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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Pure rage - toxic colleague has job in my new place

122 replies

Lotsnlotsoflove · 14/10/2025 21:34

Excuse the long post.

My previous job to my current one was a step up in terms of leadership and responsibility and I was excited to take on a new challenge, leading a team and creating a shared vision in a top organisation in my sector. As soon as I began the job, it was obvious all was not well in the team I had been employed to lead, colleagues refused to talk to each other or collaborate, nobody understood their role, and hugely inexperienced people had been given management roles way above their qualifications and experience. For example, it is standard in my industry that senior leaders have a PhD or equivalent and people had been employed in leadership roles with UG degree and barely two years of industry experience. One of these particular people was difficult from the start, she kicked up a huge fuss when I asked to meet all members of the team one on one (I was the line manager) to get a sense of individuals and set shared targets as we moved forward, and refused to meet me without another colleague present. I found this odd, as I had never met her ahead of working in the company and certainly hadn't had any negative interactions. In our one on one she got very angry and began to cry when I brought up that a budget line she had some responsibility for (though my predecessor was the overall budget holder) was overspending due to a misunderstanding about the allocation of funds available for particular things. It later transpired she had been hired by my previous role holder, who she was very fond of, and who had appointed her without the requisite qualifications and 'mentored' her in her role, which had meant doing all of the leadership tasks on her behalf. This could not continue under my leadership and I made it clear everyone with leadership responsibilty (and therefore salaries of £60k plus) would need to do their role.

The whole job was extremely difficult, with the management of interpersonal conflict and staff grievances happening from day one. The member of staff I allude to above was hugely central in this culture of formal grievance making and in the first six months I was there took out grievances against staff as well as complaints about our customer base on a more than monthly basis - all on the grounds of racism against her. The organisation I was in had a huge anti-racism policy and took a 'no holds barred' attitude to investigating and rooting out racism — investigations took place and inevitably there was no evidence of racism, or in one case evidence that some bias may have impacted decision making, although this could not be proven (as a senior leader I saw all the independent investigation reports, all of which cost the company many thousands of pounds). About half of the people investigated found the process so stressful that they went on long-term sick leave and then resigned from the post.

As an aside, and because it is relevant, this colleague was not the only person of colour in the organisation, or my team, although she was the only Black senior woman on my team. It is also relevant that our industry is hugely invested in anti-racism, and part of every institution includes specialist EDI and anti-racist departments (which I think is necessary, and do not in any way object to - simply to say, being cast as racist is a reputationally damaging way beyond what it might be in even most reasonably progressive workplaces).

It became obvious that she did not have the experience to carry out the role on her own, which wasn't surprising given her lack of skills, experience and qualifications. HR worked with me to support her development through coaching and leadership training, including one-to-one mentorship with an external Black leader of her choice, costing over £15k. At year's end her department had massively underperformed and an organisational traffic light system (arranged and operated by the exec board, not me) highlighted every aspect of her performance as 'red' (required urgent change).

Anyway, about a year into the role I got pregnant. During this time, my colleague's behaviour escalated. She stopped attending meetings against company policy, took out yet more grievances against colleagues and refused to meet one-to-one with any of her direct reports. Meanwhile, I was very ill with gestational diabetes, anemia and other pregnancy complications. On the day I went on maternity leave, she took out a grievance against me for racist harassment, it was completely vexatious and full of out and out untruths or completely misrepresented the facts. My company insisted I undergo the investigation process on mat leave, so two weeks postpartum I had to participate in a long round of meetings, intrusive interviews with external investigators and evidence gathering that took the entire six months of my maternity to conclude. Fortunately, I had evidence to refute every point and witnesses to corroborate my statements. The investigation found no case to answer and recommended any record of the process was struck from my record. No action was taken against my colleague (who I get is free to make accusations, and the employer is duty bound to follow them up).

