Does Anyone know what a birthing person is ?

[Teacupover5]

Listening to Nicky Campbell on 5 live this morning 9-10 minutes in if anyone wants to listen again .Guest is discussing investigation into declining standards in maternity services .
Refers to women and birthing people being let down .
AIBU to not understand what a birthing person is ,and to wonder if this focus on inclusivity has had an impact on declining care for women ?

It is obviously someone who ‘feels’ pregnant and then someone who goes through the ’feeling’ of giving birth. Bigot. 😁

Females are the only sex capable of giving birth. Feelings or ‘polite words’ don’t change this.

Exactly. And trying to pretend he wasn’t a man is just nonsense.

I used to support a charity for new Mums. They’ve gone all “and birthing people” nonsense too, so I’ve withdrawn my monthly donation and put it to the animal shelter instead. At least they know which puppies are male or female.

I've just been at the hospital with my male partner for his CT scan, He had to fill a form out beforehand. One page was to select which option you are that would mean you are not pregnant/highly unlikely to be, just tick the box that applies to you. All options were pretty much types of contraceptives, the only one that applied to him as a man was - I was born male and have not had surgery to allow me to bear children.

We were both confused by this and couldn't work out if we were totally missing something 🤷🏻‍♀️

They have disordered projections about the word "woman" such that they are convinced "woman" requires personality traits they do not have.

It is a sexist, offensive way of thinking that allows a small group of people with disordered ideas about sex to redefine the word woman in a way that demeans all women (including thrmselves). We should no more be accomodating this ideology than we would accomodate disordered ideas about what types of personality "align" to skin colour.

It’s very hard to engage some people in maternity care but for those people, it’s even more important that they do access it. An example is pregnant people who smoke. We ALL know that smoking during pregnancy is bad for the baby but midwives are unlikely to stress this point and simply say that trying to cut down is fine. The risk of alienating the pregnant person is too great and their need for midwifery services is greater due to their smoking.

The same would be true of a trans man. It’s possible that due to any hormone treatment he’s had so far means that it’s even more important that they access maternity services and anything that makes them more comfortable to access those services, takes nothing away from others.

What differentiates you from "women"? What traits do "women" have that you do not, and what traits do you have that cannot be found in "women"?

AIBU to not understand what a birthing person is ,and to wonder if this focus on inclusivity has had an impact on declining care for women ?

So you do understand? You claim to not understand but then follow up with a question that includes why they are using this name. So you were just being goady?

I can’t get excited about this. I think replacing sex based language around medical care, particularly maternity care, is confusing and I do find it insulting to my own identity as a woman. But additive language - tacking on the phraseology that transmen or non-binary female sex people prefer - is fine with me. I don’t see it as diluting the meaning of woman = adult female sex person. I see it as pandering to the beliefs of those who think gender identity supercedes sex. And we should pander to those people long enough for them to get the health care they and potentially their babies need. This stuff doesn’t have to be all or nothing all the time. No, transwomen should not be assumed to be the same thing as women for rape crisis centres and prison dormitories. Yes, we should tell transmen they need to get their smear tests and 20 week scans. I’m not a midwife but if I was I would use sex based language with all the pregnant women on my books as standard and only use the gender neutral terms when a patient asked or I’d check that’s then patient’s preference if an obvious transman came in for care. It wouldn’t affect my own beliefs, knowledge and experience about sex and gender but would presumably be appreciated by the patient which would lead to better engagement and quite likely better outcomes for the ´birthing parent’ and baby in question.

When I am in a group of women, I feel like an alien. If someone was to tell
you “you’re a man”, that response you’d have is what I feel if someone says “you’re a woman”. It’s an uncomfortable and sometimes alienating place to be for me, but I can’t change it as it is not a choice.

I sometimes wear a chest binder and have my hair shaved. I wear trouser suits, shirts and bow ties to work. Of course anyone can wear whatever they like, but I am deliberating choosing this as a means of gender expression.

If you aren't a woman you can't give birth. A 'transman' is a woman however much she modifies her body and changes her pronouns. That is why 'transmen' can give birth and men can't. Interesting how distorted the language has to become in order to cater to the fantasy that there is no connection between the act of giving birth and being female.

I insisted that all the medical staff address me as Your Ladyship during the birth of my 2 children, made me feel safe and heard.

Deaf and hearing-impaired women demonstrably have worse birth outcomes that hearing women. 80 non-English-speaking mothers or their babies have died or suffered long-term health issues in the past 5 years due to a lack of interpreting services. How about the NHS putting some effort into that?

Is it a doula?

I can see why a woman who doesn't want to be a woman would feel more comfortable with her HCP avoiding language that affirmed her womanhood. The comfort of a woman giving birth is of paramount importance, so think the use of her preferred language may be necessary to ensure that.
What I don't agree with is bringing language into the mainstream that suggests this is an ordinary everyday situation when it comes to giving birth. The impact on the psychological wellbeing of a woman giving birth, and the child born to her, when that woman can't even bare to have her femaleness recognised can only be guessed at, and mothers and children in such cases should be treated as exceptional and red flags for support. The casual dropping of 'birthing person' on day time TV sends the message that this is perfectly ordinary, nothing to see here state of affairs. When it's really not.

If you're a human and can give birth, yes, you are a woman (as opposed to a sow, cow, doe, jenny, mare, bitch, queen or jill, for example)

Your gender expression and your sex are not the same.

I used to think Birthing Parent was a mistype for Birthing Partner, like a doula or similar supporter.

AFAB, biologically female, but not a woman.

It is a sexist, offensive way of thinking that allows a small group of people with disordered ideas about sex to redefine the word woman in a way that demeans all women (including thrmselves). We should no more be accomodating this ideology than we would accomodate disordered ideas about what types of personality "align" to skin colour.

This is so true.

It harms ALL women.

Your sex was observed at birth and remains the same now, which is the reason you are able to get pregnant and have a baby.

It is your choice to reject womanhood but what you can't do is to compel others to believe that you are a man or that you are not a woman.

I am non-binary and I haven’t met a single person in real life who has had any problem with that. No persuasion or compelling needed. I’m sure I am lucky in this regard.

If a trans man or non binary person gives birth, do they then become the Dad or the.. what? Non- Mum?
That’s got to be a head fuck for the kid, surely??

So a woman then

On the birth certificate they will be the mother. There was a case about this and mother is a legal term and the birth certificate belongs to the child rather thsn parents.

I think "women and birthing people" is fine. I object to "women" being taken out of the descriptor, but I have no issue with additional terms being added. It's like how we might say "parents and carers" to recognise dc are usually looked after by parents but the term doesn't apply to everyone.

It means woman, as in adult human female.

Language has been skewed, at the expense of women, in order to accommodate the delusions of gender ideology.