Angry at house seller?

[perfectpotato]

Had our offer accepted, in the middle of the legal process and we’ve had got the fixtures and fittings form from the vendors.

They are taking with them all the column radiators (will be replacing with basic ones), all light fixtures - they had these beautiful sconce marble light fixtures that they will be taking and they are have a fixed mirror in the bathroom, has Bluetooth and different lighting and they are taking that too.

My partner doesn’t seem bothered but I’m really upset, Aibu?

Well no, it’s removable, so a fitting. As in ‘fitted kitchen’. Fixtures are permanent parts of the structure of the building. On one of our purchases the seller advised at the viewing that they would be removing the fitted wardrobes in the smallest bedroom, as they were suitable for their new property. Our solicitor advised that they were within their rights to do so as long as they declared it in the TA10 and made good any damage incurred in the process. In the event they redecorated the room after dismantling the furniture.

It didn’t make any difference to the value of the property, it just gave us leverage to negotiate a reduction for the cost of the replacements.

What...what do you think the "value" of the property is?

Because I think it's the price it actually sells for.

So if you used the fact that a fitting turned out to be of lower standard than you priced into your original offer to negotiate a lower price, then absolutely it affected the value!

I am also confused about what "value" is here @OooPourUsACupLove if I am honest

We revised the offer downwards after the survey and the seller refused at first and we had to offer higher and take a bit of a loss or lose the house, which we really wanted. When we raised this with the solicitor afterwards he confirmed that the seller was under no obligation to accept a lower offer as the surveyor had agreed that the asking price was a fair reflection of the value of the property - the older double glazing hadn’t affected the value.

Conversely, on a subsequent purchase the surveyor valued the house we were buying at £5000 less than the asking price - l think it was based on the value of other similar properties in the area. The seller was advised to take our revised lower offer based on the survey because had they refused and we had pulled out, they would have found it difficult to realise the previous asking price after a lower valuation. I think intrinsic value is more complicated than it seems on the face of it.

@perfectpotato that seems very strange, edpecially the radiators, have never heard anyone doing that. That coukd leace a big of a mess.

This happened to us re light fittings and something else (can't remember) we got the solicitors to confirm with them if they were removed that they had to be removed by a qualified electrician and that we wanted confirmation in writing. They left them !

When were buying our house and we got particulars they said they were taking the plantation blinds! We said then you better make good any damage! They then offered to leave them for a certain price. We counter offered with a lower price and they accepted. I mean what would be the chances of them buying another house where they would fit?
The house we were selling was £5000 under the asking price. We had a fridge freezer with a water and ice dispenser which was plumbed in. We also had a range cooker both were barley a year old. We said we would leave them if they paid the asking price and they were happy to do so. This enabled us to buy new in our new house after we had remodeled the kitchen so they could fit.
We wouldn't have dreamt of taking the radiators!

We bought a house and they spent ages showing us the fancy bluetooth mirrors with lights and music (this was when they first came out) and they took the bloody things with them!! AND on one of them they left the wire, dangling above the sink and it was live. Luckily my husbands best mate is an electrician and could whip round, test it and cap it but it was really dangerous thing to have in the bathroom.

They also took the remote for the electric fake fire (likely a mistake but highly annoying) and the breakfast bar!! Which was ikea and so not a fixture apparently, when we disputed this. Oh and the ensuite shower didnt work.

Call the estate agent and say you’re incredibly disappointed and have concerns about radiators being changed and then leaking and wires being left from mirror and also the tiles behind being ruined and now on show!

maybe you could negotiate it all being left? Or look at other properties!

Ok it's a minor grammatical mistake. I said "I would pull out", as I already know she hasn't bought the house yet. I meant "you decided to buy the house".

I remember visiting a friend in his new house and they had indeed taken the stair rails.

Right OP you go back and say your offer is dropping by 1k for the cost of nice radiators and plumber. Absolutely bloody ridiculous.

Radiators - no I wouldn’t take! I’m not sure what a Bluetooth mirror does that any other mirror does not! But sure as shit I would be taking my light fittings, mine cost a fortune and I consider them like my furniture - I picked them for a reason and they’d be coming with me!

