To ask for advice on how to handle dm with newborn?

[CountingDownToAutumn]

This will be long so please bare with me.

I’m currently pregnant with my fourth child and as I’m hitting the third trimester I’m starting to get really anxious about the newborn period. Particularly my mother during the newborn period. I see her at least once a week so she can see the children and while I’d say things are generally ok, that also has a lot to do with me not rocking the boat.

The problem is she can be very overbearing, cannot tolerate not having her own way and will fly of the handle or flounce if she doesn’t like something. This is usually manageable but when there’s a newborn it goes to a completely new level! Examples;

Dc1; Would not accept that I did not want her in the room when I gave birth. After months of wearing me down she guilted me into it by saying her best friend’s daughter had her in the room when she had her grandchild and it was a lovely experience for her friend.
Tried to take newborn ds of my ex a couple of minutes after he started having his first hold in the delivery room. When he politely said he’d like a bit longer first she flounced. I called her an hour later just for her to shout at me about how she felt pushed out by ex.
Ds had reflux and before we changed his milk would not sleep and scream for hours. After around 48 hours of nobody getting any sleep I’d finally got him down for an afternoon nap. She called informing me she was on the way with my dad. I begrudgingly agreed but asked her not to pick him up as he needed sleep. She started pouting and disappointedly complaining until I gave in.
Invited various family members over to my house to meet the baby when I wasn’t up to visitors.
And the one that still makes me furious when I think back to it… first proper outing with ds in the pram at a few days old. We got out of the car and immediately she takes the pram off me shouting ‘my pram’ and starts pushing it. I let her do it because I didn’t have the energy for the hassle and think I’ll have a go later. She pushes the pram the entire time. At the last shop I’m paying at the till and as we leave to go back to the car I take the pram. We’ve barely made it outside and yet again she takes it off me shouting ‘my pram’. This time I say I’d like a go now and she flies off the handle, marches ahead of me all while screaming behind at me that ‘she wants the best bits’ and that she ‘won’t be left with just the shit’.

Dc2; The newborn period was a bit more of a blur. The two instances that stand out are her bringing ds1 to visit the baby in hospital. He has ASD and Global developmental delay so was non verbal at the time and needed constant supervision. She got so sidetracked by the baby that she repeatedly ignored him to fuss the baby. This resulted in me panicking as he tried to get in the discarded medical sharps bin. I couldn’t move to get him as I had a catheter.
She put a lot of pressure on me for her to take baby dd for the day at around two weeks old. I’d kept brushing it off hoping she’d get the hint that I wasn’t ready but she’d paint it as me being able to give my undivided attention to ds. Making me feel awful for wanting to refuse. I spent the entire day anxious and miserable.

Dc3; I had needed a large piece of furniture assembled for a while and my dad had agreed to do it. It ended up being that the day he scheduled happened to be the day after she was born. What usually would happen is my mum would drop my dad over and pick him up when he was done as he can be quite slow (likes to make sure a job is done properly). Not this time! She spent nine hours planted on the sofa, only leaving to collect her friend so the friend could also see the baby. She held the baby the entire time, if I so much as tried to have a turn holding her she’d get twitchy and take her back. Dd was very mucus-y after birth and this would come up in feeds. She fed her and this happened. Next feed she originally said she wouldn’t do it as she was nervous only to say ‘actually I want to do it, give her to me’ about five seconds after the bottle hit her mouth. When she eventually left she placed dd in her basket and as she was leaving I went to pick her up. She turned to me and had the nerve to say ‘don’t, she’ll be spoilt and expect it all the time’. So it was ok for her to hold my day old baby all day but heaven forbid I actually want to give her a cuddle! Then I’m spoiling her! I actually took up breastfeeding at that moment because there was a family event a few days later I had to attend and I couldn’t tolerate the thought of my mum holding her the entire time again.

