To ask how much you think income tax will rise by?

[Wonderofwimbledon]

We’re absolutely financially at our limit… I’m so incredibly stressed. An income tax rise will break us and we won’t be able to afford it. We won’t have money to eat.

What do you think it’ll be? I just want to curl up and cry- we can’t take anymore increases our bills , mortgage everything has increased we have no spare money at all

Yes pp are a bit oblivious on this one.

It’s still a massive tax hike hitting the economy and causing Reeves and Starmer issues.

I’m guessing they’re realising just how problematic since they’re facing breaking the manifesto pledge.

Apart from a few on here most will be pissed off by tax rises.

I'd also have no problem paying more tax if I felt like it being spent effectively, but it isn't. Welfare payments are growing, it now looks like pensions will be taxed discouraging people being responsible for their retirements, NHS is unproductive. If you are raising taxes you need to make bold moves to show people what they are getting.

Firstly no one knows whats being proposed
secondly based on your post

So ????

it won’t affect you so it doesn’t matter ???

I think an increase on income tax is probably necessary, so I'll grumble and pay up. But I want economic competence and effective spending even more. Why should we graft if there's no matching attempt to control waste and limit benefits?

Agree

but if Labour are raising taxes in this way they need to justify they are tackling overspending
They need to cut the benefits bill and go back to the white paper that was voted down

They said Theyd look at it….so what’s happening ??

In what way is wanting a social safety net and good public services self-righteous nonsense or virtue signalling?

In what way is wanting the wealth of the sixth biggest economy in the world to be used for the benefit of 99% of the population rather than to line the pockets of the 1% in any way a bad thing?

The poorest 50% of the population own 5% of the nations private wealth.

The top 10% own 57% and that gap is widening and that is before the estimated 35% of wealth owned by the very wealthiest that is kept in off shore accounts or undeclared assets like artwork is taken into account.

The wealthier someone is, the easier it is to compound that wealth through property purchase, pensions or risker investments. Many of those 'investments' only make money because of the workers who work for the companies gaining value or because of the consumer habits of those workers.

It is highly doubtful that the majority of people who cry foul about taxing the rich through a wealth tax are actually in the bracket that would be affected.

But people have been conditioned to believe that they might, one day, be rich enough to be affected if they just work that little bit harder.

So they argue against it now while agreeing that the best thing to do is make those pesky benefit claimants take the brunt of the cuts instead.

It is easy to blame Annie who is claiming sickness benefit because she's in excruciating pain having waited 18 month for an operation or Johnny who works a 40 hour week in a manual job at minimum wage and claims UC top up and housing benefit just to keep a roof over his families head and feed his kids. Those situations are easy to understand and look down on.

Its a whole lot more difficult to say hey Tarquin - how about you buy one less luxury car this year and pay some tax on that £100 million you've got stashed in the Cayman Islands.

Heaping tax rise upon tax rise on the ‘broadest shoulders’ is wholly unsustainable.

In any event, the budget will see the less able having to share the pain. Very few will be immune.

The pressure for the government to tackle the welfare budget will grow and grow. I sense many people are at or are beyond tipping point.

I haven’t got an employer. Presumably you missed the carefully chosen first two words of my post?

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

Yes it changes behaviour and now Reeves and Starmer need another £40bn odd.

They could sell in the last budget with some nonsense about ‘working people’ but it won’t work this time.

Tarquin pays tax on cash he has stashed in the Cayman Islands fgs. The Cayman Islands are one of many, many offshore jurisdictions that data share with HMRC to ensure Tarquin - if a UK domiciled citizen - pays tax on his cayman island investments. You’re allowed to invest in companies and funds set up in the Cayman Islands.

It’s so frustrating to see so many people think that someone else - in this case the mythical ‘Tarquin’ can bail us all out. Taxes cannot always be paid by ‘someone not me’. yOU need to pay more tax. I need to pay more tax. EVERYONE needs to pay more tax if we want to get out of the hole we’re in just now.

I totally agree with you. No point paying more taxes of our current welfare system is just driving more people onto welfare! I don't feel that there is a social contract anymore, just entitlement. It's wrong that you can get more on benefits than minimum wage.

