Genuine question for anti-vaxxers

[Raisinmeup]

I see a lot online about anti-vaxxers and I’m trying to understand where they’re coming from, so this is a genuine question, not rage bait.

My understanding is that some parents choose not to vaccinate their children because they believe vaccines cause harmful side effects, or they just don’t trust the government and big pharma in general.

But what’s the alternative? If everyone stopped vaccinating, wouldn’t we start seeing diseases like polio coming back? That would mean more infant deaths and lifelong disabilities. It just doesn’t seem like a rational trade off?

From what I’ve seen, there seems to be a belief that immune systems can deal with these illnesses naturally, but I wonder if part of that belief comes from the fact that parents of today haven’t actually seen what a world without vaccines looks like. We’ve grown up in a time where infant death from preventable diseases is almost unheard of, so maybe it’s easy to forget how serious these infections really are.

And lastly, if you haven’t vaccinated your child and they then catch one of these illnesses, do you not end up turning to the same big pharma for the medicine or treatment anyway?

Completely pro vaxxer.

But I can understand why if youre in America where medicine is a business and theres insurance premiums, billing that changes and appears arbitrary and it all being about money... that people might struggle to trust drs and pharmaceutical companies. The profit first mentality may make someone skeptical.

Additionally with all the "fake news" I can understand the need to do your own research and that increases the risks of antivaxx mentality.

With measles- not of measles. One child- that you do not know. You’re clutching at straws.

Vaccines don’t stop the spread 🤦🏼‍♀️

Eh?

One of the most sensible responses on here 👏🏼…and I’m sorry for your loss x

Oh dear. The vaccine deniers and freeloaders have started up again.

It’s not nearly as bad on MN as it was some years ago. But it’s still depressing to see people pumping out nonsense against vaccines.

I’m fascinated by the minds of anti-vaxxers. Since they know vaccines work and are as safe as any medicine can ever be, why do they promote their harmful ideology?

Freeloading, sure. But there must be something deeper and even worse.

Why does it make any difference whether this poster knew the child or not? And what makes you say they died ‘with measles, not of it’?

What about the USA experiencing their highest number of measles cases in 30 years and the deaths resulting? All a direct result of idiots refusing to vaccinate against a disease that spreads rapidly and can be fatal.

Well, she’s relying on other children be vaxed but not her precious bundle. Gross

Exactly but it’s certain communities like the Amish and the Hasidic Jewish communities but they do a bris with the rabbi sucking the blood off of a male penis. Like, really. That’s hiv became a big thing in New York for awhile. Baby penis btw

I don’t know where you live but it’s getting worse here bc of that lunatic Kennedy being in charge right now.

Lot of lawsuits going on but I don’t think they have a chance really, in the long run. Hopefully

Because I have a relative who was permanently disabled by a vaccine - she went from a completely normal primary-school aged child to being profoundly learning disabled.

Like all medicines, vaccines can sometimes have side effects. Rarely, these can be severe. Vaccines are the only medications for which this is denied, probably because they are the only medicines that are forced upon us.

Instead of working to improve safety and researching the causes and risk factors for severe adverse reactions, pharmaceutical companies deny and whitewash, and have their flying monkeys attack anybody with the slightest concerns as an "anti-vaxxxxxer", or claiming that they think vaccines cause autism.

Few people are actually against vaccines, they just want them to be safer, and the true risks to be acknowledged and dealt with.

Of course, the diseases the vaccines prevent have side effects themselves, but you'll find that most of those affected malnourished people, which is a controllable risk.

Was that proven that that was the cause of the disability.

I can blame any body for anything I want but it doesn’t mean it true

It seems there is some evidence that vaccinations can trigger Guillain-Barré syndrome (a rare neurological condition causing muscle weakness and paralysis), but the risk is so low (a few cases per million) that the benefits of vaccination far outweigh the risks. Of course that's not much consolation to those who do develop GBS after a vax. It would be interesting to know more about why this happens (rarely). It looks as though there is probably some kind of genetic factor involved, and/or immunological disorder.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-vaccination-guillain-barre-syndrome-information-for-healthcare-professionals/information-for-healthcare-professionals-on-guillain-barre-syndrome-gbs-following-covid-19-vaccination

You have a very narrow-minded view there.

Hasn’t it ever occurred to you that the vaccination debate might be more nuanced?

That there might be people who are happy to accept certain vaccinations but have concerns about others?

No. Because there’s no evidence that any should be avoided.

I think the troulbe is that suspicion of vaccines is natural, but not rational (unless you have significant genetic or immunoligical conditions to be considered). I posted just earlier about the potential link with GBS, but the risk is significantly lower than the danger of, say, crossing the road.

People get fed up because the overall success of a vaccination program depends on uptake.

And so do tick bites

Right, right. Not your child or my child that died, so you're comfortable being a complete pedant about the language I used?

Are you so completely ignorant to the fact that the whole "herd immunity" thing means that this child (who may or may not have had the immunisation) may have been better protected from measles if the uptake of the MMR wasn't lower than 75% in Liverpool? The only thing we know about them is that they had other health issues. And that they died.

Frankly that's a disgusting response. A child died.

You don’t think it was rational to be wary of the Covid vaccines given the number of vaccine injuries and adverse reactions there were (e.g. the massively under-investigated effect on menstrual cycles) and the fact that large groups of the people who were given it did not and could not benefit from it?

I think that’s actually very rational.

Forcing people to inject medications for herd immunity is completely unethical. Nobody should be obligated to sacrifice their bodily autonomy for other people.

Herd immunity could be better encouraged by safer vaccines and more transparency.

Yes to the horror. And I know this is a side tangent but I think it is important.

When I teach the BTEC unit on health promotion I play a film that is just news reports about HIV / AIDS. The teenagers are horrified. Horrified that Ryan White was barred from school. Horrified at police wearing washing up gloves at a protest.

They really struggle to get their heads around the fear.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
You should do stand up comedy 👏👏🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

A teenager in our village was being treated for Leukaemia, chemo had wrecked their immune system. At a hospital appointment, another child had measles, which the teenager caught from them, ans was affected very badly. Their funeral was very well attended last week. It was the measles that killed him. If the other child had been vaccinated he would have continued on the road to recovery. Get your kids vaccinated.