So on to now. Pregnant with dc4. This baby has a different father to my first three. My ex can be quite a meek man. If he does react it will be snide so it often went over my mother’s head. Dp is far more forthright and if he feels someone is pushing his boundaries will be upfront about it. This will not go down well with my mum. He’s already pushing for us to have the first week just ourselves as he/we feel the children will need time to adjust. I brought this up to my mum and she shouted that she ‘just won’t bother then’. My sister has also mentioned people having time just themselves after birth to her in the past and she replied that she wouldn’t listen and would turn up regardless of what we said. My sister also fell out with her on several occasions leading up to the birth of her child and after.

I’m so anxious about this. I don’t want another recently postpartum period of her taking over/being demanding. I don’t know how to get her to understand how she acts has consequences on my mental health. I don’t want to fall out with her, it’s hell but if she goes about this birth the way she has with the previous childrens it will happen regardless because dp wont put up with it!

Keep everything you have where she's threatened you in writing.

She's unhinged and seems to believe that your kids are hers. Explain to the police that she is manipulative and will lie to get what she wants and you're a really in fear of what she will do to your kids if she has access.

How do I know all of this? Because my mother is a narcissist. I cut her out of my life many years ago but she wouldn't take no for an answer. She kept tracking me down and turning up at my work and any new house I moved to. In the end, I called the police on her to stop her from approaching my kids. The police were fantastic and told my Mum that she'd be arrested if she ever contacted me again. She's left me alone ever since. It's been lovely and I'm now no longer afraid of bumping in to her.

You need to block her and protect your children from her.

Her having videos of you arguing with your ex years ago just makes her look unhinged - they wouldn't be relevant in getting her any contact as a grandparent.

She can flounce and pout and huff all she bloody likes. Don’t give in to it! If she shouts “I won’t bother then” you say “good, thank you,” and move on. Don’t give her the satisfaction of begging her to see your side, she won’t care. She wants thins her way and she knows if she is as insufferable as possible she will get them her own way.

Lock the door, phones off, enjoy your newborn bliss. If she turns up don’t answer, she’s been told.

Dont even tell her you’ve gone into labour. Let her find out when you are ready to announce it.

You’ve had four children now, it’s time you step out of your own mother’s shadow and take charge of the situation. Just say no, hold your ground, and don’t bloody give in or get yourself het up because she’s huffing and stropping. It’s not your problem.

I’ve now blocked her everywhere but WhatsApp. The same for my dad. I’ve also messaged my ex to say I’m really concerned and think maybe we should think about reporting to the police together.

She thinks she’s having them for dinner a week Tuesday. She’s as much as told me as long as she gets her way and sees them she’ll leave me alone. I don’t believe her though. I don’t think once a fortnight will be enough for long and then it will just start again.

I’ve been told I’m an awful daughter. That she hopes my children never treat me like I have her. That after what I said about my dad (not agreeing that I grew up in a supportive household and mentioning his aggression) that he nearly had another aneurysm. Apparently he knows he had alcohol and anger problems but it’s fine because it wasn’t a weekly occurrence. That I’m unhinged and have problems. That she can’t remember any of her bad behaviour from the birth of my children but if she did do any of it she’s sorry but she was just an excited grandmother. That shes going to track my dp’s mother down to show her these videos and prove that it’s actually me who’s unhinged. That she doesn’t give a shit about the baby. That dp is controlling because I once mentioned he didn’t like condoms (I don’t like hormonal contraception so we were avoiding the fertile window but neither of us minded having a baby). Apparently because I had told her in the past I didn’t want more children this makes him controlling. I didn’t with my ex… she doesn’t understand things change and why the hell would I discuss family planning with her! He’s controlling because he said my son couldn’t have a computer (I think I’ve explained this earlier in the thread) and because he asked my daughter to not wear shoes on the sofa due to the amount my children seem to cherish accidentally standing in dog poo.

She will never admit to any wrongdoing. She twists it so that I’m wrong. She also conveniently ‘forgets’ any occurrence that makes her look bad.

