parent's house, if she has similar issues, I doubt you'd be pleased if his family were making similar comments about your daughter.

I'd leave well alone, spending 24/7 with your in-laws doesn't give you any insight into their relationship, I used to hate being around my in-laws (past tense, we just don't do it anymore!).

They all know one another pretty well - OP says that he lived with them for 6 months during covid but that he has changed recently - it's all in her opening post

I was going to say could you ask him if he is OK? Just say "you don't seem your normal self, is everything OK"

He sounds like he has social anxiety too

Something happened at the Xmas do.

Have they fallen out over the drunken incident? And he's keeping out of the way on her territory so to speak. Went to the loo and didn't come back, I would assume embarrassing upset stomach. Or are you all drinking and he's avoiding it after the other day?

You could have a very gentle talk. I will have little talks with my sons every so often just to check in that they are still happy in their relationships. I don’t interfere but do impart my wisdom every so often.

It does, TBH. It is enormously draining and stressful and lonely.

He can’t help it though. And he does mean well - there isn’t a nasty bone in his body, though there are times when I’m not sure that counts for as much as I think it does when functionally I’m still left carrying everything, practically and socially and emotionally.

We can’t separate for financial reasons (and also because I couldn’t rely on him to be able to take proper care of DC during contact time, and I also don’t think he’d really manage to live independently TBH).

I'd simply say ... just a gentle reminder that we will support you in any way we can if you need us to.

I don’t think my DH knew he was masking - I think I was his special interest and he put all his energy into being a fantastic boyfriend. It was a hobby and project for him, and he loves a project, and loves to do things well.

Once the project was complete, we were married, and suddenly he stopped bathing and brushing his teeth with any regularity and spent all his time restoring old electronics and wouldn’t speak for days on end even though he insisted there was nothing wrong.

MN at the time told me he was depressed and I must support him.

He wasn’t depressed - this was his baseline. When he’s actually depressed he goes into obsessive, ruminative, catastrophising spirals and develops whole body aches and terrible fevers and literally can’t get out of bed.

He does mean well. But no, it doesn’t feel like a partnership much of the time, it feels like I am his carer - though he would be horrified to know I think of it this way, as he has very little insight into how his experience and functioning differs from other people’s.

No didn't miss that either.

Yes, I read the thread, did you not read my answers?

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

My dd was diagnosed by a pyschologist, psychiatrist and speech therapist.
No mental health nurse ever involved.

And….(I’m not sure what you are saying?)

No mental health nurse involved at any point. Normal procedure for our very large city.

Only nurses in the department were neuro disability nurses.

ND is not a mental health issue. So why would a mental health nurse be involved in diagnosis?