To think a very high percentage of people are Neuro divergent?

[Marshmallow4545]

I have just spoken to yet another friend who suspects that they may be Neurodivergent. They are not interested in seeking a diagnosis for various reasons but this means they will never be picked up in the statistics. Anecdotally, this isn't unusual amongst my friendship circle and I now suspect that a very large percentage of the population believe they may be ND even if they have no diagnosis and have never seen a professional about this. So out of interest please vote:

YABU: if you think you are Neurotypical
YANBU: if you believe you are Neurodivergent, even if you don't have a diagnosis

I think a lot of people think, and self diagnose, as being ND.

No it was a hugely offensive and abelist post .

@Star458 I agree with you. That post was astoundingly ignorant, I couldn’t be bothered to even write a response. Take it with a hefty pinch of salt.

The Asperger's diagnosis was a useful one and I don't know why it is no longer used. Your son was in a mainstream school and is aiming for a professional career. The autistic young people I know of are non verbal/shit smear/violent to their carers/ a million miles away from being a software engineer. It is confusing to the point of offensive that such different conditions now have the same name.

For me, it is grossly insulting to people profoundly affected by autism (and their families/carers) to pretend they have anything in common with those who self-identify as ND.

@SlipperyLizard

If your in-laws have not been diagnosed but use it as an excuse to not get on with things, that is wrong. I can't abide it when people have problems but don't seek help.

But, I don't agree with your comment highlighted above as I don't think anyone with a mild ND would consider themselves to have much in common with someone profoundly affected by autism, beyond perhaps being able to better empathise.

It does, however, highlight the issue with using ND as an umbrella term.

People with mild ND are treated as if they are making it up, or just not able to cope - it's the latest version of "There's no such thing as depression, people just need to cheer up".

But ND, whether mild or severe is no different to any other umbrella terms for other types of conditions / illness / disabilities.

You wouldn't say it is grossly insulting to people with schizophrenia or bi-polar to pretend they have anything in common with someone who suffers from mild GAD, but they are all classified as mental health conditions.

The same could be said for people who are quadraplegic or have ALS to be classed as physically disabled and pretend that they have something in common with someone who has mild spina bifida or who has had an amputation but can live their lives quite fully.

Cancer survivors can range from those who've had a stage 1 melanoma, fully removed in a biopsy to those who've gone through years of chemo and radiotherapy to survive stage four breast cancer - but they are all cancer survivors.

ND is no different - some of us have what would be seen as relatively 'mild' forms and we just need a little bit of medication or coaching support, or to understand our condition so that we can manage it in today's fast paced life. Others are more profoundly affected, and need a lot more support, but it is not insulting to recognise both as ND conditions.

Maybe we all are to a degree, but somehow we have to navigate this complex society, which isn’t always ND friendly.

I think the flip side of it has been intelligence and my academic abilities

Intelligence and having academic abilities are as much a trait of NT as ND, are you really trying to say that ND people are more academic and have more intelligence than NT people?

Utter nonsense

I think they should have different names. My friend had an autistic son who is 11, non verbal, can't use the toilet, will literally only eat toast

He's completely different to my verbal, high functioning autistic dd. I think the severe side of autism is more of a global development and the high functioning autism is more sensory overload/ struggling socially

I don't like saying My dd is autistic because there's such a wide range of autism

The ed psych that assessed my DGD said that ND people tend to be higher on the centile than many of their NT counterparts.

Is that triggering for you?

Why would it be triggering?

To be fair, people who are neurodivergent might be more interested in clicking on a thread about it

This is not the same as being diagnosed with adhd. Or asd.

This is already how the diagnostic process works.

