Middle earners punished

[Eucalyptus321]

I am feeling so disheartened and frustrated by how middle earners are constantly suffering at the hands of ridiculous government priorities. My husband and I have a greater household income than other families we know but have less cash in hand due to increased taxes coupled with the fact we receive zero benefits like child benefit or tax free childcare etc. ZERO. If they want middle earners to fund the country thought tax then at least support us with childcare costs. It’s a joke that two parents earning £99k each get childcare funding but parents with one £101k salary and one £25k salary receive nothing. I just need to speak to people who understand the burden of raising a family amidst the current financial climate and then the potential of further tax rises!

Would the average worker accept the 40+% tax to get those services? From this thread, I doubt it!

But you're asset rich?

In a couple of years your nursery fees will have disappeared. I do wonder about your budgeting though.

It's less about jealousy and more about fairness in my view. I'm for a generous welfare state, but it cannot be that the same earners are consistently and repeatedly made into cash cows while getting less and less "value" in return. The tax system needs a complete overhaul and I can't understand why there isn't more emphasis on closing loopholes/taxing sectors of the economy that aren't currently taxed (whether that is individuals or companies) etc. Apparently on Amazon alone VAT evasion could be worth up to £700m a year, corporation tax over £500m a year, just two examples...

Be interesting to hear what you actually take home though.

I was having a conversation with a friend of mine about this - turns out, she takes home significantly more than I do, working PT with a UC top up.

To me, that makes no sense at all. She gets to work less, earn more and spend more time at home. Please make this make sense.

Sorry what. I earn over £100k and DH planned to leave his lower paid job when I was pregnant as his whole salary would have been childcare fees.

It wouldn’t be him paying for them, we don’t have his and hers money, it’s all family money. But the obvious preference was to have a parent home parenting the child if it was going to be the same cost as childcare fees for 10 hours a day.

I’m not judging anyone who uses childcare, or keeps their career, but our lives would be better with someone at home full time. The only reason we don’t do this is because we like the money. If the money was being spent so we could just both go to work, it was pointless.

And DH has a penis too!

Absolute rubbish. It’s quite simple really you can’t afford children don’t have them. I don’t ask you to pay for mine so why should I pay for yours.

I think the major issue this thread highlights is the lack of financial astuteness in the UK. To argue that you’re worse off earning £100k than £25k (yep, look above) is just….well being fucking thick to be honest

They ought to disincentivise people having multiple children to increase their benefit entitlement. To combat child poverty, they should give them vouchers for the things they need.

Agreed! And to be fair we don’t have faith enough in the government to believe they would do it if we did. We want low taxes, high social benefits - very hard!
Sweden is high tax, high social benefits.
we are high tax, low social benefits. Worst way to be.

Does your husband work for himself or an employer?

Yep. When I was a lower earner and my kids were younger I was absolutely broke. Now managed to focus on my career now they’re older and earning an OKish amount and get shafted. Fed up.

Yep, agree! My post wasn’t about all this in general, as I don’t have the expertise. I was looking for people in the same situation as me that I could discuss it with. Perhaps I came to the wrong website.

No? I have a flat I let out with negative equity because it’s dropped in price since we bought it (to live in, and then couldn’t sell), and have a few thousand in equity in the house we live in (a £300k house when we bought it with a 95% mortgage 6 years ago). And two cars each worth less than £10k.

I’m not sure you do pay for mine considering I’m a high earner. But let’s consider you did. Do you genuinely want to see UK kids dying of starvation? If a ‘feckless’ parent has children they ‘can’t afford’, are you arguing that child should die? Be clear here

It doesn’t make sense

You're right, but also wrong because that income does not lake you a middle earner, which is in fact the main issue this country is facing. You should be middle earners, if the economy had continued to grow, instead of which you're in the top few %.,. if tax rates hadn't been endlessly frozen we'd be paying 20% tax up to about a salary of 80k and the top rate would be at 200k.

I'm so bloody sick of hearing about "the vulnerable". Serious fatigue.

Well if you were happier go back to being a lower earner - no-ones saying you can’t!

It's all just victim bullshit, yep. Policy by victimhood.

I don't know if there is a group labour/Rachel reeves hasn't poo poo'd all over. I won't be long before every red seat is wiped off the political map.

And if they want to support children from some poorer families, please give money to school to feed and cloth the children properly and provide what they need. Fund social services to help stop neglect.

Throwing endless money at some parents to end poverty isn't always the right response. Sometimes it just goes on more deliveroos, very expensive phones and branded clothing. I don't aim that at conscientious parents struggling...but I just know a good few people who have more disposable income for utter crap who are living on benefits and the kids still don't get fed proper food and basic needs met. Money isn't always the answer. Rant over. Fund the services to support the vulnerable in society. That's what I mean I think.

I think the childcare cut off is unfair and does need looking at but I do wonder how much the childcare fees of low earners are actually being subsidised by higher earners. I don't know the statistics but pretty much all the low earners I know haven't put their children in nursery and rely on parents or work different hours to their partners. I think it is seen as very middle class thing to put young children in childcare.

I wish there was a way for low earners to 'gift' the hours they don't use. I know that is probably widely unrealistic but it is a bit of a farce that the group who apply for the hours don't want them and the group that desperately want them can't have them.

Well maybe you’ve transcended being human:…congrats:… I guess

I don’t feel I should be subsidised, I just want to be part of a society that values me and doesn’t just see me as a resource to be exploited.

I am a high earner, single, no children. I have always worked incredibly hard and have taken a lot of risks to be a high earner, For every £1 I earn I pay around 47p in tax. Out of of what remains, I have lived frugally and saved and saved to build some capital so that I can pay for my parents’ care (which I am now doing) and in due course my own.

I am glad to pay reasonable tax as that is what I need to give to have the benefit of living in a civil society and know that I am contributing but I am exhausted. I am starting to feel like a cash cow just there to be milked and despised for being stupid enough to have tried so hard and that we are not all in this together. After the budget, I am predicted to be paying around 51p for every £1 I earn. Every week, I will be working until Wednesday afternoon before I start to receive any part of the money I am earning. I am starting to wonder whether it is worth it and I should wind down and take my 51p with me.

That's all very well but they share their bank accounts with me as part of the support we give and if their net income is the same as mine (and I earn 60k/year in a tough public sector job) then something isn't right. If I posted on Mumsnet that I was struggling and said my salary was £60k I would be told I was loaded and had no right to complain. Yet my net income is the same as a mum with 3 kids working 16 hours a week in an entry level job.