She sounds completely unhinged, in all honesty you should go NC. However, if this isn't what you want you should definitely listen to your partner and let him lead in terms of visits etc

She sounds completely unhinged, in all honesty you should go NC. However, if this isn't what you want you should definitely listen to your partner and let him lead in terms of visits etc

Anyone who is willing to blackmail you will never stop at just one request. Don’t let her have control. Completely NC, don’t get sucked into her bullshit. She can do what she wants with whatever videos she has but ultimately you and your ex are managing the childcare fine between you.

Her threats mean nothing. She’s a horrible woman trying to cling onto control. It’s abuse and don’t allow your children or yoursef around it to another second.

You need to cut contact and protect your children!

You have done amazing in their lives so far you really have, it sounds like you are so switched on with their needs and with new dp and ex. However your mum has a hold over you still.

Please recognise the strength you have inside to be where you are today- that strength can also help you stand up to your parents and cut contact.

Your dad doesn’t sound good either.
I am sure they love you and the dc but it’s love that is dysfunctional and actually damaging. Look at why you originally started this thread- the worry about when dc4 is born- that’s not fair.

The longer you keep persevering the more damage is being done to you and your kids. I think you’re hanging on and waiting for her to turn into the mom you want but without serious help like therapy (which I doubt she would have) SHE WILL NOT CHANGE.

You have made yourself and your kids a lovely life, free yourself from her and you can live it.

If she causes issues that are threatening or of a serious nature, report to Police.
Let her try to access your kids, with her history there will be questions asked of HER.

If you need support stepping away, maybe ask the school or look for groups or organisations near you. Places to help aren’t always about a couple relationship- some help with all relationships.

I feel so awful. I know rationally and logically I am not wrong. She makes me doubt myself because she is the absolute queen of gaslighting and remembering things ‘differently’ to everyone else. It means she’s never wrong because either it didn’t happen or she remembers an argument but conveniently not what the argument is about.

Take the her taking the pram incident I mentioned in my first post. I brought that up to her yesterday. She remembers us having a big falling out on the car ride home but she can’t remember what it was over. She goes on to say, I can’t imagine doing that but if I did I’m sorry as that was an awful thing to do. It would have been because I was an excited first time grandmother and my logic would have been that you get to push the pram all the time so it was my turn. To get that from her she clearly does remember it but she can’t just apologise like a normal person.

In the past if I’ve fallen out with her the only way to resolve things is to take the blame. Let her make out she’s the most perfect supportive mother and I’m the problem. That I’m ‘unhinged’ and need help. The woman who has kept videos of her daughter at her lowest point mental health wise in the midst of an abusive relationship to use as leverage at a later date. Yet I’m the ‘unhinged’ one. She told me on the phone yesterday to stop calling her mum because she’s not my mother. First thing she’s ever been right about. I didn’t invite her to the court date with my ex. I got the worst guilt trip about that as ‘she’s my mother so she should be there. She’s not just anyone off the street’. Yes because I’m really going to invite the woman who has a penchant for blackmailing me to hear the most intimate details of my abuse to salivate over! Jog on! I’ve put up with enough abuse, manipulation and gaslighting in my life. She’s just going to have to believe what she wants. I’ll believe what I want and know to be the truth. I worry about how many people she knows. Somehow she has a lot of friends. They’d never know this side to her exists.

So my plan of action today is to get a ring doorbell. I don’t think I have it in me to stop her seeing the children while I’m still pregnant. I can’t handle her meddling right now so me and my ex have agreed to let her have the 2/3 hours once a fortnight. What I’m not sure she realises is that it’s once a fortnight. When she brings them back that first time I will tell her she can do the same in two weeks and she’ll either have expected it, or she won’t have and the penny will drop. If it’s the latter any retaliation from her I’d like picked up by the doorbell.

