Page 22 | To think *some* independent shops really aren't helping themselves...?

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 19:23

Dideon · 07/12/2025 18:29

Noted …. If you come into my shop I will speak only when spoken to.

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I think a pleasant "Good afternoon. Let me know if I can assist you with anything," is fine. I don't want someone standing next to me directing my attention to this or that.

Shopkeepers need to understand, we aren't just standing there vacantly staring.

If I am looking over merchandise, my mind is whirring with things like "Would that work for Abby's birthday?" "I wonder if that hardware is strong enough to hold up that old mirror we never yet hung," "Would that paint match the paint on the bench in the kitchen?" "Where could I fit that plant into the new cottage garden??" "I could use that on the car seats in winter, perhaps..." "If I got rid of the brass lamp on my bedside table, this one might be better for reading in bed.." and so on. It's difficult to problem-solve on the go if someone continually interrupts.

RafaFan · 07/12/2025 19:33

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 15:44

Eating lunch while staffing the till is hardly a major deprivation. If the alternative is alienating customers.

I’m not a shopkeeper but in a 40-year career, 95 percent of my lunches have been eaten at my desk.

It's one thing eating lunch at your desk in an office, another thing entirely eating it while attempting to serve the public. I remember once going into an independent upmarket clothes shop (the type which calls itself a boutique) and the staff member was sitting behind the till eating a burger and chips. The whole shop smelled of it. It was awful, and that one first impression ruined any chance of us ever buying anything there. Who wants to pay a lot of money for clothes that smell like a burger van? We may well have given her the benefit of the doubt and tried again another day if, when we arrived, there had been a sign in the door saying closed for lunch, back at xx.

BatchCookBabe · 07/12/2025 19:37

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 19:23

I think a pleasant "Good afternoon. Let me know if I can assist you with anything," is fine. I don't want someone standing next to me directing my attention to this or that.

Shopkeepers need to understand, we aren't just standing there vacantly staring.

If I am looking over merchandise, my mind is whirring with things like "Would that work for Abby's birthday?" "I wonder if that hardware is strong enough to hold up that old mirror we never yet hung," "Would that paint match the paint on the bench in the kitchen?" "Where could I fit that plant into the new cottage garden??" "I could use that on the car seats in winter, perhaps..." "If I got rid of the brass lamp on my bedside table, this one might be better for reading in bed.." and so on. It's difficult to problem-solve on the go if someone continually interrupts.

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Yes, this. ^ I don't agree that shop assistants should not speak until the customer speaks first. That's a bit odd I think! As you say, something along the lines of 'Hiya/good afternoon, are you looking for anything in particular?' will do. And if the customer isn't looking for anything in particular and just wants to peruse, they should just say 'well let me know if you need any help...' and leave the customer to it.

Even if some (independent) shop owners/assistants don't push their 'help' on me (as a few posters have illustrated,) it's still hard to look around peacefully, as they sometimes keep talking. Where are you from? Are you a local? Bit choppy for June isn't it? Been to many shops already? Have you been down to the beach yet? Have you gone on the cable car, there's a nice view over the bay from there. Are you staying here for a while, or just on a day trip? Are you here alone or with family? Have you bought anything nice yet? Are you in a caravan or a B & B? ...... and so on and so on and so on and so on....

I just think 'pleeeeeeeease stop talking!'

.

BatchCookBabe · 07/12/2025 19:43

RafaFan · 07/12/2025 19:33

It's one thing eating lunch at your desk in an office, another thing entirely eating it while attempting to serve the public. I remember once going into an independent upmarket clothes shop (the type which calls itself a boutique) and the staff member was sitting behind the till eating a burger and chips. The whole shop smelled of it. It was awful, and that one first impression ruined any chance of us ever buying anything there. Who wants to pay a lot of money for clothes that smell like a burger van? We may well have given her the benefit of the doubt and tried again another day if, when we arrived, there had been a sign in the door saying closed for lunch, back at xx.

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Well yeah that is ludicrous. I have never ever seen this though... (Or anything like it.) It's never usually 'hot food.' All I see shop assistants eating - in these little independent shops - is a sandwich, or a cheese and tomato bap, or some crisps, or a mini salad baguette, and maybe a piece of fruit, or a kitkat or a yogurt...

Burger and chips at your desk is ludicrous and farcical. Every place I have ever worked would never have allowed that in the office/at your desk/on any kind of customer facing desk.

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 19:50

RafaFan · 07/12/2025 19:33

It's one thing eating lunch at your desk in an office, another thing entirely eating it while attempting to serve the public. I remember once going into an independent upmarket clothes shop (the type which calls itself a boutique) and the staff member was sitting behind the till eating a burger and chips. The whole shop smelled of it. It was awful, and that one first impression ruined any chance of us ever buying anything there. Who wants to pay a lot of money for clothes that smell like a burger van? We may well have given her the benefit of the doubt and tried again another day if, when we arrived, there had been a sign in the door saying closed for lunch, back at xx.

