To think *some* independent shops really aren't helping themselves...?

[BeansAndNoodles]

I'm massively supportive of small businesses, I try to use them as often as I can. We are lucky to have a high street with lots of independent shops. However, my trips to town are limited due to being short of spare time, plus parking costs a fortune unless you limit it to the free 90 mins that you get in the supermarket car park, etc.

But time and time again I go to one of the independent shops to find them randomly shut. I get that they probably only have one staff member so it's hard to stay open if anything out of the ordinary happens, but it's still so flipping frustrating.

The last few trips to town have ended with me ordering stuff online or going into one of the chains because the independent shops I wanted were closed for no apparent reason. The independent health food shop is the worst, they close for an hour at some point between 11 and 3 for lunch but it's not the same time day to day and they don't say on the closed sign what time they'll be back, so if you get there and it's shut you don't know if it's worth trekking back to that end of town in 30 mins or not. I tend not to even bother checking now and just go straight Holland & Barrat instead. Several more shops seem to rely on posting that days opening hours on their FB page, but thats hardly a reliable way to tell people if they're open or not! Last week I had an afternoon off and took a trip to a different town specifically to go to a shop that stocks work by local artists to get some cards and gifts, only to find it closed with no indication of why or if it was opening late or what. I checked their FB page while stood outside but nope nothing. Later that day (3 hours after their stated opening time) they posted that they'd decided to open later for the Christmas lights switch on and that they hoped people would come and support them

Anyway I've just seen yet another slightly passive aggressive plea from one of the owners of the worst shops for this, complaining how quiet business is and telling people to use them or lose them yada. Well yes I totally agree but more often then not when I try to use them they're not bloody open!

Agree, but tbh if I were so desperate for custom, I wouldn’t close for lunch at all. Why not just have a sandwich in the back room? Why the need to leave the premises at all?

Re: coffee shops/delis
Locally to me there are 2 cafes and 1 deli.
2 don't open on a monday
All close by 2pm
🤷‍♀️

I was in a pet food shop a couple years ago, long established on the high street, and the owner was griping about Amazon. Yet as I pointed out, I can shop at Amazon of an evening after work, whereas he chooses to close at 6pm.

I asked if he’d consider a delivery subscription for dog food, treats and wild bird feed, pointing out that he had a nice van with his shop logo on it. He looked at me and scoffed as though I’d asked him to come clean my toilets, and made a snarky remark to other patrons.

Fine. Guess what, Amazon is still in business; he is not.

That is just bizarre.

Yep.
They miss out on all the post school/work people.
And the deli doesn't do the late opening evening for christmas either!
Another local cafe/bistro seems to change its opening hours weekly - you just can't rely on it being open and they don't update their fb page...
So I don't bother anymore.
It's really frustrating tbh...I have money to spend...I'd like to spend it locally but 🤷‍♀️

sorry your business didn't work out. Did you research when people who would be likely to use your business would be able to actually, you know, go in and spend their money?

It is legit to ask people not to photograph your stuff - i have done that with things i am selling at a market. Same as the "hey, Janet, look at this, can you make things like this? can you make me one?" well - meh - if Janet says yes, i lose a sale. But if Janet then sets up as a rival using my original ideas? fuck her, and i will point that out to anyone who asks.

What this thread is saying is: if you have a business research your market and open for that market. Be transparent about your opening times, and don't just change them willy-nilly with little or no notice (or only on your Instagram). If you have to close, unexpectedly - especially if only for an hour or so - put up a clearly worded sign saying when you will be coming back. With a time.

If you are a café or similar - don't leave people waiting ages to be seated, to get their order etc etc.

And if you don't do all that - push off with your sadface social media "use it or lose it" bollocks.

Not all companies succeed, even those with an excellent business plan and carefully researched marketing etc. That is a fact of business life.

My goods were not over priced,

economics theory says that if people were't buying them, they were overpriced.

It is an unfortunate fact of modern life that

when they discovered the joys of Temu and reverse image search which was often done in front of my face

We are all being stiffed by, and by buying these things stiffing the people who make them, these businesses.

It is acceptable (to me at least) to ask people doing that to leave the shop. It does not, however solve your proplem of sales.

I feel for you, i really do, because the economic downturn, Covid and the loss of your DH has been a perfect storm for your business.

I can pinpoint the day my takings dropped to a WTF level and never recovered - one local bus company went out of business which halved services down my road. Parking was non existent, so footfall declined dramatically. Other businesses around me were similarly affected.

So there was actually a very significant external factor at work here. Nothing to do with the behaviour of your customers, or non-customers.

Things like public transport, parking and business rates aren’t within the control of the potential customer, any more than they are within your control. Yet you still seem determined to blame people for not buying from you.

My particular bugbear are the various startlingly expensive shops in my village with lots of poor-me on social media, when in all cases there is inherited money/rich spouse. Why should I pay a premium to find your lifestyle choice, Lucinda?

And that awful feeling when you go into a little shop, do a quick scan and immediately see there's nothing you want, or it's more than you're prepared to pay. You want to walk straight out, but because you don't want to cause offence (you live there after all, and you can feel the owner's eyes burning holes in your back) you have to decide whether it's worth feigning interest in something... or if it's better to make a quick exit, trilling 'thank you!' as you're halfway out the door.

