Do you believe in God/a higher power?

[CuriousAboutWhatYouThink]

Not religion. I have no time for organised religion and the associated man made rules.

But do you believe in 'something'?

For context, my grandad was a CofE vicar but my parent rebelled against it and we were brought up broadly l in the religion (eg we celebrated main religious festivals like Easter and Christmas) but not as practising Christians and without a particular belief in God.

As an adult, I have friends of different faiths and none and it's something we have discussed from time to time. It's also something I used to discuss with my grandma who had a very strong belief in God but also believed the Bible until she became older when she still had a strong faith but admitted she thought the Bible was largely nonsense!

I suppose I've always felt that there is 'something' but I refer to it as the universe. I don't know, I always feel that there has been 'something' looking out for me.

That doesn't mean bad things have never happened because they have and religion/belief doesn't protect anyone from that. And it doesn't mean my life is anywhere near perfect because it's not. But the universe has always seemed to 'step in' when needed.

I don't know. I'm going through a tough time at the moment but I have a feeling everything will turn out to be OK because it always does.

RememberBeKindWithKaren · Today 14:28
No, not really.
This may well be inviting different views but I think people who do believe in God, on the whole, tend to be nicer people than those who don't. Excluding child abusing priests/ clergy people etc of course. If it was possible to find an average person who does and an average person who doesn't.

Not my experience, I'm afraid. I've met lovely people who are believers, and horrible ones, and the same can be said of non-believers.

For eg a Christian is someone who believes in certain religious ideas and believes what is said in the Nicene Creed. A Christian is not necessarily a nice person!

Evelyn Waugh was a devout Christian. Whatsisname Rees-Mogg is a devout Christian.

Just suggested because op said she had c of e / Christian family... OP can fully explore what they believed and decide for herself what she thinks about it all.

There is nothing more humbling than watching How the Universe Works Documentary. Mind blowing 🤯

Should add that I'm perfectly accepting of Jesus Christ as a moral teacher, like Buddha. But I don't believe he was the son of God, or in any way a superhuman figure.

If you didn't have to believe in the supernatural aspects of Christianity, I'd be a Christian - except that Buddha doesn't need anyone to worship him. In Christianity, God (in whatever form - the Father, Son or Holy Ghost) needs you to worship him/her/them, and I think that's weird and quite unnecessary in a moral sense.

@Parker231

I don't think it is, no. (I realise I could be wrong.)

I am fascinated in what other people believe and will discuss religion with people of other faiths, so long as they do not judge or try to convert me. I do not believe in god as an individual or a personality. However the universe was somehow created, possibly by some kind of higher power. Or powers. I dont believe there is anyone looking out for me or anyone else. I also believe that death is the end.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=otrqzITuSqE&t=32s&pp=2AEgkAIB

I’ve enjoyed listening to John Lennox, professor of mathematics at Oxford University speak on this subject when he addressed the Oxford Union. He is warm, easy to listen to and intellectually rigorous. This is him addressing the question ‘Does God Exist?’ and there are plenty more related videos on YouTube as he’s a prolific speaker and debater. I’m not a scientist and not in his league intellectually, but I find his arguments compelling.

Well obviously turtles (plus elephants)

Why worship a character who demands a certain level of obedience and threatens with hell if you don’t?

I thought that was well known re Newton. But remember he was working somewhat before the scientific method was fully developed as such, and there wasn’t yet a clear line between alchemy and actual chemistry. (He was also into numerology iirc.)

He was part of the ‘scientific revolution’ which paved the way for Enlightenment - but still himself from the era before it, and well before geologists realised the age of the earth, Darwin developed the theory of evolution etc. It was, imo, less irrational to believe in a deity (or deities) then.

It's a tricky one for me. Having a devout Irish Catholic nan who was taught at a convent school in Kildare in the 40s you can imagine what was drummed into her. When she babysat us we would stay over at hers the night. As you'd imagine from a Catholic household there were crucifixes and Jesus on the walls, rosary beads, holy water, books on Padre Pio and Mother Theresa etc.
She would tell us Bible stories instead of the usual fairy tales. They are great stories whether you believe or not. I still love 'The Prince of Egypt' animation.

Being Irish she would tell us the best ghost stories too, about the Banshee or the Puca, or her neighbour Mrs Connolly who's ghost was sipping tea at the bottom of the stairs in her father's cottage the night after her funeral! I think her dad had probably been on the whiskey😂We absolutely loved these stories and they are some of my favourite childhood memories.

Here is the part that isn't so great. I developed a terrible fear of going to Hell or my family dying and them going to Hell. I would ask my parents when they were going to die. I think being exposed to religion at such a young age undoubtedly created anxiety around mortality and the hereafter that created a long lasting impact.

Now for my scientific beliefs. Evolution is proven and I accept it. I'm also an avid amateur astronomist who cracks out the telescope any chance I get, which is seldom with UK skies being what they are. Anyone who knows anything about space understands the vastness of the Universe and the timescales involved which directly contradict any religious teachings. I think it is arrogant to believe we are the only life in the Universe when you take time and distances into consideration.

I also like spooky things and do believe in a bit of Hocus Pocus.

Short answer: I think there is a God or at least I like to think there is a God.

Logically, I believe religion probably only exists because people are scared shit of dying.

@MargoLivebetter I know theres no proper evidence I could point to for this conviction and plenty of people who would profess to being Christian are ( to my mind), backwards- thinking, or extremely traditional, sometimes exclusionary, sometimes sexist and generally not in keeping with what I'd say were my principles etc. And yet if I needed the help of a random unknown dude and I was told person A believed in God and person B did not, I know I would fancy my chances much more highly with person A. Could be wrong but that's been what I've picked up over the years.

