AIBU or is my DD - bedroom privacy

[Settingstory]

I have 2 DD’s in their 20’s and I am very happy to have them still living at home while they save up for the future. I’m lucky we can afford to offer this to them, they don’t pay any rent with the intention they are saving this for their future. They both work full time.

Backstory is I was a single mum to them their whole childhood, just us 3 living together and when they became adults I met someone and we got married he’s a great supportive stepdad to my girls. He is also fine with the principal of them not paying rent as we are in a good position financially and times are tough out there.

The deal with no rent is they are expected to keep their own room clean and tidy and not make mess in the main house. The girls can eat any of the food in the house if they want to.

My oldest DD1 is neurodiverse (AuADHD) she makes no mess in the main house and she keeps her room fairly clean and tidy because ‘that was the deal’. She says she appreciates she has a very good deal and I don’t go into her room for any reason. She often buys her own food, she’s respectful and always asks politely to use the washing machine, things like that.

You can probably guess where this is going. My DD2 is the complete opposite and it’s causing arguments. I’ve tried giving her the benefit of the doubt but I think she is mostly just lazy.

Her room is awful and I am often having to go in there when she’s out to turn off all the lights/TV she leaves on (I’m paying the bills and these appliances get hot)

take the glasses and plates down (so many of them) and retrieve the 10 bath towels she has taken to use (and we have none clean left).

There is always a full up bin and rubbish/food all over the floor, and that’s if you can even get into the door from the 7 to 8 loads of laundry all over the place blocking the door.

She leaves her shoes all over the hallway, never loads the dishwasher after she cooks.

It’s all kicked off in a ridiculous way of DD2 yelling ‘respect my privacy’ (South Park style) when I’ve been in her room yet again to retrieve 12 glasses, 7 plates, 5 towels and turn the TV off.

I’m asking DD2 just to do these things herself, nothing more and we now have a standoff apparently where she says she doesn’t feel like her own person and I am helicopter parenting and she wants to install a lock! I’ve said absolutely no way she is having a lock on the door, the room is a fire hazard. She has even offered to pay rent just so I have ‘nothing to hold over her’.

I did explain I have better things to do in life than sort out another adults mess so if she could keep it tidy, I would have NO reason to go in there.

AIBU? I do go in her room even though she asks me not to! But I think I have good reason!

I think she's a slob. And a lot of this smacks of entitlement.

However, some of the language of your original post is a bit weird. Asking to use the washing machine? They've always lived with you. It's their home. Surely they just treat it as their home? If anything, your husband is the interloper and should be on his manners?

But yes, if she can't live by your rules at her age, she needs to move out. But I wouldn't lay the rules down just for her. I'd make them rules for both of them (of course your other daughter already complies but...). Clean room. No food left in the room. No appliances left of. Sheets changed weekly. Either abide by these very standard, everyday, rules or move out. You can be upfront and say it isn't about money. It's about YOUR home being kept the way you want it to be. If she wants to employ a cleaner to do it for her (she can afford rent so why not a cleaner?), fine.

This is why moving into adult life and living independently is so important! Of course some young people.still manage to transition to being responsible without that...but she is stuck in a dynamic of being a child here.

If she moved out she would learn quickly the real consequences...ie. plates are dirty....only person who will wash them is her !

Disgusting sheets ? A friend or partner will notice and comment with disgusting

I agree you cant and shouldn't ignore a filthy room like this as it involves your household running properly with plates towels.

But this is keeping her in a ridiculous dynamic

Tell her she will be a lot happier living independently and help her pack !

Yanbu. Time for her to get her own place.

She will have saved enough for a rental deposit now. You've tried being lovely & supportive, now she needs to learn the hard way.

Agree.

This isn't about paying rent - it's about being considerate of the other people who also live there. A condition of living in the house is to keep her room clean and hygienic. If she's not willing to do that then she needs to move out.