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I agree they shouldn't be eating anything pungent. A turkey sandwich and crisps, discreetly, is more like it. Or fruit and cheese. Or yoghurt and a salad.

The point is that is just the way it goes in some occupations. If one can't or won't hire a shop assistant, then one is stuck there for the duration.

riceuten · 07/12/2025 19:56

Ha, I amuse myself looking at their FB posts where they inevitably respond to customer complaints that the reason orders are delayed is because it’s Christmas - as if the latter comes as a massive surprise every year.

A local bakery has a limit on orders - which is the right thing to do. Other local
shops have delivered Xmas presents after the 27th which kind of defeats the point.

Local restaurants are not helping themselves either - one is only allowing people to order in December from the inflated price 2 or 3 course Xmas menu - and recently went online moaning about the downturn in business. It’s never, ever their own fault.

Dideon · 07/12/2025 20:05

Cheese is my Idol and Batchcookbabe … I was being sarcastic.
I am more than capable of reading the room and assessing the amount of input a customer wants. Some of my customers want me as a personal shopper some want very little interaction. I am sure I was probably too eager in the early days but it’s a learning process. This thread has been interesting.

Joeninety · 07/12/2025 20:07

Suppose small independents are fine in theory, but in reality you pay through the nose when using them. Unless of course they deal and have a good knowledge of various niche products one might be interested in.

BrightYellowDaffodil · 07/12/2025 20:13

MixedFeelingsNoFeelings · 06/12/2025 17:17

And that awful feeling when you go into a little shop, do a quick scan and immediately see there's nothing you want, or it's more than you're prepared to pay. You want to walk straight out, but because you don't want to cause offence (you live there after all, and you can feel the owner's eyes burning holes in your back) you have to decide whether it's worth feigning interest in something... or if it's better to make a quick exit, trilling 'thank you!' as you're halfway out the door.

That's why I limit my visits to small independents, also craft markets. Whereas I'm happy to browse a chain store numerous times before buying anything.

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Absolutely this - especially craft markets and definitely the sort of stall where you can tell the owner is very very keen for you to like and buy their stuff. There’s one near me that a friend works at and I often pop in to support it. I like the stalls where I get a ‘Hello” from the stall-holder and other than that I’m left in peace to look. The ones where the owner starts telling me the life story of the art they’ve created from recycled bicycle cogs or lamps made out of wine bottles that I absolutely don’t want but I’m only stopping on my way past to be polite, or where they immediately start the hard/up-sell, are the ones I scuttle away from and don’t go back, even if there was something I wanted to look at.

PollyPlumPeach · 07/12/2025 20:15

Badbadbunny · 05/12/2025 13:01

Probably because the owner and staff have also dropped off their kids and it takes an hour to set up to open a cafe, i.e. turn on the ovens, coffee machines, tills, etc., set up the tables/chairs, etc. You can't just walk in and start serving within 5 minutes! I'm just pointing out the reality when owners and staff also have children themselves and themselves want "family friendly" hours.

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But then why choose to run a business if you are just looking for a hobby business to fit around your kids school hours. We've got a lovely independent cafe near a school that would do a roaring trade if they were open at 9 to catch the mums after drop -off, or stayed open until 3 to catch the mums waiting for pick up. But no, they are open 10 and close at random times anywhere from 1pm to 2.30. Then put endless posts up on FB about how the town isn't supporting independent local businesses and how they are struggling to keep the cafe financially viable.
Either treat it as a hobby, and accept you will lose money on it, or run it as a business and put in the hard graft to make it a success. Can't have it both ways.

BrightYellowDaffodil · 07/12/2025 20:18

Joeninety · 07/12/2025 20:07

Suppose small independents are fine in theory, but in reality you pay through the nose when using them. Unless of course they deal and have a good knowledge of various niche products one might be interested in.

But indies often have interesting/quirky/arty stuff that Amazon et al don’t, or I’m happy to pay a bit extra for because I popped in and it’s the perfect present for me someone and I’ve got it there and then/don’t have to pay delivery charges or meet a minimum spend.

I have a lovely independent bookshop near me, not only do they have all sorts of events but they’re great to chat to (if there isn’t a queue) and they often have beautiful editions of books. I’ll quite happily use Amazon but I also enjoy the experience of going to that shop.

Those are the sort of indies that thrive.

Dideon · 07/12/2025 20:20

Joeninety · 07/12/2025 20:07

Suppose small independents are fine in theory, but in reality you pay through the nose when using them. Unless of course they deal and have a good knowledge of various niche products one might be interested in.