It goes without saying that this was hugely stressful. I left the organisation soon after and began a case for constructive dismissal on the basis of the handling of my case, which they settled ahead of a tribunal for tens of thousands of pounds. I found a new job at the same rank in a much nicer company soon after, am thriving here and have moved on. Two years have passed. However, the toxic colleague who was let go from the last place earlier this year has somehow managed to get a job here. As I understand it from a friend at the last job she was given a severance package that included a glowing reference. I am horrified I will have to work in her proximity, and today, when I bumped into her in the staff canteen, I was overcome with emotion. I am so shocked, and seriously considering leaving a job I love, so I don't have to be near this person. Is there anything I can realistically do to move on psychologically from this? Part of me feels that I need to let it go and accept she has a different perspective on the events of our last job to me. I am not in her team at this place, so contact will be minimal. AIBU to feel so angry and upset that I need to work with this person?

OP posts:
LooseCanyon · 15/10/2025 19:29

Sadworld23 · 15/10/2025 19:20

Hrft but definitely get on there first.
Ime and I've a fair bit of toxic experience, people believe the first story they hear.

You have it couch it right though. Don't go in and complain about Xtoxic, but be positive about her.
EG whilst discussing something else with manager,
I am pleased to see Xtoxic is doing so well after the troubles she had at x name employer. So glad you've given her another chance as I've been so happy here .

Good luck, Xtoxic sounds painful .

Maybe RTFT then. OP's manager is not colleague's manager.

Sadworld23 · 15/10/2025 19:34

LooseCanyon · 15/10/2025 19:29

Maybe RTFT then. OP's manager is not colleague's manager.

Doesn't matter. What matters is Ops manager hears it first from OP. Xtoxics manager is irrelevant.OP is then not trying to make trouble for Xtoxic by speaking to Xtoxic's manager.

Thanks for filling me in though.

momtoboys · 15/10/2025 19:38

I was in a similar situation two years ago and I didn't handle it the way I should have. I have been in a upper management position for 20 years. I've never had anyone take a grievance against me for anything. The story is too convoluted to go into but the person was a new hire and she went to HR every day with some sort of complaint. This went on for a couple of months. I just sat back and let the process play out. I answered every question I was asked, offered to meet with here one on one (with HR present) she refused, I could only communicate with her via email and each email my superior was cc'd. Everyone she spoke to she trashed my name and my reputation too a hit. It took a real toll on my mental health. An investigation was done. They found nothing that I had done wrong, and still she continued. I should have stood up for myself. I should have gotten ahead of it. Go, tell your supervisor. It won't be dramatic, it will be facts.

SemiRetiredLoveGoddeess · 15/10/2025 19:38

It seems to be the norm theses days for former good organisations to employ a lot of completely wrong people for the job

They are either vastly under qualified, very inexperienced because their age or just not suitable.

This practise started over 40 years ago and follows in some ways the Business Process and ReEngineering Model in many ways. Chopping huge swayves of management from companies and is very toxic.

As long as a position is filled. They don't really care about who fills it. T
heir products, customers or services.j Just profitability

Governments love hem and back them and their friends to the hilt.

As for the woman with the race problem. She sounds like a real nightmare and very cunning. She seems to be using her race card big time.

So to hat she is untouchable and wants everybody to be frightened of here.

Maybe in it for compensation and damages as well. Knew someone like her who worked in the Voluntary Sector years ago

Hope you get things sorted out soon

Wooky073 · 15/10/2025 19:58

Don’t ditch your job. Speak to HR. State her regular grievances raised by this person against you and harassment of you on may leave via further complaints. Say she needs to be kept away from you. Control the narrative. Make cow the issue. HR can handle it

AlphaApple · 15/10/2025 20:21

I completely understand how you are feeling, I have had similar experiences but not nearly as bad and I would feel the same.

Thankfully you will have minimal interaction with her. You are established, known and trusted in your organisation. You have the backing of your manager. You are in a strong position. Confide in your manager and then put it all to the back of your mind.

