Angry at house seller?

[perfectpotato]

Had our offer accepted, in the middle of the legal process and we’ve had got the fixtures and fittings form from the vendors.

They are taking with them all the column radiators (will be replacing with basic ones), all light fixtures - they had these beautiful sconce marble light fixtures that they will be taking and they are have a fixed mirror in the bathroom, has Bluetooth and different lighting and they are taking that too.

My partner doesn’t seem bothered but I’m really upset, Aibu?

Why do they want radiators? It’s pretty obvious why.

Radiators are part of the house.

People who take all the expensive fittings after using them to get a higher price offer ARE CF.

sorry if the truth hurts you but it is still the truth. Its deliberately underhanded to mislead up until the paper work stage when people have spent money and feel trapped into buying.

Exactly this. It will be the flooring or doors next. Most of which won't fit in new house probably.

Just a tactic to make OP offer more money.

It can feel bit like Maccies advertiment vs what you get, doesn't it.

Fair enough if people want to keep these things, but lots of it is part of the "character" people pay for as well as fixture reasonably expected to be included when people offer.
Like door, fireplaces, kitchen cabinet door etc. Rather than ceiling light (unless very very good and original or something).
So imho they should be taken out or it shpuld be made clear on viewing.

My take on this is to say you are ok with them taking things.

But counter with the fact that everything must be put back to an acceptable un noticable condition.

For example, you can remove the mirror but if it has electric power supply then this must be either removed or reconnected to a replacement. If there is tiling around the specific mirror this must be put right. If there is discolouration behind the mirror then this must be redecorated.

The same kind of stipulations apply to all the radiators too.

Basically, they are fine to go and remove those fixtures but in doing so they must not cause damage or reduced value in the house that you would have to immediately have to put right.

Lets see if saving a few quid on a few fixtures and fittings they thought they could rip out is really so attractive if they have to redecorate everything.

Remember this works both ways. Its their contact to say their intentions. Its also your contract to say what you will accept before completing the purchase. You can definately say no

There is some iffy legal advice going on here.

For those saying the radiators are fixtures or the radiators were in estate agent pictures and are therefore included are wrong. In England no sale is final or binding until a contract is signed. Whatever is included in the contract is what matters. You can include in the contract any exceptions you want as long as both parties agree and sign.

Is it abnormal to remove the radiators, yes. If you have some expensive and fancy radiators is it slightly understandable, also yes.
Is the Op understandable to be a bit frustrated, yes again.

Op your options are basically:

1. Accept it move on
2. Push back and drop your offer
3. Offer to give them a bit of money to keep them

If nothing was mentioned about the radiators in the viewings or earlier in the contract process, I would definitely pull out. You bought the house, thinking it was worth what it was worth with column radiators.

💯 this!

The OP hasn't bought the house. The viewing and making offers stage is just haggling. Everything on both the buyer and the seller side is changeable until contracts are exchanged. Until exchange either side can pull out, either side can change their mind about price and either side can change their mind about what they want included in the sale.

I’m on the fence about the radiators.

My copper column radiators cost a bloody fortune. It would be far cheaper for me to have them removed and refitted with big standard screw fix radiators than to leave them and buy them again.

Was your offer well under the advertised price? If so then I'm not surprised they are keeping their expensive nice fixtures and fittings. When we had to take a low offer I'd have chipped the Victorian tiles from the wall if I could have done. I did take my expensive French lighting and replaced it with some cheap ones from a car boot sale. It's still in a box in the garage as it doesn't fit here. Petty yes I know.

The form is the basis of the contract on what is included so you have a choice to pull out if it really means that much to you.

That's all fine but if no-one tells the vendor you planned to do that then their offer would, quite reasonably, be made with the expectation that the radiators would be left. It's fine to take them but should be clear from the outset. If I was the OP I would reduce my offer to reflect the fact that I had to reinstate decent radiators (which I thought I was buying when I offered on the house).

My living room light fitting are antique and unique and rescued from my parents house. They are a personal item which belong to me nor were they original to my house. The same with curtains, my taste, my purchase to take with me if I want.
Radiators might be slightly different but statement radiators are a personal purchase. If you leave functional radiators then surely that's all you need to do.

When you buy a house you are paying for bricks and mortar and location. The accessories probably don't feature much in the valuation as they really are just dressing the house.

I don't think you're being unreasonable at all. It's normal to buy a house with its fixtures and fittings and I assume one of the reasons you offered was because you liked them. Unless it was made clear before you offered, if I were you I would get straight back to the agents and say that as they're taking this stuff away your offer has dropped by the cost of replacing them - £25,000 (including labour and making good).

Their advice was to pull out you then basically wrote the same thing saying 'their only option is to pull out'... not sure why you felt the need to be pedantic to this poster and over explain just to say the EXACT same thing they said.

I disagree - I think it's totally unreasonable. I bet when you went to view the property the column radiators were a key feature you fell in love with and no doubt one the estate agent drew attention to in the particulars for the property.

I think it comes down to what you were led to believe when you put the offer in. Did the estate agent listing etc explicitly state the house had these fittings? What did the estate agent say on the viewings? If neither mentioned these then the seller probably isn’t being unreasonable.

People really need to understand that what they think their house is worth doesn't matter if no buyers agree with them.

In your head you "had" to take a low offer, but in reality you took the highest offer anyone was prepared to make within whatever constraints you placed on the sale.

In reality you took the highest offer anyone was prepared to make within whatever constraints you placed on the sale

Exactly. Well said.

All this is fine as long as you are upfront so the buyer can factor it into their offer.

Because while you may think you are just selling "bricks and mortar and location", from the buyer's perspective they need to factor in the overall cost of the purchase - what they pay you for the house plus whatever else they may need to do to bring it into the condition they want it. So the more work they have to do after purchase, the lower their offer will be to allow for that.

If you don't make it clear at initial viewings what you plan to take and what you plan to take is unusual like expensive radiators, do not be surprised if the buyers reduce their offer or withdraw because the additional work they are now facing means other properties are now more attractive. The sale has to work for them as well as you.

I feel your pain! At least you know ahead of time that they plan to do this. Many years ago, we moved into a lovely house where the vendors had stripped out every light fitting leaving bare wires, and removed all the downstairs cloakroom tiles and half of the TV antenna booster. If we hadn't stopped them, the removers would have dismantled the stair rails as well.

@OooPourUsACupLove All you have to leave are functional light fittings which are functional and safe.
And a heating system with functioning radiators.

I have never put "nice radiators" in my filters whilst house hunting.
Yes they should mention if they are removing them, but certainly should have to lower the price .

Unless you also hide the estate agent's pictures while house hunting and wear a blindfold to viewings I think you are being a little disingenuous here.

Viewers take the standard of decoration, maintence and fixtures and fittings into account when they offer.

So if you plan to leave it in a worse decorative or appointed state than they view it, or take anything that might be a grey area like the currently installed radiators, for your own sake it's better to be upfront so your buyers do not make offers that they then have to revise once they have the true picture.

You know nothing of the circumstances of this sale.

Given the energy performance rating which you have to have done before selling will have been based on the radiators in situ when the assessor came to look at everything.
Changing radiators so drastically will make the certificate worthless and will need to be done again.