My shop is cheaper than the supermarkets for much higher quality clothing. It can be done . You have to work really hard behind the scenes, do hundreds of hours of research, be totally committed.. infact a bit obsessive!

OonaStubbs · 07/12/2025 20:22

An independent shop whose only USP is the idea that they are "an independent shop" isn't going to last very long. They have to offer something different and better than the chains and online shopping to make it worthwhile for customers to go the extra mile and spend the extra money.

MustWeDoThis · 07/12/2025 20:23

BeansAndNoodles · 05/12/2025 08:55

I'm massively supportive of small businesses, I try to use them as often as I can. We are lucky to have a high street with lots of independent shops. However, my trips to town are limited due to being short of spare time, plus parking costs a fortune unless you limit it to the free 90 mins that you get in the supermarket car park, etc.

But time and time again I go to one of the independent shops to find them randomly shut. I get that they probably only have one staff member so it's hard to stay open if anything out of the ordinary happens, but it's still so flipping frustrating.

The last few trips to town have ended with me ordering stuff online or going into one of the chains because the independent shops I wanted were closed for no apparent reason. The independent health food shop is the worst, they close for an hour at some point between 11 and 3 for lunch but it's not the same time day to day and they don't say on the closed sign what time they'll be back, so if you get there and it's shut you don't know if it's worth trekking back to that end of town in 30 mins or not. I tend not to even bother checking now and just go straight Holland & Barrat instead. Several more shops seem to rely on posting that days opening hours on their FB page, but thats hardly a reliable way to tell people if they're open or not! Last week I had an afternoon off and took a trip to a different town specifically to go to a shop that stocks work by local artists to get some cards and gifts, only to find it closed with no indication of why or if it was opening late or what. I checked their FB page while stood outside but nope nothing. Later that day (3 hours after their stated opening time) they posted that they'd decided to open later for the Christmas lights switch on and that they hoped people would come and support them

Anyway I've just seen yet another slightly passive aggressive plea from one of the owners of the worst shops for this, complaining how quiet business is and telling people to use them or lose them yada. Well yes I totally agree but more often then not when I try to use them they're not bloody open!

Finally! Someone else who thinks the same. I said this to my husband a few days ago. Said the shop was open online, drove there - Closed 2hrs early. Then they all complain on FB. Do they not realise we all also work, or have commitments during their opening hours? Maybe they should open later and close later?

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 20:35

BrightYellowDaffodil · 07/12/2025 20:13

Absolutely this - especially craft markets and definitely the sort of stall where you can tell the owner is very very keen for you to like and buy their stuff. There’s one near me that a friend works at and I often pop in to support it. I like the stalls where I get a ‘Hello” from the stall-holder and other than that I’m left in peace to look. The ones where the owner starts telling me the life story of the art they’ve created from recycled bicycle cogs or lamps made out of wine bottles that I absolutely don’t want but I’m only stopping on my way past to be polite, or where they immediately start the hard/up-sell, are the ones I scuttle away from and don’t go back, even if there was something I wanted to look at.

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Last weekend a local garden centre had a tiny seasonal artisan market - it was five women with tables set up to display their wares. They were quite close together, facing one another, creating a narrow aisle in between the tables.

All of them sat squarely at their tables with arms folded, staring at me, deadly silent as I walked along murmuring "How pretty" "Very nice" "Cute!" It was so uncomfortable.

If they had talked among themselves, or pretended to organize their goods, or anything, but five pairs of eyes boring into me, waiting to see whose merchandise I picked, was too much. I actually did sort of want one of the items but instead drifted away without a purchase.

IsntItDarkOut · 07/12/2025 20:35

Obviously I’m fine with someone saying hello. The worst is when you are wearing headphones and they start wanting a conversation so you have to take them off.
I have them on for a reason. I’m a carer and there’s times when I go out was the only peace I got.

multimillionaire · 07/12/2025 20:46

taxguru · 07/12/2025 15:45

I was responding to someone who said shop owners should just eat their lunch in the back of the shop and never close. Heaven knows how they think the shop owner could go to the loo!!

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What on earth is wrong with eating lunch in the back of the shop? I know business owners who do this and they arent complaining how awful their lives are, they eat a snack for lunch in the shop and then have a proper dinner in the evening when they go home to their family just like most of us do.

I eat lunch every flipping day at my desk- no biggie.

As for going to the loo- that takes all of a couple of minutes unless you have a significant health issue and in that case then maybe being single shop owner isnt for you.

I am not sure why you are being so weird about this but if a shop owner requires hours and hours of time away from their shop every day to eat their lunch al fresco or to get fresh air or exercise as you claim, thats entirely up to them. However, they cannot then moan and complain that their sales are dropping.