I’m not against going to the police and if it escalates anymore I will. I don’t have a social worker or social services involvement but I did do a course run by social services on how to recognise abusive relationships. The woman who runs it is the most wonderfully supportive woman. I’ve decided that if my mum attempts to blackmail me again I will arrange to call her and explain the situation. I have also decided that all communication from her needs to be written. Everything but WhatsApp has been blocked and if she attempts calling I will answer once just to tell her that she needs to put whatever she wants to say in a message.

The only way I can see this ending is with complete no contact with both me and the children because I don’t believe for a second she will behave and accept once a fortnight contact. I also don’t believe for a second she will want nothing to do with the baby and leave us in peace. Her ‘I don’t give a shit about the baby’ is lashing out because she knows there’s not a cat in hells chance of her being around them. Once I’ve had the baby I think I’ll feel stronger and more able to deal with her threats.

I know I’m going on now and this is outing but it is outing enough as it is so I’m past the point of caring. Another example of how little respect my mother has for me as a parent…

Instilling moral values into my children is highly important to me. My mother knows I do not in any way condone racism or homophobia. A few years back my mums friend gifted her a dolls pram and a couple of dolls to keep in my mums house for when the kids came over. One of these dolls is black. All the other dolls were introduced with normal names. Not this doll, my mum told my daughter her name was ‘chicken tikka’. I told her immediately that she was not to say that around my children and that doll was in fact called Bobbi. I was accused of not being able to take a joke. She has repeatedly called the doll her preferred name ever since while grinning at me. She practically sings it. I always correct her but she thinks it’s hysterical. It’s an attitude I find revolting.

Once a fortnight is way too much, do every 4th week/once per month. You need to spend the extra time with your DC ot her!

OP think long and hard about going NC, your last post just makes it crystal clear she is not a nice person, she really doesn’t care about you and the kids are just a control mechanism. Maybe do the dinner and then start fobbing her off and then just block her entirely. Just to try and do it in a less stressful way for you.

She isn’t entitled to “a turn” as your DC is not a toy for you to share. It is your baby.

My DM did all this and more and in the end I went NC, it was the best decision I ever made and I wil never end the NC. No regrets. Protect your DC.

You are planning to hand your children over to an abusive, unstable, horrible person who is determined to make your life a misery. It is time to step up, be a parent and protect your children. Do not give your children to this person. Do not.

This. You are undermining your own responsibility as a parent here. Forget your own feelings-are you genuinely prepared to have this woman damage another generation of your family? To make up lies to your children about you? To instil racist behaviour with them?

You are contemplating leaving your children unsupervised with two people who have a history of violent, abusive, manipulative and utterly deranged behaviour: you need to step up and be the parent rather than focusing on your status as their child. Do not put another generation of children through this.

I’d really love to cut her out. The stress of what she might do with whatever videos she has will cause me so much stress and anxiety at the moment though.

She has videos and there are also texts between her and my ex where he’s telling her awful things about me. I’m not so concerned about these because I know it’s stuff like I haven’t done a food shop so I’ve left the children without nappies. I can disprove this quite easily. I’ve always done online shops and I can show past orders through the app or my bank statements. Also he’s a grown adult. If there ever was an occasion where we were running low on nappies he could have got some for a change! The videos probably aren’t great. There’s only so far you can push someone before they snap and he counted on that.

I feel backed into a corner. Give her a bit of what she wants and I’ll have peace (for now). Fight back and I live in constant anxiety and fear of her next insane move.

I would go to the police right now with your ex and explain everything. She will never accept what you give so you might as well have this out now. You can't let your kids be exposed to someone this dangerous and abusive. I'm so sorry you have such an awful mother

I feel so very sorry for you. Your parents sound so awful, and you are having to deal with all this while you are pregnant and looking after your children. But you are not alone, and it’s really important thwt you understand that. Both your partner and your ex know exactly what your parents are like, and you are all on the same page. None of you really believe it is anyone’s best interest to let your parents have contact with your children. But you are panicking about the videos which is understandable so I want to try and give you some gentle advice if you will allow it…. And I’m speaking as a mum, a grandma, and a health care professional.

