To think criminals are very common?

[ChicJoker]

I see lots of threads on here claiming moral high ground and pearl clutching for example about people not correcting large company’s on a billing mistake. All very tsk tsk tsk “that’s stealing” etc.

it got me thinking, I’m sure it’s dependent on your region but I don’t believe there’s a single person where I’m from that doesn’t either know or have a relation to a criminal in some way. If mums net was a true representation of the public, surely criminals would be shunned from communities and the holier than thou would reign free.

where I’m from, everybody, and I do mean everybody - either knows someone directly or are themselves involved in illegal activity in some way. Even if it was historically. It’s astoundingly common. Anyone who claims otherwise is either lying or incredibly naive.

what are your thoughts? How do the whiter than white cope in life? FWIW there’s absolutely not a chance on this earth I’d correct for example Tesco on sending me a free online shop by mistake. I’d actually find it more morally inferior TO correct them.

I’m genuinely shocked that the percentage of people with a criminal record is so high - I’d have guessed 2 or 3%.

I probably have met a lot of people who have in their life committed some low left theft / tax fraud (I don’t know this, I’m guessing given it seems prevalent in small businesses / trades etc) but I genuinely wouldn’t have a clue where to find drugs even if I wanted to - as far as I’m aware I don’t know anyone that does them - and I don’t know anyone to my knowledge who has ever been violent.

As far as I’m aware I don’t know anyone with a criminal record.

This thread's the only thing to have made me think "I haven't broken any laws since before the pandemic! Must be time to push a boundary ..."

eta: Oh. Yes, I have. Last week! I let the self-checkout think I had 5 bananas when there were 7 😂 It should've weighed them, not defaulted to 5. Stupid machine.

You've now made me wonder if we're all just walking around committing small crimes all the time, perhaps not even considering that they're crimes. I wonder what the most commonly and easily broken law is? I mean harmless ones you might not even know are crimes. Maybe that one about taxis having to have a bail of hay in the boot?

I always wonder this. I imagine most common are, not wearing a seatbelt or touching the phone when driving.

how about the law that says only men are allowed to put the bins out? 😉 that one I do enforce.

I like this idea. Here are some crimes you might recognise if you're as old as me.
Loitering with intent to use a pedestrian crossing.
Walking on the cracks in the pavement.
Walking in a loud shirt in a built up area during the hours of darkness.

@ForgetMeNotRose:

Littering applies to anything you "throw down, drop, or otherwise deposit, and then leave" in any open-air public place, including private land and land covered by water.

Failing to Clean Up After a Dog: The act of allowing a dog to foul a public path without cleaning it up is an offence.

Flashing your headlights to give way

Parking on the wrong side of the road at night

Using the horn between 11.30pm and 7am in a built up area for any reason other than to warn oncoming drivers of immediate danger. Wish someone would tell minicab drivers and impatient husbands!

Swearing or gesturing at other motorists - even if you're trying to be helpful, the other driver could be offended which would make it a crime. Or you could be deemed 'not in full control of your vehicle' while waving.

Cycling on pavements. Mumsnetters might be innocent of this, but I suspect they aren't all telling their teenagers!

Being drunk on a street or in a public place.

Stealing two bananas because the self checkout is a stupid machine 😳

I agree OP, I think MN posters appear to be massively naive about life in that respect (I suspect it’s more that only certain posters contribute to those threads and get carried away in their horror and pearl clutching though, so it seems overwhelmingly naive)

its not even about who you know or your circle- I went to a normal state (catholic) school and have 3 friends from my year who ended up doing stints in prison (drug dealing, football hooliganism) and a house mate from university who did (stealing from employer). I haven’t seen these people for 20/30 years but they are still connections.

in a long career I have also managed people
who have been in trouble with the police or government.

go to any high street at kicking out time and you’ll see fights (and I can predict where MN pearl clutches think I’ve lived to say that- but it won’t be Fulham, Putney, Cambridge, hitchin, which is where I have an seen pub fights a plenty)

also I find it strange people seem so gobsmacked by thinks like tax evasion which i also think is fairly common.

Depends on the circles you move in! Some people will know only crims.

I can’t say I know any. If they admitted theywere criminals they wouldn’t be my friends.

Do you count tradies who don’t pay their taxes and always want cash? I’ve had a couple of those and always roll my eyes when they expect me to agree that ‘we don’t want the taxman to get it!’ Don’t we? I do. As a wage-slave I always had to pay my taxes.