That's why I limit my visits to small independents, also craft markets. Whereas I'm happy to browse a chain store numerous times before buying anything.

I had this at our soft play. They closed upstairs sports facilities and party rooms to open a nursery, moaned that nobody came to the stay and play from 3-5pm and then when I did go the last time they let me in then said they were closing at 4 as it was so quiet. This was about 6 months ago. They have now closed down and the whole place is a new-business nursery.

Yep. I always convinced myself it was just me being silly, but having spoken to this local store owner I now feel my awkwardness is totally appropriate!

Ha ha- theres a lot of that goes on and not always much businesssense. In all fairness though as others have mentioned I do feel awkward going into this kind of shop if there’s nothing I want and I would also feel awkward as a shop owner - definitely wouldn’t be for me - I would actually find a place I was doing something easier , cafe, sandwich bar, wine bar etc

People just want facilities for their convenience or for sentimental reasons. They want a shop/pub to be there for the odd occasion they want it, i.e. when they run out of something and don't want to drive to Tesco! Or, in the case of our village pub, they just want to be sentimental about the Saturday evenings they had there where they met and smooched their first loves, but not been anywhere near for the subsequent few decades - our village Facebook group was full of that kind of post when one of the village pubs shut down - lots of people, many of whom didn't even live in the village anymore bemoaning how sad it was that they place they had their first Saturday night snog was no more!! They don't really want such places to use themselves, it's just nostalgia. The "use it or lose it" is a response to that kind of pointless sentimentality which is widespread.

I own and run a very successful Independent Boutique. I am in a large village and have limited hours. I have had the exact same limited hours for my 16 years of trading. I never turn up late or leave before my hours state . If someone comes from another town they can rest assured that I will be open . I greet everyone who comes in . If I'm already with a customer, I will welcome them and let them know I will be with them soon. I want people to have a good experience in my shop.

Well done to you, it’s not easy and you clearly know your market and customers

Fresh air, some exercise, shopping for something else, taking the cash takings to the bank, dropping some paperwork at the accountants, picking up the car from the garage after a service, etc etc. Loads of reasons really why someone wouldn't wish to be trapped inside a shop for 8-12 hours all day every day - it's just not healthy and when would they get to do other things that are essential to do? I can't imagine the majority of posters on here don't actually leave their workplace at all if they are full time and stuck in a shop/office all day.

Thank you . You have to know your customer and look after them . In turn many will come back. Nobody owes me anything. I do not like those memes about small business owners doing a happy dance, paying their kids whatever etc. I cringe at the go fund me requests and use it or lose it rants… if they don’t use it they won’t loose it, miss it or frankly give a toss !

Some of the tales of rude shopkeepers on this thread are so bad ... Pleased to report I was in two different independent stores in my little town (in Canada) today, and made a purchase in both. Pleasant encounters both times. The owner of one shop does recognize me, and knows my husband, and remarked that he hadn't seen me, or my husband in a while. After reading this thread I'm thinking he wasn't just making small talk and it was passive aggressive. 😆

Ha ha you are so right - we’ve got a business( not a retail one) but are very well regarded for what we do but it’s taken 20 years to build to that level and a lot of consistency even at points where I’ve felt ‘simply bored’ of it and I’m sure my H has too as he’s on a monthly cycle hamster wheel . He does front end creative side, I do back end and I know everyone well from fans to press. It’s hard going running any business that you need to make a proper living from when itsall down to 1 or 2 of you and I think many are unsuited to doing it, but don’t realise it till after they’ve committed.

And I do think that the attitude displayed here, that independent retailers are "playing" at it, with a sense of entitlement, is borne of a bit of jealousy

Why jealousy? If I see that a shop is meant to be open at 9.30 and I get there at 9.45 and it's still not open, why shouldn't I be annoyed? The point is that chains don't get away with it unless there's an extenuating reason, whereas indies think they can do what they like.

Well done . Consistency is key along with getting the fundamentals right. A cafe local to me has an idea and if it hasn’t worked within two weeks they move o to the next idea/menu/concept. Yet to get a cup of coffee in 10 minutes brought to your table the stars must align. The way I do business has changed very little over the last 16 years and that has proved not to be a bad thing. Some people cannot work like that and get carried away with the fluff.

Jealous is the last thing I'd be of an independent retailer or café owner (at least of one who is actually out to make a success of it in business terms).

If they're "playing at it" by being flaky about opening times, or in any of the ways people have highlighted in this thread, then they aren't going to be successful. If they stay open at all then it's because it's a hobby business being subsidised from somewhere.

If they really put in the thought and the research and the grind, then it's a tough job and they may or may not be successful. It's not a line of work I would go into, personally, unless I had a real drive and talent for a particular business and wanted to make it the major part of my life, at least for some years. And I certainly wouldn't go into it at all - even with drive and talent - at a time when I had young kids and no backup (family or paid employees).

What is there to be jealous of?

Those things are luxuries if the business is failing.

By all means start an independent business.

But opening a retail outlet is a massive commitment and shouldn't be done unless you have really thought it through. If you're a one-person-band, then you just cannot do it for the reasons you say.

I've no sympathy with the points you make - unless you can open a shop 9-5 and not just when it's convenient or you feel like it, don't open a shop at all.