If I were the Tories I'd be speaking to every person who works at a Tesco bakery, delivery driver, nighttime cleaner. People all bothering to show up and contribute to society.

Basic UC is £400pm. That is not more than someone on NMW.

People on UC do not get more than those on NMW (which probably receive UC as a top up and/or help with housing).

My concern is - Reeves is about to break the promises she made last October (as well as the manifesto), and therefore there is no longer any taboo. What’s to stop her doing it again, and again, and again? She’s clearly comfortable deploying various excuses.

Regrettably, I see tax rises for the remainder of this parliament, with either a political or financial crisis being the only mechanisms to stop it.

Local government pension schemes are funded by the employee. They are self funded from investment returns and members contributions.

NHS and Armed forces are funded by current contributions and general taxes.

Yes you might be right.

No. But a combination of UC, housing benefit and PIP does.

How many people do you think are in receipt of all three of those benefits? I bet they’d trade them in for not having a disability.

Not every one gets the housing element, and not everyone is on PIP.
PIP is totally separate, is not means tested and is not an out of work benefit. People getting it are disabled. Take their money away, but please take away the reason they get it too.

Someone on basic UC and housing element is still not getting more than someone on NMW. And people on NMW will most likely be getting UC too because housing costs have got crazy.

Oh, and you can also be on NMW and claiming all 3 too.

So as someone who has faced struggle due to poor public services and increasing prices you'd rather everyone in the poorest section of society be stripped of benefits because a small number of them are taking the piss?

It isn't right that tax thresholds are frozen, and it won't be right if the increase in tax is applied to the basic rate. Its not about you needing to give up more of what you have without complaint.

Its about directing your anger at the people responsible for making such a mess of the economy in the first place - and that is not people claiming benefits no matter what their motivation to work

The problem I see with the tax hikes is that those who are shouldering the most burden, also use less of the public services being paid for. We had several friends who pay 6 figures in tax every year and are happy to do so, but they also have private health insurance, use private schools. We have friends who have gone part time and are paying into pensions heavily to reduce their taxable income while their kids are still in childcare so they still qualify for free hours, one of the few benefits they actually have access to. A few friends have said they would rather go to a 4 day week or 9 day fortnight to drop their income, rather than pay more tax on top of what they already do because they’re sick of footing the bill for everyone else. Obviously we’re incredibly lucky to be in the position we’re in that an increase in tax won’t have a huge effect on our monthly outgoings, but when we already pay SO much tax, and pay for private services to stop the gaps when we can’t access public services we should be able to, and have the fucking stress that comes with doing the job which brings these sort of incomes, it feels galling to have our pockets raided even further. You can’t continue to rely on the top earners (who are often middle class, I don’t include those who have genuine wealth, oftentimes inherited) to foot the bill.

Don't be so naive!

Tarquin would only pay tax on that money if it was stashed it in a personal account. If he truly had to pay the same amount of tax on the money in the Cayman Islands, there would be no benefit to keeping it there would there?

It is much more likely that money is in a complex business structure to enable profit without having to pay tax under reciprocal arrangements which only applies to personal wealth and he is able to do that because he can afford to access the relevant financial and legal advice.

In either case it would be much more beneficial to the economy if that money stayed within the UK banks, thus circulating in our economy, through UK investment than supporting the economy of the Cayman Islands.

If you think it is right that the top 10% continue to accumulate more and more of the nations wealth while being able to avoid taxes simply because they can afford the mechanisms that allow them to do so, then you are utterly deluded.

The majority of ordinary people already pay a significantly higher proportion of their money in tax than the wealthiest do.

People invest in the Cayman Islands for reasons other than dodging personal tax. You know that surely? Regulation is far lower. Investing there is quicker to set up and cheaper to regulate. There are far fewer protections if it all goes wrong, but some people are fine with that.

Neither of the two main parties will tell you this but tax on basic rate taxpayers fell under the Tories, whereas tax on the higher rate taxpayers soared. Just how much more do you think higher rate tax payers should pay? They give and they give and they give and they’re well and truly sick of it.

Of course Hunt cynically cut NI knowing that the Tories would lose the election. Labour should have reversed that cut in the following budget. I think it was a mistake not to call that out for the move it was and state that intention in the manifesto.