I’ve always found ‘pearl-clutching’, as you so patronisingly say, to be a mighty good mechanism for self-protection.

I would steer well-clear of criminals if I knew them to be criminals- if you get involved in violence, theft or fraud why the hell would I want you in my life?

I’ll keep on clutching, thanks.

I tend to agree. I have three people in my own family who’ve been involved in criminal activity in the past (and wouldn’t think twice about doing the same in the future)
Two of them have got away with it so far, another was in court years ago but got a fine.

Another person I know has done community service and been in prison in the past and continues to break the law yet she’s surrounded by friends who don’t seem to hold anything against her.

I grew up somewhere rough and yeah it was a bit of an in joke. You knew who was at it people would come to local pub offering stolen stuff. Everyone bought their fags from a bloke who’d take orders.

I live somewhere naice now and I suspect the criminals would be white collar.

Really depends on your demographic. In the USA, 1 in 5 black males and 1 in 25 white males has been in prison. So in the former group, you would definitely know someone. In the latter, maybe not.

(corresponding figure is 1 in 200 white American women have been in prison. We should wonder a bit more about why men are like this … )

Literally.

You obviously haven't read the legislation.

Ehay don't you do that, then come back to me.

I took “pearl clutching” from the OPs first post.

and keep doing it as much as you like. It impacts noone, makes no difference to life - although it sounds like it gives you some marginal satisfaction feelings about your life? It’s meaningless in reality though. It’s not like anyone who doesn’t bang on about dumping imaginary criminal friends is a gangsters moll.

I’m not surprised. The amount of people who seem to be quite happy to pay cash for building work and thereby facilitate criminal conduct is incredible.

The reality is that nobody tells you what's really going on though. I've met wives and mothers of serious villains who really have no idea what is going on until the police are at their door. They believe the guys are making 5 star cruise money from roofing.

please don’t tell me you refuse to pay cash 🤦‍♀️

Me too. Don't they even realise how galling it is to the majority of us who have to pay our taxes? And just selfish and un-public-spirited? It’s the conspiratorial way they wink and assume you don’t want ‘the taxman’ to get paid either!

They expect their health care and policing to be there for them…do they imagine the fairies pay for that? It’s as if to say to their customers: you stupid mugs can do the paying while I go in my 3rd cruise this year.

I had dealings at work with someone who was convicted of murder a few months later. They were not in my social circle as a client and a boy I went to school with is a convicted rapist. One of the Mums at school is open about how she was in court a few times as a teen.

@ChicJoker I do not pay cash as well as disapproving of the black economy which evades probably more tax than the likes of Amazon and big corporations avoid tax that people on here bang on about I also like my points on my credit card. There is also a huge difference between tax evasion and avoidance which people struggle to grasp. People may not like big companies avoiding tax but if it’s not evasion then it’s legal.

You probably do know folk with a criminal record it’s not something that you generally brag about so unless you’re DBS checking new acquaintances as they come along yoto d never know.
I now own my own business and do a fair bit for charity and and I think a lot of folk now would be shocked to know that I had a minor conviction for assault on my record from 20+ years ago!
doing a bad thing doesn’t make you a bad person for life 👌🏻

Well no, I don't count trades unless they have a criminal record!
The one in three statistic actually have a criminal record. Honestly, you must know some of these people, how could you not? Also why the heck would they tell you?
As far as I know I have known very few personally - one affray, one common assault. And many more professionally. But really how would I know?. People don't broadcast this stuff.

I have a record but I don't see myself as a criminal over a stupid thing that happened when I was a teenager. But if I am one I'm the only one I know

I live in a very MN middle class, nice area in Scotland and don't know anyone involved in crime.

I can well believe that! But I don't think they are blameless. These women should take some interest and have some knowledge of what their partners are earning. I suspect some of them turn a very convenient blind eye.

I agree dodging your tax isn't like being a serial killer or bank robber but it's still dishonest and fraudulent - and it's illegal - they are breaking the law! And harming all of us, especially the hard-working people who earn far less than them. It really does annoy me.

I remember over Covid, when small businesses were allowed to claim from the govt for lost earnings and this was based on their previous year's tax return. I heard there were a number of tradesmen who'd declared they'd only earned about 15K for the year....and they got their come-uppance.