To think *some* independent shops really aren't helping themselves...?

[BeansAndNoodles]

I'm massively supportive of small businesses, I try to use them as often as I can. We are lucky to have a high street with lots of independent shops. However, my trips to town are limited due to being short of spare time, plus parking costs a fortune unless you limit it to the free 90 mins that you get in the supermarket car park, etc.

But time and time again I go to one of the independent shops to find them randomly shut. I get that they probably only have one staff member so it's hard to stay open if anything out of the ordinary happens, but it's still so flipping frustrating.

The last few trips to town have ended with me ordering stuff online or going into one of the chains because the independent shops I wanted were closed for no apparent reason. The independent health food shop is the worst, they close for an hour at some point between 11 and 3 for lunch but it's not the same time day to day and they don't say on the closed sign what time they'll be back, so if you get there and it's shut you don't know if it's worth trekking back to that end of town in 30 mins or not. I tend not to even bother checking now and just go straight Holland & Barrat instead. Several more shops seem to rely on posting that days opening hours on their FB page, but thats hardly a reliable way to tell people if they're open or not! Last week I had an afternoon off and took a trip to a different town specifically to go to a shop that stocks work by local artists to get some cards and gifts, only to find it closed with no indication of why or if it was opening late or what. I checked their FB page while stood outside but nope nothing. Later that day (3 hours after their stated opening time) they posted that they'd decided to open later for the Christmas lights switch on and that they hoped people would come and support them

Anyway I've just seen yet another slightly passive aggressive plea from one of the owners of the worst shops for this, complaining how quiet business is and telling people to use them or lose them yada. Well yes I totally agree but more often then not when I try to use them they're not bloody open!

It is very annoying. Recently a bakery I like was doing a pop up, 11-6. I arrived at 11.45 to find a sign saying gone for half an hour. No clue when the half hour started or ended. I waited 20 mins but no one came so I just gave up

Couldn't agree more. Many seem to be part time hobby businesses. There's a lovely little gift shop on my local high street. 3 times I went there intending to buy gifts and I've never found them open yet.
Plus of course COL. These types of shops will be the first to close.

Not all shops actually care about selling like pp said sometimes its just a hobby or a front for something sinister.

I used to volunteer for a library (not council run) and they were so inconsistent with opening times, it was infuriating. If it was a quiet day they would shut shop 2 hours early. Very frustrating when you have to return items that day or get a fine.

As an aside, where I live it's custom for items to get wrapped up nicely, especially in small shops. Why do shops in the UK not do this? It's why I prefer going to small businesses.

I don't understand the insistence that we must support small businesses. I support businesses that are well run with good customer service and a sensible not (necessarily cheapest) price.

IME some small businesses are terribly run, and they're often appalling employers.

So, I use an independent opticians who provide excellent service, have gone out of their way to help me when I was in pain, and are a bit more expensive than the big chains, but on Saturday mornings when I do parkrun and the cafe in the park is over priced, grumpy and very slow for poor quality food and coffee, I walk down the road and go to Wetherspoons for breakfast, who regardless of opinions on quality/status, do what they do really well.

I have a small creative business which I sell in these type of shops (I do also have a full time job, saw someone mention getting a real job up the thread). I do see it from both sides, but ultimately these shops end up closing down in the end. I’ve seen it time and time again in our town. All our ‘nice little shops and cafes’ are on one little pedestrianised road where people don’t walk through anymore due to restructuring of the town centre. Half of them are closed until 10am and then shut again at 4. Closed on Sundays. The independents that did do well have had to move into the large shopping mall to get any footfall now.

I do wonder why the personally owned and run ones close for an hour at lunch each day and don't open and close 30 mins earlier or later to catch the panic buying customers.

The amount of times I've needed a last minute card, gift, foodie item ir even jumper (yes, really. Theres been more than a few occasions, usually in summer, when ive left in a hurry and left it on the hook only to do a long commute in the car and arrive in a freezing cold office)

I get not wanting to live at work but if you work for yourself in a quiet shop you can enjoy the peace of before and after core hours and read a book, listen to the radio, watch something discreetly. Or eat lunch in a quiet period.

I’ve had to withdraw from a few independent shops in the past because the rent for a very small shelf space can get ridiculous, not to mention they also take a large cut of your profits. Sometimes I’d come out with £50 at the end of the month after paying the shelf and cut. Because of this advice, if you do like ‘shopping small’, seek the artists/makers/crafts out online or at craft markets, rather than going to a shop.