It's possible she has changed. You don't know what's happened in the intervening years. I'm not saying that to say you should give her a second chance - far from it - but she may have learnt her lesson.

All best to you and your DD.

Orders76 · 15/10/2025 20:56

If contact will be minimal, try to do some coaching to let it go.
Additionally, ensure she doesn't try to wrangle into any of your teams projects so that she can become any kind of problem to you, boundaries are your friend here.

99bottlesofkombucha · 15/10/2025 21:09

LooseCanyon · 15/10/2025 18:06

I don't think OP should use the word "vexatious". It is an accusation in itself and could be seen as - vexatious.

Although, as OP knows, I don't think they should say anything to anyone at work.

Vexatious is exactly the accurate factual word the op should use about a woman who has raised many grievances which have been demonstrably false and the expensive, traumatic for those involved, investigations have shown this to be the case.

99bottlesofkombucha · 15/10/2025 21:10

InSpainTheRain · 15/10/2025 17:34

So I had a similar situation to OP, there was no settlement involved and it wasn't as severe though. I worked with a woman who was just awful (many grievances raised, awful to some individuals, I mostly escaped her attention luckily). I changed companies, and just as the OP says - this woman also moved to my new company about 14 months after me.

I can't tell you what is right or wrong to do, but I simply went to my line manager and told him the facts and dates. I gave no opinions about what happened, or how I felt, just the facts. I then told him it was of course up to him what he did with the information. I felt I had established myself in the role by then and was respected as someone who worked well and over-achieved on their targets. My boss dealt with it, I don't know what happened (didn't ask) but she failed her probationary review and after an extension failed again then left.

This is what the op should do. Factual, calm, open.

Spinmerightroundbaby · 15/10/2025 21:39

Lotsnlotsoflove · 14/10/2025 21:54

I have considered this, but I also think it could seem like drama creating and I have worked really hard to stay drama-free and get on with the job at this place.

I agree. I wouldn’t say anything either, unless you work closely together. If you are on different teams and are unlikely to work together, continue to minimise contact and work out strategies to protect yourself from her. Sorry you went through all of this by the way OP - it must have taken its toll, especially post-partum.

PrivateCry · 15/10/2025 21:41

99bottlesofkombucha · 15/10/2025 21:09

Vexatious is exactly the accurate factual word the op should use about a woman who has raised many grievances which have been demonstrably false and the expensive, traumatic for those involved, investigations have shown this to be the case.

The allegations hadn’t been found ‘demonstrably false’ - they just weren’t upheld. There is a big difference.

If they had been proven to be vexatious then the colleague would have been disciplined. But she wasn’t, she was presumably restructured out and sent off with glowing references.

DisforDarkChocolate · 15/10/2025 22:09

If she's till on probation I'd highlight her know issues to her manager and leave them to it.

Lotsnlotsoflove · 15/10/2025 22:52

PrivateCry · 15/10/2025 21:41

The allegations hadn’t been found ‘demonstrably false’ - they just weren’t upheld. There is a big difference.

If they had been proven to be vexatious then the colleague would have been disciplined. But she wasn’t, she was presumably restructured out and sent off with glowing references.

One of the most galling among many galling things for me was that the substantial allegations against me were found to be demonstrably false, as in there was lots of documentary evidence and witness statements that evidenced she had lied. There were some other more minor things that were simply ‘not upheld.’ What was galling and solidified my decision to leave was that although her allegations were provably false and the investigation report states this, HR took the view in their written response that my management style was ‘operational’ rather than ‘holistic’ and what she had needed, as a person of colour, was ‘a holistic management style’ that recognised her work performance within a context of her felt sense of trauma and oppression - they said they saw the false allegations in the light of that, rather than in the light of the actual factual harm she caused me and others by bringing false claims. That is, as my lawyer put it ‘they wanted you to be her mother and not her boss.’ Anyway, obviously their own layers advised them that approach was insane because they settled out of court for a higher amount than my lawyer advised I was likely to be awarded if I won - probably on the basis that if what they had done and said to me got into the press it would be a PR disaster. Looking back I think what happened was that they were so caught up in worrying she would take them to tribunal for racism that would be in the press, they forgot EDI law also applies to me.

