A double one on Rugby

[JamieCannister]

AIBU to say that Mumsnet is putting girls at risk by allowing the promotion on rugby on this site?

AIBU to say that given the risks of head injuries children under 18 (or maybe people with not-yet-fully-developed brains under 25) should not be allowed to consent to play contact rugby?

I cannot speak of martial arts, but other than rugby, american football and boxing (and gaelic football, aussie rules?!??!?!) where repeated heavy head impacts are ineitable.

The keys risks are "massively harmful injury from a one-off incident" (equestrianism, rugby, boxing all fall into this) and "repeated minor incidents that when added up can do massive long term harm (rugby and boxing, not equestrianism).

Personally I hate the thought of a kid of mine riding a horse, but at least it does not come with regular head impacts as a natural part of the game.

Also, I think I said rugby not touch rugby when I talked about banning.

It is possible that they have picked up from me.

The difference is that it is unrealistic to keep your kids 100% safe from idiot drivers. It is perfectly realistic to ensure they never risk a long term head injury or neck down paralysis from playing rugby.

It is tag rugby or touch rugby until U9, and they do not do scrums/lineouts etc until much later. There is the option to continue with non-contact after that if you don’t want the risks of contact.

Hell, there is even “walking rugby” for middle aged men with creaky knees who can’t manage 90 minutes of sprinting but still want to hang out with their rugby friends.

OP, you’ve been very clear that you don’t like sports and that you think it is unladylike for young girls to get muddy or sweaty or spoil their clothes. I think you have sadly misunderstood the demographic of mumsnet if you think many parents on here think that “behaviour unbecoming in a nice young lady” makes you transgender.

I have no problem with girls or women getting muddy, sweaty, dirty or involved in very physical sports.

This thread was specifically about children (not just girls) (and potentially anyone under 25 or 18) being too young to consent to the risks of rugby (not touch rugby).

But if they do, they are trans men in the making, right? Because it’s unladylike.Which is what you said in your now-deleted comment.

I don't know why my ds loves rugby compared to the other sports he's tried, but he really does love it. We didn't encourage it, in fact we consciously tried to steer him in opposite directions. But he found rugby in high school and that was that.

He's fit, healthy, happy, confident right now.

I heard a radio show a while back where an a&e nurse was saying that the number of kids coming to a&e with broken bones has really reduced in recent years but the number of kids presenting at a&e with acute mental health crises has increased.

I'll take the definite wins right now over potential downsides in the future.

Which is not to dismiss the risks and the horrible prognosis for mnd in particular. We are aware of those, we've talked to ds about them, his club run a compulsory training session for both players and parents every year.

That's all we can do.

OP, You lost any credibility I tried to give you, with your offensive comment (now deleted) on P2.

You haven't exactly redeemed yourself since.

YABVU.

You are correct that any sport that involves rapid head movements including heading the ball in football causes serious damage to the brain resulting in later neurological disease including depression and suicidality. But no one is going to stop sport anytime soon because of money and vested interests. I am not sure where rugby sits on the scale of dangerous sports but I imagine it is less dangerous than boxing and American football.

I might consider advocating banning them.
😂

You do that, as if it will make any kind of difference to anything.

I am not researching the number of injuries, broken bones and head injuries in playgrounds and playparks for you, you can do it yourself.

Even inflatables have, sadly, records of casualties. So knock yourself out with advocating banning everything you don't agree with.

My 10yo DS is really successful at rugby 🏉 it's an arena where he feels completely at home. He isn't judged. At school he feels the pressure (undergoing dyslexia screening) and knows he isn't top for everything. Reading is difficult for him, but rugby....he's like a different child.

And we didn't lead him into it. He came home with a slip from school that lunch time rugby classes were running and could he please go to it? I said that's fine, it may not be for you but see if you like it. Then he asked me to contact a rugby club to do training. So I did that at his request and two years later here we are....he absolutely loves it because he is treated with respect, as someone above has already pointed out as one of the values. His success with rugby is giving him confidence in other areas of his life.

I call BS on this!

Or, no doubt, mountain biking, rock climbing, snowboarding, skiing, motocross, BMX, or anything else remotely fun.

That is not what I said - I can;t remember what I said but I think it it was making the comaprison that some things kids are too young to consent to - I include tattoos, transitioning and undertaking contact rugby which risks early death due to repeated head injuries.

I have never heard of anyone dying aged 40 due to repeated head injuries from adventrue playgrounds.

There are massive issues with rugby. It is not difficult.

You told a specific poster that their daughter was probably secretly trans because why else would she enjoy playing rugby. That is why you were deleted.

I've never taken my DC to rugby due to the risks. I don't voice my concerns with real life friends as I suspect they'd think it ridiculous but I believe there are safer sports. Obviously there is risk in everything, but I try to reduce it where possible.

I swear to god I did not say that - I would not say that. Are you sure that wasn't someone else deliberately using a very similar user name?!?!?!

I swear swear swear I did not say that.

My issue is with kids playing rugby, because they are too young to consent to the risks. If girls want to get muddy then they are girls who happen to want to get

I don;t even believe trans kids exist... in fact I am not even sure I believe trans adults exist

Cumulatively- snow boarding, rock climbing, motocross, mountain biking and skiing PLUS rugby whilst a lot of fun would significantly increase the risk of your child being injured (as well as costing an absolute fortune!).

Individually of course each of those activities carries a much lower risk. In addition each of activities provides physical benefits to the child.

So it is simply a question of how much risk of physical injury or harm you wish to avoid for your child set against the development harm that you cause your child's development by them not experiencing and dealing with risk.

You said I was like a mother of a trans child because my daughter plays rugby on a mixed team with boys. You said the boys shouldn’t be forced to play with her. I didn’t report your comment but it was deleted anyway as it was against guidelines. You made a really odd leap equating my little girl playing rugby with her friends to me being a mother of a trans child. It might not have been what you meant but it was how it came across.

We all read it. You were deleted for it at 10:56 on page 2. The responses on p2-3 to your deleted comment also make it clear what you said.

Stop trying to pretend “somebody with a similar username must have said it” - it is transparent self-serving shite. We can all see it was you.

you need to shut up now

Your post was reported by several posters and deleted for a reason.
Mixing trans issues and rugby is offensive and won't be tolerated on here.

It goes well to show that your entire argument and thread are all nonsense.

The oddest thing about the comment is that rugby has been one of the sports in the forefront of ensuring that women are not forced to play with men.

I swear I don't recall what I said and cannot believe I said you were "like a mother of a trans child because my daughter plays rugby on a mixed team with boys."

I can believe I said that boys have a right to sport without girls and I think that anyone encouraging girls to play sports with boys is putting the girls at risk, as well as risking causing harm to the boys in ways other than safety.

Some boys and men are bad people, and you would be crazy to allow your daughter to play with bad boys or men.

Good boys and men will hold back when playing with girls, for obvious reasons. Why do girls have a right to spoil sports for good boys and men?

@Ooogle 's recollection is a lot better than yours. What you have written there is absolutely nothing like what you wrote yesterday, which is not much less unreasonable.

Anyway, that is all a distraction - the point is that rugby - certainly if played at a high level for a long time, but also if you;re unlucky and are paralized from the neck down - is incredibly risky and can destroy lives.

IMHO it is immoral to promote such a dangerous sport, and kids cannot consent to playing a sport (even at non-contact level) because they might fall in love with it when they are too young to understand that it might end up killing them