To think budgeting culture has become joyless?

[ByNattyFinch]

Budgets are good.
Financial literacy is good.

But AIBU to think some people treat buying a hot drink like a moral failure? Life shouldn’t feel like a spreadsheet.

Fine to not budget every pound if you can afford to not budget every pound. Necessary to do so if you don't have spare cash for coffees. Don't think it is nice to look down on people with less money than you who are being sensible.

It's not a moral failure but it's a waste of money and it adds up quickly. When a hot drink stopped being an occasional social event and became my every time I left the house I realised I had a problem in the same way alcoholics do and it drained my finances.

Really depends on how much money you have, doesn’t it!

If you can afford a coffee and still have enough money to pay the bills, fine. If you are short of cash or going into debt, there are usually better things to spend your money on than a £5 coffee every day.

I know what you mean OP.
Not judging people who don't have money, not even people who siply don't buy them but the people who do "omg. I would never buy a hot drink! How wasteful of you! I could never waste like that. Tsk tsk" dramatic types.

I agree that if you can afford an occasional splurge budgeting shouldn't become an end in itself. But it is ridiculous that a coffee is now £5, and having one a day can cost you the equivalent of (or more than) your monthly gas bill!

Has budgeting ever been a joy??

It's something one does out of necessity, not for fun. If I'm budgeting for a hot drink it means I'm fucking brassic and I haven't got a choice.

there are many reasons to despise coffees out and budget implications are only one

I agree that budgeting out of necessity, especially when money is tight, is stressful and not joyful at all. What I was getting at is slightly different: more the cultural tone around budgeting where even people who aren’t brassic frame small, ordinary pleasures as moral failures, rather than as trade-offs or choices.

Budgeting because you have to survive is one thing. Turning every hot drink or small joy into a character judgement feels like something else to me.

You do you OP, I'll do me. I enjoy keeping a budget and we're a pretty high income high savings household. A couple of years ago we made a conscious decision to cut back on frivolous local spending so that we could increase our holiday budget, and it's been great. We've had some fabulous trips with the kids that we'll remember for a lifetime. When I realised we were spending a couple of hundred pounds a month on coffees/lunches/takeaways it made me question whether that was really what we wanted to spend it on, and we decided it wasn't. It's never been a question of whether we could afford it, but about how to get the most enjoyment and value out of our money. The only way to make this change was to track spending. This had had the knock on effect of me being able to plan finances throughout the year, as I know where the natural peaks and troughs are.
For what it's worth, I would never want my budgeting to affect us socially, so I'd never turn down the invite to meet a friend for coffee or a drink out and I don't discuss my budgeting habits with others.

I think people can become obsessive / addicted to saving, as much as others become obsessive / addicted to spending…!

It’s a fine balance between ‘enjoy life, you might drop dead tomorrow’ and ‘save for the future’. I think most of us struggle to find a sensible equilibrium.

I said hot drink, not coffee.

You don’t want your life to feel like a spreadsheet. I can put £2,000 a month in savings towards my dream house because, in part, I don’t buy overpriced coffee or food when I’m out. It’s ok to have different priorities - and I used to spend money on shit like hot drinks too. Then I discovered the magic of a thermos and not spending £20 a week (£1040 a year) just on coffee.

Nobody should look down their nose at you for buying a hot drink

Equally if someone chooses not to for budget (or other) reasons, you shouldn’t judge them, or see it as an inherent criticism of you.

Basically you choose, buy or don’t buy and let others do the same.

I think this aswell . If you’ve ever read any of the Fire forums it’s become a religion for some , totally obsessive even to the tune of limiting toilet paper .

I think because hot drinks are expensive and rushed they have become a default, mindless ritual rather than a special treat or event by itself, instead it's something extra on the day out and extras add up.

A £3.50 cup of coffee just ten times a month is £35 that is £420 a year on mindless often disappointing coffee while we multitask, coffee that we waited in a queue for and then rushed to drink between errands or destinations.

Cafes want their tables freed and want you to take your drink and leave, there is nothing special anymore in it.

I do agree it's not a moral failure but a foolish way to haemorrage money mindlessly and unnecessarily and we need people to be aware and talk about it because cafes and businesses are always seducing us using clever psychological tricks that target our weaknesses: bad time management, bad diet causing energy crash,bad fitness so tired and need a pick me up,bad sleep hygiene...etc and we need to be better armed and aware, specially if you've worked hard for your money....why should they have it? It's not a question of immediate affordability, it's the principle of it and the bigger picture over a month, or year.

So what if they do? Everyone is a bit judgemental over certain things. I honestly couldn’t give two hoots what a random person thought over my hot drinks purchases. Just live your own life!!

Depends how you do it. We budget £800 amount a month for food and fuel and then each have £200 a month to spend on whatever we want. We don't have to look at every little item as long as the overall figure lines up with what you can afford/budget

I think budgeting and not being able to afford things has always been joyless. The difference is that most people never really felt that they had to budget for a coffee, they would just make these micro-purchases mindlessly and they would be a little treat that would bring joy to the day. Now where a coffee is in in some places breaking a fiver, there are fewer and fewer guilt free treat purchases people feel they can enjoy.

Every item and transaction becomes something you need to rationalise or account for. There is no relief.

I think it's just a matter of how much wiggle room you have. I've had times where budgeting to buy hot drinks/sandwiches out at a cafe would have been unmanageable. I've had other times when I could spontaneously go out for dinner and not have to worry about it.

It's really hard work having to budget every penny, and it is joyless. But in those times, joy has to come from something that's not consumer capitalism. I still feel that getting a coffee out is a real treat. But my DC are used to being able to get a hot chocolate whenever they want. I don't think they get half as much joy from it as I did.

I agree there are some people who make a hobby out of budgeting and perhaps get a bit obsessive over it.

But so what? it’s not hurting anyone as long as they aren’t judgy about others who are not following the same path, indeed it’s good for the world to have people who deliberately consume less.

Some people get joy from spreadsheets 🤷‍♀️ especially spreadsheets that show their savings going up and their retirement age coming down

Coffee tea hot chocolate hot milk hot squash apologies this it’s is incomplete

if someone is complaining they are short of cash for a pint of milk and spending money on none essentials then I will judge ( looking closely at BIL)

if someone is judging me because I tend not to buy hot or cold drinks out and about i will tend to judge them back

if you don’t want to be judged don’t judge others
and learn to ignore pointless judgement from others

You would hate us - we have a spreadsheet with a budget for everything from stationery to holidays. Managing finances is important to us regardless of our income.

I think this is just because of how expensive hot drinks are when out now. They used to be £1 which was a big mark up on home (maybe 2p) but still cheap and cheerful.

Now a drink is £4-5+…. That just feels like a complete waste of money because it is not worth that amount. It just seems like chucking money down the sink.

I love my spreadsheet. I hate wasting money and I get pleasure seeing my retirement pot growing.

If I fancied a posh coffee/hot chocolate from costa I'd buy it, my spreadsheet/budget wouldn't stop me but it isn't something I often do. If there was a larger purchase that my budget couldn't accommodate, then that would stop me.

I was in a lot of debt when I was younger, took me years to pay it off. I vowed never to go back there. My budget keeps me sane.

I must say it's more joyful seeing a healthy bank balance and a cup of coffee drunk at home in peace where you don't have to dodge crowds one handedly or be in a noisy clackering, screeching cafe playing some awful music. 😁😁