If she moves out, it might be the rude awakening she needs. I doubt that she'll find many housemates who would be happy living with someone whose bedroom is so rank it makes the whole place smell. So she'd have them nagging her about cleaning and be paying rent to boot.

My dd is the same age and is really messy. I charge her rent, not just because I can’t afford to support her but because that’s how it works in the real world, she uses electric, gas and eats food, she’s an adult and needs to pay for those things, it’s still considerably cheeper than her moving out and renting somewhere. I don’t go in her room often, I don’t tidy it, it’s often a mess and the bins often full. My dd is also autistic and possibly ADHD, she is pretty lazy and a slob but now she’s an adult I refuse to spend my time nagging her or getting stressed about her life style.

You need to either charge her rent (if you are then happy to leave her to it) or if you can't tolerate the mess you ask her to move out. But no, you shouldn't go in her room, everyone is entitled to privacy.

I have two young adults living with me.

I have been in this dilemma too with one of them who is ND and has been kicked out by a relative.

I've really pushed him to keep room clean and tidy.

My main motivation to keep going with this gruelling daily grind of asking him (and not just shutting the door on the mess) is I don't want him growing up to be a useless, unhelpful, dirty partner to someone one day.
Plus I genuinely believe living in squalor is not good for MH. - mine or his.

If I were you I would explain one more time how it has to be or she can move out. And until she moves out take money off her for cleaning. You are 100% in the right - be firm and don't budge - think of her future and being a mother herself maybe one day if you ever think you shouldn't be pushing her.

dd2 isn't keeping to her side of the deal - do neither do you

start charge £30 a week and get a cleaner

This. Tell her to go. I don’t agree with no rent either. Charge them £700 a month minimum you can always gift it back to them as a moving in present. We started charged rent and there were massive objections we pointed out he was paying no rent, no bills, no food etc and he actually let it slip he had over £50,000 in savings. We introduced an immediate rent of £500 a month and that rose to £750.

We’ve been here and honestly it doesn’t do them any favours.

Our eldest only sorted himself out when he had to pay. He has his own place now.

We had words a few years ago as whenever we went out as a family - he never paid, never even got drinks - he was just entitled. Eg went out for a family meal he didn’t even offer to get drinks but middle child at uni paid for a round of drinks and paid for her own meal. She insisted vocally as she was fed up with ‘the sponge’ as she called him.

We called it out for what it was. He keeps suggesting trips out etc and I’m like ok 👌 nice you book it for everyone - as this is what we would do and then he would pay nothing. I remember one day we paid for a day out that he wanted, got the tickets, did the pack lunch and ice creams etc and he had the nerve at 25 to complain at the price of the guide book and kept banging on about it and about how ‘I paid for the guide book for everyone’ I - totally lost my shit. Sometimes when adult talking doesn’t work you have to hit them where it hurts - in their wallet.

I do not think it does them any favours.

Get her downstairs and tell her she is out - tell her warnings have fallen on deaf ears and she has a new year and a new start as a lodger somewhere else as you are black sacking her room and do it. Tough love.

Yeah no there is no way under any circumstances this is acceptable behaviour she stops or leaves and i would say this to any child i had if they were like this

I wouldnt charge rent either, but rent or not still not acceptable at all

Well the loss of privacy is currently the only price she pays for not sticking to the deal.

Ultimately, the deal isn't working in her case (she isn't sticking to it), and I agree with PPs that she needs to move out. Letting her stay is not doing her any favours long term.

But the grind of monitoring it and the stress etc the mental load - he is still not learning. It didn’t matter how many times we told the eldest to put the tea bag in the compost bin and not create a pile on the side of the sink that went mouldy - he didn’t.

Just like a toddler they have to learn words have consequences.

The partner this young adult you have living with you will need to be is someone who has to ask daily and that can’t happen. Neither can they paid their partner to clean up either.

Our only learnt after major shit losing and charging him eg £700 local rate look at what a local room without food costs.