OP posts:
PrivateCry · 15/10/2025 23:08

Lotsnlotsoflove · 15/10/2025 22:52

One of the most galling among many galling things for me was that the substantial allegations against me were found to be demonstrably false, as in there was lots of documentary evidence and witness statements that evidenced she had lied. There were some other more minor things that were simply ‘not upheld.’ What was galling and solidified my decision to leave was that although her allegations were provably false and the investigation report states this, HR took the view in their written response that my management style was ‘operational’ rather than ‘holistic’ and what she had needed, as a person of colour, was ‘a holistic management style’ that recognised her work performance within a context of her felt sense of trauma and oppression - they said they saw the false allegations in the light of that, rather than in the light of the actual factual harm she caused me and others by bringing false claims. That is, as my lawyer put it ‘they wanted you to be her mother and not her boss.’ Anyway, obviously their own layers advised them that approach was insane because they settled out of court for a higher amount than my lawyer advised I was likely to be awarded if I won - probably on the basis that if what they had done and said to me got into the press it would be a PR disaster. Looking back I think what happened was that they were so caught up in worrying she would take them to tribunal for racism that would be in the press, they forgot EDI law also applies to me.

Shock That is beyond insane, OP. No wonder seeing her has stirred up some trauma. I am so sorry she has upset your safe space again.

I honestly have no idea what the best thing to do would be - I think it very much depends on your relationship with your boss BUT I have never come across someone who behaves this way and ultimately gets away with it. She will be found out again.

And like I said before, I think she has far more to lose from bringing it up than you do. It takes a while to build trust and I think people can generally sniff out bullshitters.

Avoid avoid avoid. But definitely see if you can talk to someone. Why the hell she would follow you there is bonkers.

What did she say when she saw you?

Lotsnlotsoflove · 15/10/2025 23:18

PrivateCry · 15/10/2025 23:08

Shock That is beyond insane, OP. No wonder seeing her has stirred up some trauma. I am so sorry she has upset your safe space again.

I honestly have no idea what the best thing to do would be - I think it very much depends on your relationship with your boss BUT I have never come across someone who behaves this way and ultimately gets away with it. She will be found out again.

And like I said before, I think she has far more to lose from bringing it up than you do. It takes a while to build trust and I think people can generally sniff out bullshitters.

Avoid avoid avoid. But definitely see if you can talk to someone. Why the hell she would follow you there is bonkers.

What did she say when she saw you?

We ignored each other. I am not sure she deliberately followed me -
I think it’s more likely that she applied for all of the very few jobs in our field that came up in the last few months in commutable distance (as I say her role is pretty niche) and this is the one she got.

OP posts:
Lotsnlotsoflove · 15/10/2025 23:22

PrivateCry · 15/10/2025 23:08

Shock That is beyond insane, OP. No wonder seeing her has stirred up some trauma. I am so sorry she has upset your safe space again.

I honestly have no idea what the best thing to do would be - I think it very much depends on your relationship with your boss BUT I have never come across someone who behaves this way and ultimately gets away with it. She will be found out again.

And like I said before, I think she has far more to lose from bringing it up than you do. It takes a while to build trust and I think people can generally sniff out bullshitters.

Avoid avoid avoid. But definitely see if you can talk to someone. Why the hell she would follow you there is bonkers.

What did she say when she saw you?

It wouldn’t take a lot for her to be found out. I don’t think she is particularly strategic, because in the claims she made against me she gave accounts of meetings we had had that were totally fabricated, after having signed records of that meeting I kept (I always had and others her sign off meeting records after seeing what she was doing to others) as accurate. So some of the documentary evidence was literally her own emails saying ‘yes that is an accurate record I’m happy to agree it, thank you for taking such careful notes’ with her chosen mentor cc’d in!

