ID cards to be introduced. What do you feel. ?

[Fishingboatbobbingnight]

I have worked in serious organised crime for two decades. This is one of the best bits of news I have read in a long while. I have also been involved in ‘small boat’ arrivals. The reason people will by pass several safe EU countries to get to the UK is ‘I can get lost if I don’t get asylum’ ‘UK has no ID cards’ . It’s a no brainer .. why why has it taken so long. ? If you want to have the services your country has to offer - through most of the world - from healthcare to the library- you need to show you are a bona-fida citizen. However , for some unfathomable reason , the flag waving right wingers are always the one to oppose ..is it because they are scared it will work and leave their thinly veiled racism floundering ?

Yes to ID cards = YANBU
No to ID cards = YABU

Is it just a privacy thing for people?

It's just the last time they tried to introduce an identity card, it cost approximately £257 million before ultimately being scrapped.

It seems to be touted as some sort of deterrent to illegal immigration, although I can't see how it would actually change anything in that department. Then the Rwanda scheme which rightly or wrongly was arranged at a cost of approximately £700 million, £290 million of which already paid to Rwanda, and the scheme was scrapped, which arguably would have been a better deterrent. Where is the money coming from for this, and is it a need or want, is there a better use for this money?

Just a reminder that 1984 is a work of fiction. A classic yes but still a fiction. It does not predict future. Using this logic we could start using The Hunger Games as a warning.

This ^^ sounded to me as though you were dismissing the idea of 1984 or the Hunger Games as being useful analogies because they are ‘pure fiction’ ie can’t possibly become real life. But, putting aside the more creative details, if we’re agreeing that those bad - even dystopian - govts are possible then great. No argument there. My point is also that many works of pure fiction even science fiction can and have eventually become real futures and these books serve as useful warnings.

This was a project back in 2008/2009 I was part of the project team and they were going to be compulsory then Goverment made them voluntarily and it died a death. Called the National Identity and Biometric
Service. www.bbc.com/news/10164331.amp

Won’t be long before criminals will find a way to clone the ID cards..not that I agree with this but be better off with a microchip like our pets..

I honestly don’t know how I feel about it 🤷‍♀️

I honestly don’t know how I feel about it 🤷‍♀️

I honestly don’t know how I feel about it 🤷‍♀️

Don't forget the several hundred millions we have paid / are paying to the French to stop the boats, most of which they are not stopping. We're throwing money everywhere to no good effect.

If it's compulsory an ID card will be sent to you and that will be that.

It’s not a card, it’s a digital ID scheme.

YABU

So many people seem to be prepared to sleep walk into accepting ID cards; it’s utterly dismaying. It’s a massive civil liberty violation just waiting to be enacted.

Consider that the police already have the power to record your actions as ‘criminal’ without you knowing. The abuses that they, and the wider State, could (and absolutely would, even if by incompetence alone) get up to with the power that a unifying ID card will provide is staggering.

We have always resisted ID cards (putting aside the War years) for very good reasons. Those reasons remain, along with some new ones brought along since digitisation and every UK Government’s failure, since the 90s, to run effective and secure IT projects.

Can you imagine Fujitsu (of Horizon infamy) or any of the other 2-3 firms big enough to bid on it getting their hands on this? Christ, never mind how incompetent they’re likely to be - just think how much they’ll be wetting their pants at the thought of the project overrun costs they’ll be able to hoover up.

Where on Earth did you get that gross generalisation from, and what does it have to do with your point?

I’m in favour of ID cards. I also support many ‘right wing’ policies. Not sure whether to vote YABU for your bigoted opinion or YANBU because I agree on the ID card issue 🤔

If it's compulsory then one will be issued to you and that will be that.

One will still be sent abet digital.

“The flag waving right wingers are always the ones to oppose…”
Where on Earth did you get that gross generalisation from?
I’m in favour of ID cards. I also support many ‘right wing’ policies. Not sure whether to vote YABU for your bigoted opinion or YANBU because I agree on the ID card issue 🤔

Well I'm afraid i take a bit more of a practical approach- we are being told it will help in the fight against illegal immigration and illegal working and organised.
Lets look at the things introduced by both shades of government and what was promised it would achieve.
1/ Privatising power, trains, water, postal service- claim it would mean more investment and better value for the tax payer-has it achieved any of that? No chaos hugely higher prices less investment than ever before AND a higher cost to the taxpayer.
2/ Brexit- claim more autonomy, much lower costs and far more money going to the health service, improvement in business and investment. Actual achievement- the closure of thousands of businesses, far lower GDP, higher costs for everything , no extra money to the health service and politicians have made zero use of the increased autonomy.

