Very religious colleague

[ThatLadyLady]

I have a new colleague who is young, and very very religious. He isn’t quiet about his beliefs and in some ways I think that’s great, because he feels comfortable enough to be that way.

But in others it’s becoming quite uncomfortable. He will regularly ask people in the office what their opinion is on things like evolution, abortion and gay marriage. If they express a “non-Christian” belief he will laugh, tell them they’re wrong and explain what the bible says about these things. He won’t drop the subject even if people are visibly uncomfortable.

We listen to music in the office and he will object to almost anything that isn’t worship music. Someone played Sam Fender the other day (the consensus amongst the office was that it was a good playlist and we all enjoyed it), he asked for it to be changed because he doesn’t align with “Christian values”. So they switched on a different playlist, the first song was an Olivia Dean song and he started ranting about how she promotes sexual activity outside of marriage and that it’s wrong, women should be waiting until marriage etc.

He also expresses pretty strong views about women dating and it not being for marriage, that it’s “great” he has so many young female colleagues but he thinks we should be looking for marriage and to be a homemaker, etc etc.

I obviously don’t dispute his right to have these views, even if I disagree with them it’s his right. But would I be unreasonable to mention it to my manager quietly because his constant expression of these feelings is becoming quite uncomfortable?

I've worked with people of all kinds of religions, Mormon, C of E, Muslim, Judaism, Hindu, Jain, Sikh and NONE of them ever expressed an opinion based on their religion or ever talked about their religion unless it was relevant to the conversation, eg 'pub or cafe for lunch?' or 'what are you planning for your wedding?'

This guy's behaving inappropriately.

I wouldn't be surprised if several members of your team are quietly applying for other jobs OP. You need to sort this out before your team falls apart.

He's taking advantage of the fact that non-religious people often find it difficult to politely challenge religious beliefs because of fear of causing offense. You all need to change the narrative to indignation about him causing offense to you. 'You're gluttonous', 'I beg your pardon?!', 'It says so in the Bible', 'I'm not interested what your religious book says. That was insulting and I'm not prepared to accept it'. How DARE he say the place of women in the office is less valid than men. I would challenge this not as a 'debate' but from a position of being personally discriminated against by this view and remind him of company policies on gender equality. If you don't want to report to HR yet, this gives him a push to zip it, without the risk that he'll accuse you of discriminating against him.

If he asked my opinions I'd be tempted to say I'm not a Christian and disagree with many of the fundamental beliefs of Christianity but don't want to discuss this further in the workplace as he might find my views offensive and I don't want to risk damaging our working relationship or distracting us from work. If you said something like this in front of others, you would also be protecting yourself from any complaints from him.

I don't think there's any need to complain to management. It's one against many. You should all just stand up for yourselves. He's a rather pathetic character. Just tell him to quit the sexist remarks.

I’m a Christian but would tell him to pipe down and that he needs to live in the real world

Why not?

He's no more entitled to his views than you are to yours (although none of this should be discussed in work time)

I would be having a word with your manager at the earliest opportunity, but until something is done, I would be asking telling him in no uncertain terms to shut up be quiet and that it isn't the time or place

Why are you all scared of him?

Tell him to shut up!

If he's talking loudly over it, he's not getting on with work

Wait until he's wearing striped clothes or anything with a motif and point out that, according to Leviticus, it's an abomination in the eyes of the lord.

So basically none of you are willing to simply ask “why do you think this is appropriate in a work setting” or “why do you think any of our views on X are your business” or even “we don’t wish to discuss your religious beliefs in the workplace” but you are happy to assume he will “cry discrimination” to excuse yourselves? There is no right to propagate misogyny and homophobia in the workplace as I’m sure you all know.
How does he even know how bloody annoying he if the fully grown adults around him all just meekly smile and carry on?

For goodness sake, at least one of you must be able to ask a simple question of him. Then if he carries on, take it to the manager but if I were your line manager I’d wonder why not one of you had asked him to stop before escalating. If you do escalate and make it official then be prepared to take specifics and not just a general complaint. So start keeping a diary.

The more I think about this, the more I think you should have a word with management / HR. If he ever moves into management, then surely he would discriminate against women for promotion and is openly implying this. I'd at least point out that his approach contradicts the Equality Act and that JC told followers to obey the laws of the land!

JWs aren't Christian

Their beliefs are quite different to those in the NT

That would enable him. You need to just shut down inappropriate talk.

