To think it is not at all sad that the Women's Institute is now only for actual women?

[SingleSexSpacesInSchools]

“Incredibly sadly, we will have to restrict our membership on the basis of biological sex from April next year,” Green said. “But the message we really want to get across is that it remains our firm belief that transgender women are women, and that doesn’t change.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/dec/03/womens-institute-no-longer-accept-trans-women-members-april

Tellingly - they still think women can have a penis.

You are welcome to explain. Far as I know, the ruling say that under the equality act 2010, the references to woman and man within the context of the act be interpreted in a biology (sex assigned at birth) basis. "The court found that as a matter of ordinary language, the provisions relating to sex discrimination could only be interpreted as referring to biological sex."

Bless you heart, honey. That’s correct. So are y’all going to fight for their rights? Lawful discrimination is still discrimination ubder God’s law.

I don’t believe in God nor do I believe in gendered souls inhabiting a human body.

as far as I am cincerned a transman would be welcome in the WI. But if a transman joined the WI in order to create chaos and upset other women as a retaliation for the removal of transwomen (as I have seen threatened earlier this year about plans for a female only gym in the London area) then that transman can fuck off

Where it may be a proportionate action to restrict access to transmen in my opinion would be toilets, changing rooms and rape crisis and DV shelters, ie places where women may be particularly vulnerable. That would not be discriminatory but would be a direct consequence of the extreme measures taken by the transman to change their appearance.

The FWS action did actually fight for rights for transmen. If the Scottish govt had gotten their way with their plans for gender recognition reform, transmen would have lost their rights and protections in connection to pregnancy and maternity.

Is there any reason why they can’t fight for their own rights? Or are we just expected to be everyone’s mother?

From what I’ve seen on Reddit, it’s mostly men (both “trans women” and other men) deciding that women who identify as men should join these female single sex organisations to fuck things up. Unsurprisingly a lot of these women are getting quite pissed off about it.

Because women, however they identify, are expected to put themselves second.

I don't think the WI can exclude trans identifying women who look very much like men under this doctrine.

That passage applies to women-only services whose rationale is that including men would make the service less effective. Depending on the service, distress to female service users is a relevant consideration.

The WI isn't a service; it's an association for women. Men aren't excluded from the WI (or any female-only association) for any particular reason other than that they are men. Because there's no special reason for excluding men there's no distinctive reason to be able to exclude a woman who looks like a man.

"God's law"

🤣😂🤣😂🤣

Hilarious.

We're not living in a theocracy, thank fuck. And if we were, and it were a Christian one, I suspect you'd find he's all for discrimination. Have you read Leviticus? (It's harder going than the Supreme Court judgement, but the paragraphs are nice and short.)

Well as females with a trans identity (aka transmen) are female, are you saying they shouldn’t be in female spaces? If a male with a trans identity claims to be in danger in male spaces, don’t you think a female would be in more danger? Would you put a “transman” in a male prison? How about male changing rooms? I men, if males are in so much danger in them that they must use female facilities, wouldn’t a female face more risks?

It’s funny how none of the men are suggesting using men’s facilities or groups in laydeee mode as “malicious compliance”.

“Y’all” is an American turn of phrase and reliably indicates that either a poster is not based in the UK (or possibly would like to be thought of as not based in the UK). Such posters tend to deploy arguments from the American “progressive” left and have a poor grasp of custom, attitudes and legislation in the UK. In particular, they have little understanding of the discussions and arguments on these boards that have played out over many years now. You fall firmly into this category with your transman “gotcha”.

