Disaster with Autism and Secondary School

[StressedSENmum]

DS is 11, currently looking at Secondary School options. He is very intelligent, loves learning and is currently above average in school assessments. He has a diagnosis of ASD and ADHD, and is starting to struggle with the demands of Year 6 (mainly with the work load and less down time). He does not have an EHCP, I’ve enquired repeatedly about whether he warrants one and been told he doesn’t come anywhere close to reaching the 12 hours a week threshold for extra support.

Our local Secondary School is 1,800 students, I feel this is too big for him and he will struggle with the transitions, teachers won’t know his needs, too many kids etc. His teachers also agree and think he needs a much smaller setting which can only be achieved at a private school. We can afford private school - just - but it will mean huge lifestyle changes for the next 5 years, zero savings, holidays etc. My husband thinks we need to give the massive secondary school a chance but I think it’s doomed for failure and will effect his self-esteem negatively.

It’s also worth mentioning that I work with autistic and neurodiverse teenagers and I see so many of them struggling at school, burning out and being home schooled or not having any education as a result. I also hear mostly negative stories about autistic teenagers in mainstream secondary schools, and even ones who’ve gone to private struggle (albeit less).

Has anyone got a positive story or any advice?

If you want to explore the possibility of an EHCP than you can apply for an EHCNA as his parent. Look on the ipsea website for the letter that you change to your child. If you google your area and EHCNA request then you should get the details of where to send it.

Go and check both svhools out and try to work out what each school isn't good at. No school is perfect. The private school might be very pressured for the kids or not communicate with parents well. The mainstream might be brilliant at adhd and asd help or crap.

Apply for a needs assessment yourself.

Are there other mainstream secondaries that are smaller and that are possibilities?

I don’t think an EHCP will be finalised before September, but having the process in progress will be helpful.

Is this even likely without school supporting it though? What would my grounds be for an EHCP? That I feel he is going to struggle at Secondary School?

The private school is well known for SEN and has lots of similar children.

The mainstream school has very mixed opinions, mostly negative. It seems to be a lottery of whether you will get the support or not and very much depends who your child is streamed with.

There is no legal requirement for a child needing 12 hours support to get an EHCP. The only requirement for an EHCP needs assessment is that a child has or may have special needs, and may need those needs to be met with an ECHP. EHCPs should be forward looking so in the application you can make the case that his school are meeting needs with adjustments now, but that this won't be possible in the secondary school to which he would otherwise attend. If his teachers agree the state school can't meet his needs, I would get that in writing and put the application in yourself ASAP.

You will miss the usual timeline for EHCP placements to be finalized, and you may have to appeal - so there may not be a placement by September - but for the reasons you say, I think it's worth it in the long run. EHCP may also open up placements at smaller state schools, even if they are further away and your DS would normally be outside catchment.

There is no numerical threshold of how much support a child needs to get an EHCP so the school are not being honest. They have to have support needs that are additional to and different from what can reasonably be provided in school.

I have a 14 year old with ASD and ADHD, now in year 9. She has had two significant periods of EBSA due to her school not supporting her adequately as well as the chaotic noisy environment.

I absolutely would have sent her to a small private school if I could have afforded it

I agree you need to apply for an EHCP, without one your DS is likely to be a at the bottom of the list when it comes to getting any support.

Have you spoken to the private school you like? There’s one near me that got a reputation for being good for SEN students- the head wanted to change that and it because quite a hostile environment for the SEN students and their families.

If you don’t think he’ll cope in a massive school, my advice would be don’t try it and see. The negative experience of drowning in an unsuitable environment may set him back too far to recover from. This happened to a relative of mine, now so traumatised that they won’t go near an educational setting of any kind ever again.

The private schools main niche is SEN - there’s lots of competition for private schools around so I doubt they’d survive if they became hostile towards SEN. It’s not a hugely academic school and it’s in an awkward location.

I’m so sorry to hear that, this is my fear.

My autistic DS (15) is thriving in a massive (9 form) state secondary school. He is very bright and eager to learn and has made a lovely group of friends. It's a very good school which really pushes DC to succeed, but also has great pastoral care. He's doing GCSEs this year and on track to do very well - he wants to stay on at the school for 6th form.

When he was in year 6 I could never have anticipated this. I was so worried about the transition. We couldn't comfortably afford private so this was not an option for us, but we did move house so that the school he is at now was our 'closest school'.