First, you have said that your partners family are lovely. So be brave and tell them about the videos. It will be hard on you I know, but you’ve told us, and no one has judged you at all. And I doubt very much your partners family will. I bet anything they will be so angry at your ex and your mum for putting you through that. And once you’ve told people you have taken away the power your mum thinks she has over you…. They sound so lovely and I’m sure they will want to help you and support you which is what normal families do.

I think you should also talk to your midwife and health visitor. Show them the videos too. And tell them that your mum is threatening to go to court unless you allow her to have your children, but that she is abusive and manipulative. And tell them how worried and upset this has made you. Trust me, health professionals will have seen and heard far worse, and they won’t be shocked. If you can see them with your partner, and explain exactly what your ex used to do and how the videos came to be made. This is important because if your mum ever does kick off big time you have sought help and it will all be documented. They may feel that social services need to be involved as your mum is so abusive towards you and is trying to coerce the children.

I would also very seriously consider going to the police. Your mum has threatened to go to court to get control of your children. She has been abusive and you consider she is a potential danger to the children. I would also speak to the health care professionals about going to the police and see what they suggest.

I know you don’t want any more stress and anxiety but giving into her demands now could open you up to far more in the future. She’s racist. She’s trying to get the children to say they don’t want to live with you. That is so dangerous! You are giving her ammunition. Get a ring doorbell. If she has keys to your house get the locks changed. Keep all doors locked so she can’t get in. And go completely no contact with them.

You're totally wrong that giving her a bit of what she wants wins you temporary peace. All it does is signal to her that her tactics work. I hate to be hard on you in such a difficult situation but it is wrong of you to allow your children to be around this person. It doesn't matter if she's your mother - she is cruel, vindictive and trying to damage you. You should not have her near your family.

I seriously doubt Children's Services would take a word she said seriously. Even if they did investigate you could explain to them that your mother is actively threatening you and trying to control you. Your ex will back you up.

You need to get her out of your life. Let her threaten and scream and make a fuss. You are not her prisoner. Don't act like one.

If it helps, think of it this way - your mother is threatening to report you for things you didn't do. You can defend yourself against those things and prove they didn't happen. However, what you can't defend yourself against is the fact that you're allowing an abusive woman to have access to your children. Prevent the actual harm, not the imagined harm your mother is fabricating.

Your DH sounds great! Let him be stern and rock the boat by telling her no if you struggle with it. It might be uncomfortable at first but hints just don't work with people like this. Keep your DM away from you and your newborn, and let your DH help you do it. Don't let this horrible pattern of behaviour continue with your new arrival. Your other three will be glad of it too!

I’ve never actually seen these videos. I know they exist because my ex threatened me with them once. That’s how I learned he’d been secretly recording me. What I didn’t know at that point was that he’d been sending them to my mother. She is very gloating about them and seems to think they’d grant her everything she wants based on them. Except I think she’s bluffing. I know her, if she thought she’d get more than I’m offering through court she would have just served me papers. More than likely she’s been told she wouldn’t get much if anything and that’s why she was so quick to drop it.

I am going to tell my midwife at my next appointment. I want to go to the police. My ex is willing to go that route but he wants to try the once a fortnight first because he’s quite scared of her.

I don't know if someone else has said this already but grandparents do not have any rights at all and the court absolutely will not facilitate her having access to your children. They simply do not do that. It isn't their job. If she tried to go through the courts to get access they will just turn her away - it literally is not part of what they do.

I’ve just read your updates. Jeez.

stay strong

She’ll abuse those kids if you hand them over once a week. My mil abused both kids, her grandkids and is not allowed unsupervised regular contact with great grandchild. Abusers abuse.

It would be unlikely for her to get access just because she sees them.