When I bought my house, the seller took virtaully everything (although not radiators thankfully!) She took light all fittings (replaced with basic dangly bulbs, except for the wall fitting lights which were left with bare wires sticking out), she took ALL the curtain poles, despite downsizing to a smaller house where she definitely had no use for them all, she even took the dressing gown hooks from the back of the bathroom doors. Although she did miss one dressing gown hook in the guest ensuite - I felt like taking it off and posting it to her with a note saying ‘you missed one’…

That’ll buy two cast iron radiators!!

Those saying the "value" of the house is only in the bricks & mortar (and presumably the roof?), are you really suggesting that a well maintained house with a £50k fitted kitchen with marble worktops & surrounds, £30k bathroom with marble again & top of the range walk in shower & jacuzzi bath, real wood or travertine marble flooring throughout etc is worth the same as my pretty basic house with a 20 year old kitchen with laminate work surfaces & B&Q cupboards, bog standard bathroom with cheap shower over a basic bath, & either cheap worn carpets, laminate flooring or sheet vinyl flooring, gutters/sofits/fascias needing replacing soon - if they are the same bricks & mortar?

I know perfectly well that if/when the time comes to sell my house it will be worth at least £20-30k less maybe worse than any other identical house in the street as it stands now despite them all being terraces build the same.

Anyone in a position to put that little lot in a terrace wouldn’t be living in one in the first place.

put it another way, a freshly revamped house with the cheapest choices from B&Q will be worth exactly the same as the one with "top of the range" kitchen/bathroom marble everywhere.

not having to do any work and it looking new might be worth a bit extra, but they're still terrace and there's only so much a fresh coat of paint adds in value.

Nitpicking. OK, put the same conditions on a nice detached 4 bedroom house in a very "nice" area.

How do you think developers make their money? They buy a tatty house and do it up and sell it for plenty more than the cost of the initial purchase, the materials, and the labour.

Quite a lot of developers do most of the work themselves to maximise the profit. There’s a limit to how much value you can add to a house without losing money because its price needs to bear comparison with its neighbours.

@Allergictoironing
Exactly...I can't get over what I've just learned...that even kitchen units are not "fixtures". So if a house has a bespoke "Smallbone of Devizes" kitchen (worth a fortune), the seller can replace with a cheap laminate basic range one and as long as they declare it on the form, that's OK.

Also, cast iron radiators are what gives a house its period "feel", just like original fireplaces etc.

The value of such a house with cast iron radiators, original marble fireplaces and a Smallbone kitchen, will be worth FAR more than the house next door which has had all the original features ripped out and tatty and basic kitchen and bathroom.

Wonder what Kirsty and Phil would say?

You need to stop treating a house purchase as something moral and personal.

It's a legal transaction. It's irrelevant if it's "right or wrong", what matters is if it's legal. It's your own interest to know what can or can't happen, and make sure what is important to you is very clear in the process, not expect the seller to be unwilling to maximise the amount he can get from the property.

It doesn't mean they WILL strip the house, but go with your eyes open and know that something being on the pretty photos of the EA listing doesn't mean it will be included in the sale when legally it does not have to be.

Yes, but that doesn't detract from the fact it must be worth that time they are spending for them to do it.

I know all about local ceilings and comps, though of course those change over time and it can be possible to push that local ceiling by a small percentage with every sale in that area.

However whichever way you slice it, a very nicely done up house will be worth more to purchasers than a scruffy dump, as if nothing else it saves them the time & money it would cost them to get the house to the standard they want.

I know I don't have the physical ability to do work on any house I own due to disability, and I don't deal well with stress any more, so if I wanted a nice house with posh fixtures I either need to buy one already in that condition or pay someone to do the upgrade work. Therefore if I view 2 houses & one is say £30k more expensive but the other would cost me £50k to put in the same state, I'll buy the more expensive one. If I found out mid-sale that it was going to lose all those nice extras I thought I was paying for, I wouldn't buy it.

I’ve bought a few properties in my time and despite seeing myself as quite savvy, have clearly been labouring under huge misconceptions as to what constitutes “fixtures”.

This thread has been a real eye opener!

the pettiness of some people is shockingly endless, but as long as it's legal, there's not much you can so, so better be prepared .

how much money does one save on keeping the loo roll, when they just sold a half a million pounds or more house? 😂😂