Several more shops seem to rely on posting that days opening hours on their FB page

This gives me the rage when I've gone to that shop's actual website to check opening hours and they're just the standard ones. Go to the shop, it's closed, they've put their 'seasonal hours' on Instagram or Facebook or something.

The whole point of having a website is to communicate key things like this!

Another one. A local, independent vegan cafe opened near us. Beautiful decor and delicious looking food. DH and I went in and waited politely to be seated (there was signage telling us to do this). Ten minutes later we were still standing and waiting, despite several members of staff walking past us.

Eventually I approached the owner, who was behind the counter faffing with some lettuce, and asked when we would be seated? He barely looked up from the lettuce and informed me they were very busy but 'someone will be with you when they have a moment.'

Yeah, but no. We left and popped into Costa next door. Unsurprisingly the vegan cafe closed within 18 months despite the owner desperately trying to raise money via Go Fund Me.

I try and support local where I can. Just had a house sign made by the local shop rather than online, books from an independent seller rather than Amazon, dry cleaning from the sole trader rather than a chain and so on. But we have a fruit and veg shop. She closes at 4 and for the last 2 weeks has been completely closed as she went on holiday. Then she whinges loudly on the local FB site that no one supports her, how if people don’t buy from her she’ll have to close. Maybe be open a bit more then. Oh, and take cards… her public fairly rude whinging has put me off supporting her.

I quite agree OP and I have zero sympathy for shops who do this and then wail about loss of business.

I run a business. I am not stupid - I know that if I want people to give me their business I have to be open, convenient, and I have to answer their enquiries promptly otherwise they will go elsewhere. It's not rocket science, it's obvious as fck.

Zero sympathy.

Also, please put your address on Insta etc. The amount of times I’ve followed a reel or post to then have to spend time googling trying to work out where the sodding place is…(never mind whether it’s open, for that matter!)

our local independent book shop is like this.

The guy who runs it is ALWAYS on social media, complaining at the council about the lack of footfall into the town etc, moaning about shoppers not turning up and how difficult it is to run a business.

I appreciate all that and I do go in and buy things from him.

BUT

He is a bookshop with no website, so I can't order books from him at home. I've emailed him before asking him for recommendations for a secret santa book club i'm in, and didn't get a reply till after January (apparantly he 'missed' the email, so I had to resort to Amazon). I've gone into town on a saturday afternoon and he's been shut from 2.30pm onwards. He doesn't open on a sunday/Monday and the rest of the week he shuts at 3pm!

Because he's independent he's so much more expensive than anywhere else. I know thats because of economy of scale, but for example, when he stocked the latest Richard Osman, or the Prince Harry book, it was for the full retail price of £19.99, whereas the supermarkets were all £8-10. I know they're loss leaders and I get that, but equally, i'm not doing to spend double the price

I once went to an independent cafe an hour before their closing time and the look on their faces when I went in made it clear they were hoping to close early and I wasn’t welcome. They literally told me not politely “we’re closing in half an hour” when I went to order (not according to their opening times!) and clearly hoped I’d just leave. The thing is I wouldn’t mind except I’d seen their “boo hoo, business is failing if things don’t pick up in the next month” post on the local Facebook page so I was going there to support them and that’s what I was met with. I didn’t go back and when they folded I wasn’t exactly surprised or sad if that’s how they treat their customers.

Being self employed and having your own business sounds brilliant but the reality is it’s brutal. I think covid got loads of people thinking setting up their own business and working their own hours was a fluffy dream, but actually it’s harder than a lot of people realise, often longer hours and you have to have the pure grit, passion and determination for it to succeed. Even then there are no guarantees.

Yep! There was one near us that did the same. Then one Saturday there was a free kids event in the town they were in, we thought we'd go to that and then pop into the cafe for a coffee afterwards. It was shut. They had a town full of young kids and parents who no doubt would fancy somewhere warm to sit down and a hot drink while the kids play...

We run an event. Every year one business complained.

Then someone else in the family took over.

The next year it was their best days sales of the year.

It's about not being proactive about converting the footfall into sales. It's poor business strategy.

Sales are always about footfall.

Ahhh I was having this rant the other day.

Actually it wasn't just aimed at independent shops but the high st in general.

Took a Thursday off work, went to a busy place to do Christmas shopping and enjoy the market etc.

Also needed some basic stuff. Including, a pair of black leather flat shoes that would look good with a pencil skirt and trousers. 5 shops later, nothing. Gave up. Came home and ordered online.

Half the independent stores were shut which struck me as stupid. Busiest time of year for footfall traffic, and nope. Shut. 2 had put posts on social media saying the use or lose line....I bloody tried!