OP posts:
EsmeSusanOgg · 15/10/2025 23:37

Honestly, I would have an off record chat with HR. You don't need full details, but you can say she made vexatious complaints against others when her own performance was questioned - including yourself when you were on maternity leave.

LameBorzoi · 16/10/2025 00:03

Great advice here.

You have been through some serious trauma, and this is exactly what EAP is for.

I'd be restrained and professional, but would have very, very, clear boundaries. I'd be brainstorming the most professional and polite ways to avoid any joint work beyond what is absolutely necessary. This may require giving your supervisor a very professional heads up that there is a conflict of interest present.

MsCactus · 16/10/2025 00:13

I had a similar but different situation...

A colleague who was very sexist and sleazy to woman at work, was married but charmed and tried it on with every woman - turning nasty if they didn't reciprocate. Shouted at me at a works drinks once for not going back to his hotel with him (yes really! And I'm married) was incredibly difficult to work with.

He joined my new workplace. Charmed everyone, and when I joined everyone was gushing how amazing he was...

What did I do? Absolutely nothing. I avoided him at all costs, and didn't let anyone know all the bad stories I knew about him.

A year later, everyone has seen for themselves what he's like. I very almost went to my boss to tell them what he was like, but I'm so pleased I didn't. It would've made me look petty, partly when they were all so charmed by him at the start.

So my advice would be: avoid her and do nothing.

Miaminmoo · 16/10/2025 00:40

I’m so sorry to read this awful series of events, I’ll get flamed for this but we had a situation last year with an employee who only worked for us for a few months and wasn’t up to the role. After a couple of complaints, her relationship with her line manager breaking down irrevocably and other staff so upset they were off with stress or threatening to leave, I had to let her go. She worked for us for 6 months and wrote a 16 page grievance about how every single moment of her employment had subjected her to racism, discrimination, harassment and bullying - basically the only things you can raise if you have been employed less than 2 years. We own a small business with 30 employees and after we let her go all sorts of awful stories about her came out (would have been more useful to know in advance). She personally accused me and my partner and 3 other employees of racism and wanted money and a written apology from each person to avoid tribunal. We refused as her accusations had no basis and she had in fact shown some serious discrimination herself to several of my employees. It cost us thousands to fight and caused so much stress and trauma. I will add that for a small business we are proud of our diversity and inclusion policy and thankfully had several employees who were so outraged by her behaviour that they were willing to write testimonials. My point is, the stress and upset she caused, the time we had to spend fighting it (not to mention the money) and the impact on our team was huge. You need to ensure you will not be subjected to any contact with her and if I were you I would be approaching HR with your concerns now. I’m sorry you went through this, my DH almost had a nervous breakdown in the time it was going on. Do everything and anything to protect yourself and your team from another scenario at the hands of this disingenuous human being. As an employer we are discouraged from giving a bad reference but it’s unfair that other employers blindly walk in to the same potential situation.

Bunnycat101 · 16/10/2025 01:02

I managed someone exactly like this and I can appreciate how stressed you must be as it is quite traumatic to be bullied by a direct report. I would mention it to your manager but no-one else. Do not approach her manager or HR as it will seem you have a vendetta.

I can also see how she managed to get a good reference- it is much easier to move people like this around than it is to fire them. Her ex company had no incentive at all to be honest. I realised in hindsight that I’d inherited a toxic employee because the two previous line managers were trying to manoeuvre her away from themselves and I should have twigged that the ‘favour’ was going to be a bloody nightmare. I ended up trying to do exactly the same. By the end I was even trying to get her promoted out to some other poor sap against my own principles and better judgement as she’d broken me and I could see no other way out as I had no support from my seniors (who seemed to be scared of her) to performance manage her properly. I actually managed to get her line management moved to someone else and it was such a massive relief. I only really realised how toxic it was once I was out and in another organisation.