How many of those posting on here have been through the assessment and diagnosis process for obtaining confirmation of ADHD or ASD ?

based on some of the comments, many of you have no idea.

these conditions are so different from limiting concentration spans as a result of watching YouTube shorts. Wtf?!

better parenting is not going to cure it.

in the U.K. we are not over diagnosing. In fact we are under diagnosing in most areas. And have done for decades. However social media and Covid mean many women in particular have read up and identified that they are ND and struggling and demanding confirmation and support. Then in turn demanding the same for their kids in school (or vice Versa) ….. and why is that? Perhaps because schools and society are less tolerant than they were in the 90s. … it is no longer accepted that x or y line up pencils and don’t speak to anyone, or stare out of the window and don’t engage or run everywhere.

we are trying to fit everyone into a box when they don’t all fit in and when they can’t / won’t fit we say there is something wrong with them and then parents cry that their child is amazing and look they are ND. Pls change the environment so my child can reach their full potential.
and some schools do. And some don’t. And those that kids that don’t get that support end up dead by misadventure or suicide or in prison…… The End.

these conditions mean worse life outcomes than those waiting for NT kids. No one wants to label their kid. But we all want to support our kid and to understand our work colleagues and for everyone to reach their full potential in harmony.

hence labels and identifying strengths and challenges are helpful to avoid suicide, avoid being killed and to avoid prison. Let alone to help them them reach their full
potential in the classroom and get their exams so they can become doctors, dentists, lawyers, ski instructors and plumbers. Etc.

Yes this is true. Having an IQ in the gifted range was something that was highlighted in my autism assessment as this is more common in autistic people. Giftedness and neurodivergence often overlap, as do neurodivergence and learning disability. We often have a more "spiky profile" of strengths and challenges compared to our neurotypical peers.

But what actually is Neurotypical?

Google it

I have googled it, but there's no clear objective definition

I think our modern lifestyle highlights it more.

People might have coped better back in the day when life was far more "boring" and less fast-paced, less noisy, less screen and generally less stressful all round.

The more full-on our daily lives become, the more the rates of ND being diagnosed/suspected will increase.

But that's only my opinion.

Yes, I think that the way that society is organised currently is disabling to neurodivergent people. In a different society, or at another point in history, there might be more room for neurodivergent people to work to their strengths without having to deal with many of the barriers that exist now. Take for example 9-5 working, which is a barrier to lots of people. As well as the incredible number of forms we need to fill out for every aspect of everything, which is a barrier to others.

I personally know many people with a recent diagnosis who definitely do not have significant impairment.

Difficulties with certain situations yes. Successful professional careers, relationships, parenthood yes. Significant impairment, no.

This is what blurs the lines I think. There are lots of apparently 'functional' people getting diagnoses and this naturally causes those with struggles related to ND traits to question if they too would get a diagnosis. Looking at the diagnosis rates at some facilities, it does seem that if you can get a referral then you are overwhelmingly more likely to get a diagnosis than not. I wonder how many of the posters on this thread that think they may be ND would actually receive a diagnosis. I suspect it may well be a lot! I also suspect this is true at a population level. If every single person was assessed for ND conditions I think that far more than the purported 20% would be diagnosed with an ND condition.

I think a part of the issue with these conditions is that it is a spectrum, and people are using being ‘on the spectrum’ as an excuse.

It is a bit like blood tests. Not everyone will be in the middle of the accepted range. But we accept a range of normals and there is no treatment required if you are in that range or slightly out of it, other than lifestyle adjustments.

As I said in my previous posts, that doesn’t mean that these aren’t serious conditions for some requiring either medical intervention or lots of support.

But a slightly fidgety person who is has mild ADHD has little in common with a child who needs Ritalin to lead a functional life.

What I think is wrong is where people use ND as an excuse. For instance ‘I can’t be on time due to my ADHD’ rather than setting alarms or targeting being early in order to arrive on time. Or demanding yellow on blue when they can quite easily read black on white when it suits them to do so.

There is also demand for private diagnoses, especially among children, and there is a whole industry of people willing to provide them for a (very high) cost.

All of the above is true and not ablist. On the contrary, those who use very mild impairments (or even preferences) as excuses, citing being ND, are doing those with real needs and who experience massive distress a disservice.

It's not just self diagnosis. It's other people desperate to enlighten others with diagnosing THEM!

I'm a really organised person, I've made an entire career out of it (I'm an Executive Assistant). Naturally this tendency tips over into my personal life because it's just who I am. I have systems and processes that mean I don't miss deadlines, remember stuff, keep on top of things I said I wanted to keep on top of etc...

...the amount of (mostly online) people who ask me if I think I might have autism is 🤯

Nobody has mild adhd, you need to reach a threshold and it’s way more than being a bit fidgety. The ignorance re these conditions is massive and yes you are being ableist.