If a TIW wished to engage with her sex and join a service for her sex, as a member of her sex, then I would support her rights to do so within the remit of the law and with due consideration for other women, as is the intention behind the law.
In practise this would almost always mean she was welcomed.
If her presence causes distress to other women because she was unmistakable from a man, then I would be unable to welcome her.
While this very unlikely situation would be unfortunate for her, I couldn't justify distressing many women to accommodate one woman, as feminism for me does not generally involve championing the personal liberty of one woman against the interests of other women.So I support this point.
Its also helpful as it closes a potential loop hole that may have been used by TIM to gain access to women's spaces. They would say "How can I be causing more distress to women based on my appearance than this big bearded muscular Transman?" It's useful that the law has provided an answer to this and retained consistency. But unfortunate for TIW that they will be collateral damage from the relentless pressure from some men to access women's spaces.

It's a filibustering time waster.

Hm. There are reasons for excluding men.

The WI is single sex, main aim:

'to advance the education of women and girls for the public benefit'.

Which is what I was discreetly highlighting. Apparently they were a bit too high on their own hubris to catch that. Or just too unpleasant to exercise self-restraint.

I must admit that it's hard to imagine the trauma of attending a lecture on the history of Christmas cake (with tasting) and finding that there's a man in the room.

But yes, if the membership are keen to include transwomen they could vote to admit men generally. I doubt the end result would be very different.

There used to be a facebook group called something like 'transwomen ruin every group'. It gathered examples from women's groups that had admitted men (with trans identity) and were then destroyed by those men.

The dynamics were similar every time. Man with special identity joined, would share some 'vulnerable' personal history, and receive flattery and fawning from the women. Other women would fall silent and self exclude. The group would tend to become centred around the man's identity and eventually implode.

I'll see if it still exists.

Ah, its 'TRAs ruin every group'.

I agree with the principle (even if the point about services v associations passed me by) and that’s one of the reasons I said that as far as I was concerned they could join. But if they started acting out and it was clear that they had joined in retaliation for the exclusion of males then they could fuck off. An organisation does not have to enable and put up with that sort of behaviour.

Transmen with a genuine interest in being part of the WI absolutely should be allowed to join and the fact that they were not allowed but transwomen were was the actual discrimination.

It's not about the topics, it's about the experience women have been told they're getting.

So if it's billed single sex then no men can be allowed in through the back door via their 'gender identity'.

If they want to let men in, then fine, make it unisex.

There's nothing difficult about any of this. They just need to pick a lane.

I think this is for a couple of reasons;

Some men hate women so much that they will take any opportunity to kick us

Some men who are very pro TWAW not because they are super inclusive but because they reject TW from the male class; “he’s not like me so he can go he with the women”.

Yes. Typically when TW are part of a group of women they are front and centre.
Even if the TW is as shy and retiring as its possible to be, and the women are welcoming, women behave differently.
TW often speak of being 'one of the girls', then going on to describe an experience within a group of women where they've never experienced such friendliness, kindness and support and attention.
They think this is the way women are, not realising that this extra special attention is precisely because other women do NOT see them as one of the girls, and are over compensating to be kind/right minded, while treating each other completely differently, no special attention required.
This has the affect of centering the TW at all times as women take care to particularly include him, affirm him, remember his pronouns, and creates an inequality within the group.

Like FB menopause groups where women who don’t use ‘inclusive’ language are scolded and a one who calls into question the presence of a person who by nature cannot experience the menopause get kicked out.

To anyone with a bit of imagination, empathy and life experience, it's obvious why some women would benefit greatly from a single-sex group.

1. Women whose husbands/partners are pathologically jealous when their woman is in the company of men.
2. Women from certain strict religious groups where the sexes are expected to socialise separately.
3. Women who've experienced male violence and have a trauma response to being close to males now.
4. Women who want the chance to talk about exclusively female things to others who understand and may have useful advice.
5. Women who are fed up with being talked over and conversations being dominated by men.

I don't belong to any such group but I surmise that a lot of the benefit would come not so much from the central activity of the group as from the side conversations and friendships that may develop.

I’ve seen more than one video online of for example 3 women and 1 transwoman in a row being interviewed about the experience of women in a particular area of the workforce. The man always dominates the conversation even if he only transitioned 5 minutes ago.