99bottlesofkombucha · 16/10/2025 04:57

PrivateCry · 15/10/2025 21:41

The allegations hadn’t been found ‘demonstrably false’ - they just weren’t upheld. There is a big difference.

If they had been proven to be vexatious then the colleague would have been disciplined. But she wasn’t, she was presumably restructured out and sent off with glowing references.

My sweet summer child

leopardprintismyfavourite · 16/10/2025 05:40

I had an instance where a member of staff came to me about someone I had interviewed for a role, to tell me some things that…without being outing…would’ve made me think harder about recruiting them.

I had already offered the role at that point. It was hearsay, on paper and at interview they were the best candidate. I thanked them for feeling able to share but reiterated my position that there was very little I could act on, we should treat them at face value as they could’ve changed and improved.

What I would say is this.

Firstly, having heard the insight from someone I trust and respect, I approached everything with a degree of caution. Requests made in writing, training agreed, delivered and signed by the individual to say they received it. Minuted meetings. I made sure if something went wrong, I could evidence I had done my part.

Secondly, our culture within my employer is so wildly different that it didn’t take long before they unravelled. I had been warned they were something of a backstabber, not something our teams tolerate, it very quickly became apparent. I had been warned they tell lies, it very quickly became apparent they said one thing to one manager, another to someone else. They were trying to rile, provoke and manipulate. The difference in my current company culture is that it isn’t a toxic bunch of people. They can’t be whipped into a gossiping, backstabbing frenzy because there’s a degree of mutual trust and respect.

They did leave, six months after they started, under a cloud. Every manager in the business grateful to wave them off.

If you love your job, and you feel that your company culture here is much better, in the right ways, than your past employer then this person may not fit. Their ways may not work. It may be much easier to see through them. They may not get what they want, and they may move on much quicker.

What I would say is that it was much easier to go through a disciplinary procedure knowing I had the evidence. I would only have had the quantity of evidence I had, at the speed I had it, because someone had given me their insight.

FenceBooksCycle · 16/10/2025 05:52

Does your current employer have some kind of probation system? In which case you need to let this person's line manager know, verbally without a papet trail, that there were serious performance issues in her previous role and that the reference cannot be relied on, so any performance problems during probation must be taken seriously and not considered charitably as minor teething issues. During the first 2 years of employment it is easier to manage the process of removing an umderperforming employee. If it looks likethis isn't going to be taken seriously then yes you need to leave asap.

shuffleofftobuffalo · 16/10/2025 06:19

A year long probation is unusually long. Long enough that it’s highly likely someone can keep a lid on the sort of behaviour you’re describing. It tends to be just “who they are” - so it comes out eventually once they think they have their feet under the table.

I would not inform anyone of who she is to you or what she did. If it becomes relevant then do so, but there is nothing to be gained at this juncture.

you know what she’s like so use the same ways of working you did before to protect yourself if you do have to interact with her (although sounds hopeful you won’t have to?)

On the point of your former employer - it sounds like they were so hell bent on being really DEI friendly etc that they lost sight of the impact on everyone - including Xtoxic. It wasn’t good for her for them to allow her to continue that pattern as long as she was, completely separate from the impact on the other staff, morale and the company as a whole. I think people forget that sometimes people do need saving form themselves - they weren’t championing race they were allowing her to use that as a vehicle for self harm and to harm others.

interesting also that they pretty much outright said you should basically have been her mum….. I think these days there is an unreasonable expectation in some quarters of what a manager should be. I expect all my staff to behave like adults (varying degrees of success on that one) but I refuse to step into a parental type role for them - yet about half of them genuinely seem to expect that that’s what I’m there for. I have one who pretty much refuses to talk about work and only wants to moan about her home life, when I said we also need to discuss work in 1-1s she says that’s too stressful. She thinks my job is to be variously her therapist and her mum and is very unhappy that I listen for a few mins, signpost her to our copious amounts of wellbeing support and refocus the meetings on work (that she usually hasn’t completed….)