Niece is gay - AIBU

[Livpool]

My brother has just text to say niece has just come out as a lesbian. I said fab as no woman would choose to be straight. Then checked she wasn’t upset etc. and all happy. He joked she wanted a card to at ‘yay’ and I said I would oblige.

I am out with a friend so mentioned it and she (straight woman FYI) said I am not taking it seriously and need to act like an adult about it.

YABU - she so right, you are being silly and ride
YANBu - you’re friend is ridiculous

My eldest told me he was gay at 15. And it absolutely was a big deal. If it wasn’t, he wouldn’t have spent months working up the courage to tell us - even though he had no reason to think we would have a problem with it. He has a boyfriend and they have been harassed in the street, even when not holding hands or doing anything that identifies them as a couple. DS1 has a very alternative style of dress and gets called homophobic names by complete strangers fairly frequently. I worry about him because there are definitely some people roaming around looking for trouble.

You sound as though you have a great relationship with your niece OP and it’s fabulous that she has such a supportive family.

Does sound a little cringe

Fair enough

@Livpool I think my point is, if a close young relative's sexuality is gay/lesbian/bi, then you should 'care' (though I appreciate you may have meant you don't mind), as in care enough to know that's a potential vulnerability for them - albeit way less than it was in the past in this country - and maybe feel just a bit more protective of them.

Not just because of potential discrimination, but also because they could be more susceptible to thinking or being told that they're actually trans - which comes with its own risks and vulnerabilities and hassle - and because their privacy gets invaded a bit more.

It is of course easy to make a joke along the lines you did when the person is a lesbian, but you wouldn't have been easily able to joke in a such cutesy/facetiously (to use your word) way if your niece was a nephew coming out, and that may be what made your friend a bit uncomfortable deep down.

My cousin came out as gay to me. It had taken her a whole year to tell me and we are extremely close as well. And she built it up as this big thing to tell me and then I was like 'oh ok' which I think was good but also confusing for her as she had built it up to be such a big conversation. So I think if it is a big event to the person close to you to tell you then acknowledging that it is big for them with a card or whatever is supportive. Same as 'I'm pregnant, yay'.

when my dd told me she was dating a women, I was genuinely happy for her. Like your niece, she is very secure in her own skin, and her gf is lovely.
I do understand that it can be a bigger thing to other people. My dd has another friend who is a lesbian who can't tell her family, and some male gay friends who seem to attract a lot more homophobic abuse that she and her partner do.
My dd also says it was easier for her (she is bi) as she never had the angst of feeling "different " at a young age, as she believed she was straight. She appreciates that it is much easier to suddenly realise in your late teens/ 20s that you are in love with a woman than to know from an early age that you are "different"
So i guess what I'm trying to say is that every "coming out" is different. No card here from me, but hopefully she feels total acceptance. But it sounds like your dn would appreciate the card (and probably the joke) so why not?!!

I've said the same thing to lesbian family members of mine, who agree wholeheartedly! Some of my straight female friends have said it too, and we've all laughed and agreed - the happily partnered ones, the single ones, and especially the ones with useless husbands.

Even my (very lovely, not-useless) husband agrees, knowing the calibre of many men, and doesn't take offence at the statement at all.

So don't apologise for the truth 😂 I think your reaction to your niece coming out is perfectly fine!

If a male teenage family member of mine 'came out' as gay, the joke would definitely be made at some point: 'Well, at least we know he won't be getting anyone pregnant!' As well as any other good-natured jokes that people could think of - so it definitely can be done for a nephew as well as a niece!

In families where sexuality isn't an issue at all, and the general dynamics are quite 'jokey', then having a laugh about something isn't a big deal, as long as the people are also supportive.

Don’t really get the point of the post

I think your friend means say “my niece is a lesbian, in all seriousness.”

One mustn’t smile or laugh when discussing lesbianism. Lesbians are a very important topic and are very serious business and are not to be taken lightly whatsoever.

Yes, quite serious, frankly, very serious people, lesbians are - no laughing matter ever.

lol

I was obviously talking about comparable jokes, not just jokes.

Joking about knowing a boy won't be getting anyone pregnant is very different from saying "fab as no woman would choose to be straight". The first comment isn't making a joke about an entire sex. Not that I personally have a problem with the OP making that joke, it's a flippant comment, but it comes from a certain context and some stereoptypes and is a well-trodden phrase.

Do you seriously think there's a comparable number of heterosexual men who would say, on being told their nephew was gay, "fab as no man would choose to be straight"? Of course there isn't, for several reasons.

And until a male teenage family member of yours came out, you don't actually know how you'd react.

The fact you’re posting tells me that it is a big deal for you & whether straight or gay, it really shouldn’t be an issue at all.

I long to live in a world where it is just normal to accept other people for who they are & not have to send cards or make proclamations about it.

@ABoldSubmission "Joking about knowing a boy won't be getting anyone pregnant is very different from saying "fab as no woman would choose to be straight". The first comment isn't making a joke about an entire sex."

Well, no, it's implying that all straight teenage boys are liable to get girls pregnant...so making a joke about an entire sex. And it's in the same vein - a flippant joke about a humorous stereotype, which may or may not apply.

"Do you seriously think there's a comparable number of heterosexual men who would say, on being told their nephew was gay, "fab as no man would choose to be straight"?"

No, because men benefit far more from having a romantic female partner in their life than women do in having a romantic male partner. After all, married men live longer, happier lives, while married women live unhappier, shorter lives. Straight women are the ones falling in love with the demographic that oppresses them, while men are falling in love with the demographic they (as a group, not necessarily personally) oppress. Very different dynamics. So men are generally very happy to be straight.