This track record means that there will be no advantages to having digital ID and lots of possible privacy and human rights issues.
The idea refugees don't go to other European countries because they have ID cards is ludicrous- Italy lost hundreds of thousands of blank ID cards which are now in the hands of criminals and undistinguishable from the real thing. Digital ID is even worse because our government is completely unwilling to spend enough money on cyber security to keep this information safe- information has been stolen from many government departments, the police and the NHS- why would the ID server be any different? Ludicrous idea.

I wondered about that...

It’s a definite yes from me. It should have happened years ago. It works so well in other countries and if we can cherry pick the best practice from different systems we should have a world leading product.

Tbh I could care less. I have nothing to hide and am constantly asked for ID to obtain medications for my children (ADHD/Class B drugs) and other matters pertaining to their wellbeing. Recent trip to Italy required ID to be shown at EVERY single attractions from Rome to Pompeii. No one could care less other than those of us concerned we’d lose our passports to pickpockets and wished we had an alternative form to carry. A national ID card would be easier when my 20yo who doesn’t drive is constantly carded. And if it means that legal immigrants can wave it at rabid Reform voters so that they leave them alone and employers are forced to only employ nationals and legally resident individuals, then what’s the issue?

It will make monitoring people who need to pay for NHS services at the point of delivery are identified without issue, saving the NHS a fortune. If it could combine with NI cards, driving licences, NHS ID it would be bloody useful to have all the relevant government numbers on one piece of plastic.

It’s difficult to find logical arguments against identity cards. Rather like the Poll Tax. Starmer, beware!

You’re joking. PLEASE tell me this was a piss take?

Stupid stupid idea. athena assuming backlog is still going to exist and prior are still going to require housing while the application takes ages and ages. How confident are they in being able to avoid fraudulent ID cards? How much will it cost?

Id be interested to find out how many black/brown people think this is a good idea. Another reason for the police stops. Those who don’t look like British people are ‘supposed’ to look will bear the brunt of the stops.

There was a way around it during lockdowns - there was a big market in fake certificates. That wouldn’t be possible with digital ID.

dDo people really not see how authoritarian this government is? People are being arrested all over the country every day for Twitter posts. I watched a guy be arrested last night for sharing a ‘F* Hamas’ meme!

Not at all. The poll tax was demonstrably more equitable than previous systems. Houses don’t use local services, people do. But the change proved politically unacceptable, and was Thatcher’s downfall. I see strong parallels with identity cards.

I change my job less than once a decade, carry my Driving License, and have a full UK passport!

I don’t see the point of having a digital ID to prove my right to work as when I started my current job they required:

Passport
Driving License
Copies of MOT and car insurance showing I could drive for business purposes
Original qualification certificates
Proof of professional memberships
CRB check
Utility Bill / Council Tax Bill
Proof of Bank Account
Waver for access to my medical records
Credit Check
Employment reference (from employer)
Personal reference
Birth and Marriage certificates (some of my qualifications are in my maiden name)

Having a Digital ID seems pointless to check my eligibility to work!

I work for a Council, implementing climate change adaptation not M15…..

I previous worked for a government agency - had the same level of checks there too!

Before that I worked for the Ministry of Justice, the same checks, but with family members also checked!

So quite frankly it’s a waste of money if it’s been used to check you are eligible to work!

My concern is that with facial recognition surveillance, location tracking and digital ID on your phone, attending a peaceful protest or rally that the government doesn’t like could cause substantial issues!

When I think about how low the bar is these days on ‘terrorist group’ such as Palestine Action or Just stop oil you can see how this could be used to reduce civil liberties!

I can see how it could be helpful for people without alternative ID, but for those of us with ID already it seems like a complete waste of money!

The black economy and criminal gangs don’t do employment checks… so won’t do anything to tackle that!

The details of my government pension were hacked a couple of years ago! My personal information is on the dark web as a result including my previous salary, address, next of kin (for pension benefit in the event of my death) so I have no confidence in this scheme being secure!