Ours was horrified that a local lodger without food was £1000 a month we charged £700 and he got food for that. But I stopped being gentle gentle with tea bags on the side and lost my shit and DH told him rent was now going to be £750 and so on ….

We have a generation of incapable adulting adults who don’t appreciate the value of anything.

@Slightyamusedandsilly we have a new house. We don’t live in their childhood home anymore, we live in DH’s and I joint house now. So it is a bit different and feels less like their home because they moved into it as adults and their stepdad is part owner. They have only known him as adults not as children

You're not being unreasonable at all. DD2 is being extremely unreasonable. It's your house; you (and your husband) have overall responsibility for the house itself and the household. There are times when you may have to go into any of the rooms - what if there's a fire? The roof leaks? Police arrive with a search warrant? You get the idea. This wouldn't change if DD pays rent. A commercial landlord would reserve those rights too. And of course she can't put a lock on the door and not give you a key! She's simply not being realistic.

You've offered her the same deal her sister has: follow the house rules and we won't go into your room unless it's absolutely necessary. You've made it clear that you PREFER that option. And she still won't do the work. Personally I would not be doing it for her, it would be 'keep a basic level of safety and hygiene or get your own place', but regardless it's simply not possible for her to have what she seems to want while living in a house she doesn't own.

I had an adult SD like this. Grim and you have my sympathies OP.
My SD had no respect at all for our house or belongings, because she was living there rent free - when she moved out and had to pay her own way she got a little bit better (her house is minging though).

As someone with an ‘Eric Cartman’ brother living at home in his 30’s, just don’t do any of it. Don’t collect glasses, don’t collect towels. There may well be some ADHD/neurodiversity in there somewhere but, ultimately, she knows you are always going to give in and sort the problem for her.

She’s Fuming I sort it and currently not talking to me. She wants me to leave it and not get involved.

I have ADHD and was exactly the same!

As the parent of 2 ND children - the second one missed until later because we were focused on the considerable MH of the eldest - I’d say DD2 is definitely ND.

That is, however, no excuse. I think asking her to leave is your only answer (but say she can come back anytime if she wants to observe the rules). For my eldest going to uni and having shared accommodation actually made her realise how bad she was (she was as awful as your DD re her room) as there is nothing more mortifying that being called out as a filthy slob by near strangers in a flat share environment. She loves coming home now and is very very respectful if the house rules - she brings down cups plates etc every time she comes downstairs etc.

I think you have to (depending on her age) say that she has one month to buck up her ideas or move out by March.

So tired of every single bad behaviour being excused as 'ND' on mumsnet 😭

The fact she’s annoyed you’ve sorted it out for her adds a cherry on top of the immaturity cake.
If it was my DD, she’d be getting told very firmly that if she can’t abide by the house rules (which are extremely normal and essential for health) she may be happier living alone.
Scruffy, lazy & unsanitary behaviour isn’t something I could abide.

Yanbu AT ALL

She expects you to respect her privacy but she’s not showing you any respect at all in return. Point this out to her.

You need to lay down some non-negotiable rules eg no plates etc left in room/ lights and appliances always turned off/ bin emptied every week/ etc etc. If the rules are not kept to then she moves out or pays you market rate rent. Her choice to stick to the rules or take the consequences. Make sure you stick to it or the rules will be meaningless.

Whilst I understand her wish for privacy, this young woman is living in somebody else's house, so she needs to live within their rules.
Give her 3 months' notice to move out, OP.

"I'd love to respect your privacy DD. But as long as you continue to keep the things we all need in your room, like towels and glasses, and cost me money by not turning electrical things off, I can't.
So if you want me to respect what you want, then you need to respect what I need."

So what should she do when there are no glasses and towels left for everyone else? Buy more??

No, she needs to go. Sharing a house as adults comes with adult obligations. She's not learning those while she lives with mummy so it's time to send her on her way for her own good.