This is based on my life in the UK. Taliban are extremely hateful, sexist nutters . This is based on so-called Christian types.

Edited for random dude names

@ErrolTheDragon

Maybe it's more well-known than I thought, but I don't think modern scientists/academics go out of their way to mention it. My perception (which may be false) is that many see the fact that Newton was a deeply mystical alchemist as something of an embarrassment.

Alchemy hasn't totally gone away, either, there are still some practicing alchemists out there - some to be found in the occult communities. I sometimes go and browse a forum that's populated by practicing alchemists.

Most contemporary witches and occultists accept the reality of scientific knowledge and facts (such as evolution.) We don't see an innate conflict between occultism and scientific facts.

As a polytheist myself, I can say that I don't actively believe that the gods and goddesses had a role in the universe developing. I don't discount the possibility, but it's not something I actively think is necessarily likely to be true. My belief in deities is not predicated upon or connected to them having any role in the so-called "creation" of the universe. I tend to think that consciousness underpins everything and the universe may be consciously developing itself in some form.

Hmm how about this as something to ponder….

I agree with you that life has to start somewhere and matter has to come from somewhere. It is intellectually unsatisfying to think that something came from nothing. So we’re back to the question of ‘Was someone or something behind it?’ If we go down that route for a moment we then land on your question of ‘where did that god come from?’ Then of course you have to ask that question again. And again. If God himself had a creator, that creator would be a bigger God, who in turn would need a bigger god to create him and so on with no end.

Here’s the thing: What if the creator of the universe has no beginning and no end? What if he is in fact eternal? After all if he’s created the known and unknown universe (which to me does make more logical sense than it springing from nowhere), he’s bigger and more powerful already than I can get my head around. Maybe, given that, now it doesn’t seem an altogether stupid idea that he might not be bound by the laws of space and time that are boundaries on the created world. What if our view of God and all he is, is just too small for our minds? What if, instead of arriving at ‘If matter comes from something not nothing, then possibly it comes from God, but that can’t be true because where does he come from?’ We get to ‘If matter comes from something not nothing, then possibly it comes from God. If that is true then he must be greater than I can ever contemplate or imagine’?

This is a fascinating thread and I’m enjoying reading what people think. It’s good to stop and think about these things. 😊

@Pricelessadvice

You make some fair points. To address them...

But those are people more ‘primed’ to be believers because they are part of those communities

Perhaps so, but not all of these believers started out that way. Some were atheists and had no time for other spiritual beliefs either, but had experiences themselves which caused them to question or reconsider and, following on from that, found their way into paganism or occultism.

I can understand why people might consider experiences from non-believers to be more credible, but I don't think that the credibility of believers should be unjustly downplayed. Believers are a diverse lot, and some may have little credibility, but there are many thoughtful, sensible and rational-minded people who have beliefs in deities and spirits and all kinds of things. I'm not saying you should change your views because of this, just that I don't think that believers should be totally written off as non-credible (I realise that's not what you said.)

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/agora/2020/01/irish-american-witchcraft-do-i-believe-in-fairies/

This blog post by Morgan Daimler is about belief in fairies rather than deities (Morgan Daimler is an expect on Irish fairies in particular and writes about her own experiences with them as well as from a folklore perspective.) She gives her reasons for her perspective, so if you're interested in understanding how it is from a believer's perspective, I'd suggest taking a look. I'll quote a bit from it below:

Morgan Daimler:

"I have had experiences that lead me to understand fairies the way I would geysers, or squirrels, or cicadas – I know they exist, although I may or may not encounter them regularly. So it seems odd to me to say I believe in them, as it would to say I believe in geysers, but I understand that in common parlance people say ‘believe’ because fairies aren’t considered an objective phenomena.

My reality includes fairies as both a cultural concept and an experienced subject. Like my experiences with anything else, some of these encounters have been brief, shallow, and in passing while others have been deeper, more involved, and more complex. But for me part of what helps move the subject from a belief to a known is that I have had shared experiences with others in a group and have people I trust who have also had their own unique experience, including people with no previous strong belief or understanding of fairies. Another thing that helps make this more objective to me is things which have occurred that were tangible phenomena, things that moved or appeared with no human-world explanation. For me it’s simply too much over too long a period to even question the reality of it anymore."

Try reframing the question. Do you believe in the existence of a supernatural entity that has some influence over human lives? When asked like that, belief in God is irrational.

Not if you believe that supernatural entity created everything natural.

I believe God is real and I think what you are sensing in your life is probably God. He’s staying in the background because you resist Him.

Goodness if I only believed/accepted things I 100% understood there would be a lot I didn’t believe in!

No

The “the can’t get something from nothing” point is not a suggestion God exists for me because t don’t see it as any more likely that God has existed for ever than matter has. And it’s also important to remember when talking about scientists in the past being Christians that you had to say you were a Christian to enter University or hold any position of authority. Even now, there was a stir when we had a non Christian Prime Minister, and I suspect the PofW will suddenly become more Christian when he becomes King.

Science asks us to believe in one miracle: that everything comes from nothing. It posits that DNA, consciousness, and the intricacies of human existence all exist without reason or purpose. In contrast, Christianity asks us to believe in more miracles. Personally, I have explored various religions and can say with certainty that they do not all worship the same God. Christianity is unique in that it teaches you cannot reach heaven by your actions; it's not about doing more good than bad or being a good member of society. Redemption does not come through your works; rather, salvation is a free gift, available to anyone who wants it.

I've seen these advertised. Don't they try to convert you to Christianity?

Yes and no.

I disagree. I was taught by nuns. They were, without exception, horrible people.

I was raised a catholic and that experience taught me you’ll never find a bigger bunch of hypocrites.

And now, I find CofE ‘god squad’ types (our village has a few of them) to be judgemental and narrow minded.