They have the option of 1. hiring someone else to cover their ridiculously long lunch breaks that apparently you say they need OR 2. Not opening a shop in the first place on their own.

Noone is forcing them to become sole traders

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 07/12/2025 21:03

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 20:35

Last weekend a local garden centre had a tiny seasonal artisan market - it was five women with tables set up to display their wares. They were quite close together, facing one another, creating a narrow aisle in between the tables.

All of them sat squarely at their tables with arms folded, staring at me, deadly silent as I walked along murmuring "How pretty" "Very nice" "Cute!" It was so uncomfortable.

If they had talked among themselves, or pretended to organize their goods, or anything, but five pairs of eyes boring into me, waiting to see whose merchandise I picked, was too much. I actually did sort of want one of the items but instead drifted away without a purchase.

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That sounds like something straight out of The League of Gentlemen.

Maybe it was a local market for local people!

Crikeyalmighty · 07/12/2025 21:11

BrightYellowDaffodil · 07/12/2025 20:18

But indies often have interesting/quirky/arty stuff that Amazon et al don’t, or I’m happy to pay a bit extra for because I popped in and it’s the perfect present for me someone and I’ve got it there and then/don’t have to pay delivery charges or meet a minimum spend.

I have a lovely independent bookshop near me, not only do they have all sorts of events but they’re great to chat to (if there isn’t a queue) and they often have beautiful editions of books. I’ll quite happily use Amazon but I also enjoy the experience of going to that shop.

Those are the sort of indies that thrive.

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Toppings is like this in Bath, a massive indie on several levels, so big enough to just be in their to browse and their will be multiple people in it - I frequently find signed editions as it’s on a lot of the book tours and just good vibes in a lovely building.- so yep I’ve done a lot of impulse purchases there

Jennick · 07/12/2025 21:16

You give up when they shut likt this ,in the real world people don't have time for it

Bluedenimdoglover · 07/12/2025 21:16

A serious independent retailer will always make themselves available for customers - some offer on-line as well as a physical high street presence. Those that open erratically are often "hobby" businesses. If they really needed the trade, they'd show more respect for their customers.

Holluschickie · 07/12/2025 21:17

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 20:35

Last weekend a local garden centre had a tiny seasonal artisan market - it was five women with tables set up to display their wares. They were quite close together, facing one another, creating a narrow aisle in between the tables.

All of them sat squarely at their tables with arms folded, staring at me, deadly silent as I walked along murmuring "How pretty" "Very nice" "Cute!" It was so uncomfortable.

If they had talked among themselves, or pretended to organize their goods, or anything, but five pairs of eyes boring into me, waiting to see whose merchandise I picked, was too much. I actually did sort of want one of the items but instead drifted away without a purchase.

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I am terrified of shops like these, so never go in. Just the pressure to buy....

hopelessbusiness · 07/12/2025 21:27

There was a huge Christmas market local to me a couple of weeks ago - it's been going for years and is really popular, attracting thousands of visitors. The high street inevitably packed, shops and stalls doing a roaring trade but 1 shop (selling loose sweets, chocolates, fudge etc) was resolutely shut for the whole weekend!
Make it make sense...

Katypp · 07/12/2025 21:51

CasperGutman · 05/12/2025 10:35

A much-loved shop near us has recently closed. It was close to a primary school and was the sort of place that should have been very popular with parents on the school run, selling cards, gifts, books (including children's books) and a few traditional toys. Unfortunately it didn't open at school pick-up and drop-off times as the owner-operator was a parent of a young child and shut for her own school run. It was such a shame they couldn't either use a childminder or find a reliable assistant to keep the shop open at those key times.

Edited

I think that's the problem with a lot of shop/cafe type businesses tbh.
They are run by (usually) mums whose only purpose of setting up a business rather than getting a job is for a work/life balance to to have time with their children. This doesn't work for customer-facing businesses at all.
We had a cafe in our village open 10am-2.30 Mon-Friday only to accommodate school run for the owner's elder child. The younger (toddler) wandered around the cafe 'entertaining' customers. It lasted 18 months

CheeseIsMyIdol · 07/12/2025 21:56

Holluschickie · 07/12/2025 21:17

I am terrified of shops like these, so never go in. Just the pressure to buy....

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It was so weird because there was plenty of space; they didn't have to be crammed together like that and seated in dead silence. If the tables had been angled a bit and if the people had been sort of bustling behind them, instead of seated dead center and staring, it might have been appealing. I felt like an animal on display in a zoo.

It was just such a demonstration of utter lack of understanding of retail psychology. Their wares were cute, if knicky-knacky, and I might have bought a couple of things to refresh my Christmas decor, but it was just too awkward. I felt like I was eating an ice cream sundae in front of hopeful, hungry children.