Although I've known several straight men who joke that it must be grand being gay, as from their perspective it seems like there's a lot less faff around sex and relationships. And many straight men I know agree that they can see why straight women wouldn't choose to be straight, as so many men are useless/dickheads.

And I know how I reacted when my lesbian family member came out - I really can't imagine I'd be any different with a gay male family member!

I'm not sure what you're so offended by?

Being a parent of a gay child can be difficult to navigate initially. It can be difficult to express that sexuality is a non-issue when for them it might have been extremely difficult. To express that their struggles matter while you don't care abut their actual sexual preference can be a difficult balancing act at the start.

Maybe look up stonewall and get educated. Or if you're in the UK look up all the sht the trans community are getting .

It's important LGBTQ kids know they are accepted and cherished.

@OtterlyAstounding I'm not offended, but I think you're being obtuse/overly simplistic/naive.

Well, no, it's implying that all straight teenage boys are liable to get girls pregnant...so making a joke about an entire sex.

It's making a joke about teenage boys and their sex class yes, but demonstrably not in the same way as implying that men are awful. And there's a clear comparator - you can joke that a teenage lesbian is "at least not going to get pregnant". Historically teen pregnancy was always predominantly been seen as the girl's problem, not the boy's. (Because, sexism.)

And it's in the same vein - a flippant joke about a humorous stereotype, which may or may not apply. But it's NOT just based on a humorous stereotype, that's the point. There is more than a grain of truth and seriousness in it, and it's not always said as a joke. Men commit more than 95% of all violent crimes. And have been patriarchal and sexist. There's a reason why the concept of political lesbianism was created by some radical feminists.

There's another thread running at the moment where a woman is saying now she's in her 40s she's realised she doesn't really like men (as people, platonically). People are agreeing with her. The sentiment is the same as that in the OP's joke, albeit totally serious.

And I know how I reacted when my lesbian family member came out - I really can't imagine I'd be any different with a gay male family member!

You really can't? Then you are perhaps naive to, or uneducated regarding, some key differences. To be clear, I'm not talking about your public reaction but your private or internal one. And what type of relation you are makes a difference too. I think all family members should be outwardly accepting and supportive - that's just a base level of love and decency IMO- but that doesn't mean that there aren't necessarily some legitimate concerns that may give parents some pause for thought.

Sadly there is so much anger in this country towards minorities. All children should be accepted & cherished for who they are.

@ABoldSubmission To be clear: I'm not sure why the OP making that joke is a negative thing. It's a humorous statement that is funny because it's (sadly) true. Graveyard humour, if you will.

I'm not sure if you're bothered on behalf of men, lesbians, or straight women, but none of the men, lesbians, or straight women (single, happily married, or unhappily married) that I know would be offended by that joke - their reaction by and large would be along the lines of a laugh and a head shake, with a, 'god, isn't that the truth. Fucking men, why can't they be better' type comment, which may or may not lead onto a conversation about feminist issues.

You really can't? Then you are perhaps naive to, or uneducated regarding, some key differences.

Nope. Obviously there are very different concerns regarding sexual health, but when my daughter came out I was quite happy for her (although felt bad that her pool of potential partners was so much smaller), and if my son came out I'd be quite happy for him too (although I'd wonder how I produced two gay children)!

All of my lesbian friends are funny. They don’t take it seriously at all. It’s most annoying.

It was just a jokey comment but even if it wasn't, it doesn't denigrate women who are in relationships with men.

I'm straight. I love and trust my dp. I have good male friends.

But every day, I read stories about women being abused, controlled or murdered by partners or exes; about the rise in violent, degrading porn and how that's distorting young relationships; young girls going to the dr with horrible injuries because they were pressured into anal sex; women at risk of stroke because of sexual strangulation. Only yesterday, there was a very normal looking man up in court for repeatedly drugging and raping his ex wife.

It all made me very relieved when dd realised that she's a lesbian. Statistically, I know that she's far likelier to be safe with her girlfriend than she would be with a boyfriend.

You made light of a very normal situation. As you said straight people don’t have to come out, your db made it a big deal do you lightened it. I think none of it is a big deal!! Also hope the wine was nice

'Well, at least we know he won't be getting anyone pregnant!'

What you’re actually saying is, “If you want to have children it will be an actual nightmare and a group of random strangers get to decide if you’re allowed to have children”.

Because it's a big deal to the person coming out. It's not about you.

Another gay person affirming that straight people come out all the time but people just don't react to it.

This week I've "come out" multiple times simply by mentioning my wife to strangers, colleagues etc. Most of the time I have a bit of a mental tally of who I've told/not and in a certain situations there is a bit of a breath hold to gauge a reaction (because yes even in this day and age there is frequently a reaction)

I'm sure that's something my straight sister wouldn't even be thinking about when telling the delivery man something is for her husband

Absolutely this. I too am in a same-sex marriage with a child. As lovely as it is to see some of these comments from posters of how accepting they would be if their child were to come out, homophobia is unfortunately still rife in the uk. Even my 4 year old has experienced it sadly. She was chatting to a lady in the park the other day ( she loves to chat to anyone) about Christmas and what Santa might bring. She then introduced her 2 mummies to the lady who suddenly couldn’t get away from us fast enough (maybe she thought she would catch our gayness?). This isn’t the first time this has happened. Fortunately my daughter is too young to realise at present but soon she will be all too aware and that makes me feel really sad.