Also went to a little book store in Ironbridge a few days after that, and walked out without purchasing. The woman running the shop was so rude, had her headphones in and barging past customers. I had a stack of books to buy totalling around the he 150 mark, and just left them. I was gutted, but after standing at the til for 15 minutes waiting to be served and no one in site because she was too busy straightening every bookshelf I gave up.

I don't understand the insistence that we must support small businesses. I support businesses that are well run with good customer service and a sensible not (necessarily cheapest) price

These are my thoughts too. Moaning about loss of business on social media doesnt work for me, it just irritates me and I see it as a negative and moany. Puts me right off going in there. I think its because I really resent being told what to do by anyone so it makes me want to do the exact opposite lol

What I would respond well to is a friendly, engaging social media post inviting people in for a coffee with free live music or something similar, doesnt have to be a lot or be giving anything away but anything thats positive and inviting a community feel.

You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

I'm often bemused by independent shops as well.

There's a nice bakery on a parade of shops near me, that does delicious cakes. It's no parking outside, so you have to park in the supermarket car park and walk up about the 5ish minutes and cross a very busy road. The amount of times I've walked up there to find it randomly closed at like 2pm on a Wednesday, or not yet open at 10:30am on a Monday. It almost seems like they open as and when they feel like it. It also doesn't help that the opening times listed on Google have no basis in reality.

The same is true where my mum lives (a popular tourist town near the Welsh border). There's a sweet shop there, and honest to goodness, in the 15 years mum has lived there, I've never seen it open. It's become a running joke now. Every time I'm passing, I look to see if it's open, and it never is.
Mum reports that she does see it open, but not consistently. Not even in peak tourist season!

There's a nice independent bookshop in a town near me, that I went to once and liked. I've attempted to visit at least twice more, at perfectly normal "shopping" times, to find it closed. After the second failed attempt, I shrugged and decided I wouldn't make a special trip a third time.

If "parking costs a fortune," would catching a bus be an option where you live? No bus fare in the UK is over £3 at the moment, and unlike parking, it won't be more expensive the longer you stay.

I live in a very popular and busy 'market town' which gets a lot of tourists. I find it baffling how so many shops close on completely random days (say, a Friday, which is arguably the busiest day of the week for tourists!)
Also lots don't open until 10 or 10.30am, and then close at 4. Most of them are staffed by the owner too, so not an issue with staff not showing up.
We also have a butcher who is forever complaining that the local Aldi is taking trade away from him, but he doesn't sell "meat" - only BBQ food! Literally, the only thing you can buy from him is ready marinated meat or sausages.
We also have a very popular bakery in town, which people travel from miles around to go to, but a loaf of bread (not sourdough, just normal bread) is £4.50, and a pack of 6 bread rolls is £5.50. I have no idea where they get that sort of pricing from??!!

There is a little independent bookshop near us. Almost every single time I go it is closed. I have been mid morning, lunchtime, afternoon and so on but there is almost always a sign on the door saying they have popped out. I buy almost all my books from waterstones instead.

Yep, we have a local craft shop, which has been open for years. It had fixed, clearly displayed opening hours; very occasionally the ladies who ran it would both be ill or something and they’d post on Facebook with an apology and say when they expected to reopen.

A few years ago the owner retired and it was bought over by someone else. She started posting things on Facebook like “The weather is too nice to be in the shop today, so we’ll be shut all day, reopening tomorrow!” and then the next day do the same thing. She’d randomly close early or open late, and no one knew when lunchtime was. Within a year, the shop (which had been open for something like 60 years) had closed down.

It’s such a basic thing to get right. Yes, no one wants to be stuck in work on a sunny day, but it has to be done! And take your lunch at the same time every day (or as you say, at least indicate when you’ll be open again - a sign saying “Closed for 1 hour” doesn’t tell me anything unless it says when it was posted)!

I always try to shop locally (and for craft stuff like wool and fabric I find it fairly essential) but some (not all by any means) traders make it so awkward!

I hate to agree but I do.

As a side issue, an independent maker and seller, for whom I have been a customer for years and am on good terms with, took to making strident political statements on her social media. I didn't agree at all, but who cares, it was business and she doesn't have to agree with me. Then she started ranting and saying everyone who didn't agree was a disgusting piece of shit and she didn't want their money. So I started buying elsewhere and apparently so did many other people because the business has now folded.

Sometimes the individuality overrides the business too much. Some businesses can take a loss like that but very small independent ones usually can't.