No one has had a word or attempted to shut him down yet because he’s a man. Fuck this shit! Write an email to your manager with everything you’ve listed, say he’s making the women very uncomfortable and he’s asking for opinions just for a disagreement or he can air his views. No one ever attempts this with him and you all appreciate you’ve got different views and opinions except this man.
Hes young and needs to learn now this isn’t going to be acceptable

So why exactly are you posting? You have a colleague who does something you don't like but none of you want to do anything about it. If that's your choice then you'll just have to carry on listening to him won't you?

Or you could behave like a reasonable adult and politely say you respect his views but its not appropriate for him to raise them so frequently and a good rule would be that he only talks about his beliefs if directly asked about them.

I had a friend who had an issue with a colleague with conspiracy views. He was told not talk about them as it undermined the cohesion of the group to keep doing so.

BTW, I am an atheist feminist, I didn't agree with much Charlie Kirk said but I respected his views, even where I disagreed with them, as coherent and internally consistent. I hugely respected him for being willing to converse with those who disagreed and agreed with him that we have to be able to do this to stop society becoming divided and violent. When I have looked into some of the claims made about him ( being racist, hate filled etc) hate have not been evidenced when I bothered to look for myself into what he actually said.

Is this person a genuine religious person ?

Or

Is he a male, talking inappropriately to women for "sport" ?
The reason I ask, is because I have met some people who enjoy harassing other people for "sport".

Either way, it is inappropriate language at work & should be referred to management.

and more importantly on the role of women as well

You must raise this with your manager OP. Yes it’s “tricky” as you say, but that’s what your manager is paid for (among other things). Raise it with them today and do so in writing so you have a log, or speak to them in person and immediately log it as a dated diary entry for your records - just in case this charming chap ever decides to make a fuss about freedom of speech in the office or some nonsense.

I am an EDI manager, so wanted to throw my 2p in.

He is absolutely entitled to hold his views and not experience discrimination for them (under the Equality Act). However, so are other groups. The comments you have mentioned infringe on the rights of women and LGBTQ people (also protected under the Equality Act). He has a right to freedom of speech, but not freedom from consequence, and this does not top trump professional behaviours. He has a right to bring his whole self to work, for example, by stating that he is a Christian, or when asked about his weekend, to say that he went to church. That doesn’t include evangelising.

in my view, his behaviour can be considered as bullying and harassment (the harassment being against women and LGBTQ people). I would also look into any policies on political activity at work, as abortion and gay marriage are very much political.

i hope that helps you to frame a conversation with HR, which you absokutely should do. I imagine they may feel a bit uncomfortable due to the religious discrimination aspect, so pointing these points out may demonstrate that they need, and have a responsibility to intervene.

I would choose a phrase to say eg ‘please stop talking to me; you’re distracting me from my work’, or ‘that’s not an okay topic in the workplace’.

EVERY TIME!

After numerous times, if he continues, perhaps add ‘if you don’t stop, I will have no choice but to make a complaint to management.

Also, noise cancelling ear buds or ear plugs to help ‘mute’ him, or listen to music.

As an EDI manager you should be absolutely aware that “LGBTQ” is not a protected characteristic. Sexuality (including heterosexuality) and gender reassignment are protected characteristics and ones that can at times conflict.

The fact you seem unaware of this undermines the credibility of the rest of your post.

You don’t sound unreasonable at all.

What I would do: keep a bit of a diary these next two weeks. Note down whenever he makes these comments that make you uncomfortable (comment, date and time).

when you feel that you have enough (I’d say about 3 incidents) write a short email to your manager telling her that you have something you would like to discuss.

Surely some of the other people in the office are also men? I don’t accept that being a man is enough on its own to subdue an entire office, even if the other 39 are women.

An office of 40 people is quite large. Too large , I’d have thought, for one person to preach to everyone else, unless they actually stand on a soapbox. Too large for everyone to be listening to one radio?

And the OP imagines he’s the sort of person to cry prejudice if anyone objects to his comments - but no one can say for sure how other people will react. Does everyone think the same, and how would the OP know? Does everyone talk to everyone else all the time? Does anyone ever get any work done?

As I say, there’s something very off about this post.

@ThatLadyLady can't you just change the subject every time he pipes up or say that the bible was written by men? He needs challenging as that is the only way he'll ever learn new beliefs.

And all the same people who are complaining about him here will likely be saying he should be compelled to wear a pro LGBTQ badge in work, if its company policy. The double standards are sickening.
If he has to be tolerant of ungodly world views then you ought to be tolerant of him. It works both ways.

Thanks for the very patronising message, but I simplified it for brevity. Given that this very much does not involve gender reassignment and is not focusing on the sex/gender debate, I’m not sure what your point is, or why that is the point you have chosen to hone in on.