Does the secondary have a SEN department you can meet with? I assume your son has a SEN Support plan or similar? My 12yo has autism and dyspraxia but no EHCP (we were declined and are currently appealing). I met with the secondary SEN lead before the transition to discuss his needs and he has been really well supported so far. Its a big school and I was SO anxious about how he would cope but hes done really well.
FYI the 12 hour threshold isnt a thing - not sure what your school are talking about with that. I recommend taking some time to read through the EHCP process in detail and submitting a needs assessment. If school are saying he wouldnt cope in a big mainstream secondary they must recognise he has fairly significant needs so I am surprised they wouldn't support an ehcp application

If you think you can ‘just’ afford private school, you can’t afford it. The fees go up by 10-20% every year - do your wages do the same?

It would be infinitely more damaging to your son to be pulled out of his lovely, supportive, small class size private school and put straight into the massive state school, than just to go to the state school from the start.

I moved my asd child from state secondary to mainstream private. Totally life changing. They’re socially awkward and were picked on endlessly in the state school. Physical attacks that the school weren’t interested in addressing.

Private school the children are just so much better behaved. Respectful to each other and the teachers. The teachers have so much more control over behaviour. It was the ruckus that upset my child. Just no warning of when a child might start screeching or throwing things. Rowdy corridors. Teachers not being able to bring calm to the school, and not really being bothered to address our concerns.

Private schools are skint and need every child they can get. SEN children like yours make up about 1/3rd of my child’s normal, mainstream school. Private schools know they need to have a calm environment, they need to address parents concerns immediately, they need to communicate well with parents and they need a strong pastoral department.

We scrape the money together but would sooner move house than move our child. It’s hard when the other non-ASD kids are suffering a bit in state, but they appreciate that their sibling was really suffering. Self harming and school refusing. If we did both lose our jobs we could have the fees paid by relatives (who are shocked by how much the change in school has helped).

Good luck OP. It’s a terrible position to be in. All schools should be as good as private.

If you have any reservations about the big secondary school don’t send him there, particularly without support. Apply for an ehcp NOW. It’s not unusual for private schools to be paid for in this way.

My son was transferred to secondary school with no support. I believed the primary when they told me “he’ll be fine”. He was not fine, it was a disaster from day one. The school knew they were the wrong setting for him by the end of the first week!

We weren’t able to get him moved until midway through year 9!

All schools should be as good as private.

That’s not exactly possible when the fundamental difference between the two is that private schools don’t have to take the problem children who pick on vulnerable kids like your DC and the OP’s.

My experience of a large secondary of 1200 is that there are enough SEN kids to form a hub where they spend part of each day and lessons are individually targetted. For instance basic arithmetic instead of maths if they struggle with a subject. Mainstream for subjects they’re fine in.

Also plenty of emphasis on social situations, nuances, personal development. An extra period of football one term, another of establishing planters around the local community.

The school comes down hard on any bullying, being both protective and strict.

Some of this was put in place during the final year of primary, and involved an enhanced transition. He’s in third year now, and says he loves it.

Agreed. I don’t think any child should have to put up with physical assault. Kids that hurt others need to be removed from mainstream immediately.

Sadly not. Mainstream schools are underfunded and not at all flexible, even for small things. Mine ended up in an online private school and is much happier. She is hoping to get the minimum 5 GCSEs she needs to move on to 6th form college and wants to attend a brick and mortar college.

My academically able ASD child went from getting As to Cs to straight extremely high As across the board at private school. It’s the environment giving them the peace they need to really focus that makes the difference.

If your school SENCO seriously think there's an 8 hours a week threshold for needing an EHCP, they badly need retraining. As has been pointed out, initially you are only asking for an assessment, and all you need to demonstrate for that is that your child may have SEN and may need support through an EHCP. The threshold for needing an EHCP is whether the child needs help over and above what is normally available through normal mainstream resources. It is not just based on academic issues; they have to take into account also communication (including social communication), sensory and physical (which includes things like sensory sensitivity to noise, fabrics, foods, bright lights etc), and social, emotional and mental health.

Some local authorities refuse assessment almost routinely, but appealing against refusal to assess is quite easy and 98% of appeals are won by parents. Even if you don't get an EHCP, you may find it beneficial for your child to have a proper assessment.

Some pp are saying private schools are "skint."

If so, could you negotiate the fees with them? Could the local authority help with the fees, as he won't be taking a main stream place?

My son is 11 and started secondary school in September. He has been on the ASD pathway since the dawn of time (it feels), so does not have an EHCP.
There were 4 local secondary schools to pick from, and we were lucky that he got his first choice. There are only 800 pupils in the entire school. There is a SENCO, but I mainly discuss things with his form tutor. They are very understanding, and although there are some things they can't offer him without an EHCP, they give him the support they can. He still struggles, but he is doing well.
I really don't think he would have faired as well in another school.

If I were you, and had the option to put him in the private school, I would do that. It's too much of a risk to his well being and future to try the local school.

You can always apply for an EHCP yourself.