Had you heard of Charlie Kirk before yesterday?

[Havetoagree]

Just that really? I hadn’t and wondering if I’m the only one. And why is it such a big story? I guess the association with trump. What would be the equivalent level of fame over here?

I am now feeling really ignorant - not only had I not heard of Charlie Kirk but I haven't heard of Darren Grimes 🤦‍♀️

< goes now to crawl back under a rock >

Sounds like an all round good bloke 🤦‍♀️

He was emphatically not "decent" or in any sense a "good man". That still doesn't mean he should be killed. The death penalty, for whatever reason, diminishes civilised society. I am an absolutist on this.

I'm 46 and I've watched loads of his videos. He was an excellent debater, so calm and articulate. I disagreed with some of his opinions, such as abortion, but on the whole he made a lot of sense. I'm actually really shocked and upset!

I’m guessing his primary aim was just to unalive him. Job done.

Perhaps if public figures are shot instead of school children they might consider changing the gun laws.

Apparently so

I knew he was on the Ben Shapiro track i.e. debating students and using controversial conservative views to gain attention.

I have a slight conspiracy theory that its very convient for an adminstration whose only tactic is to create division to assert power to have such a divisive figure die very publically. Though I think in reality the person who shot him is a loner with some extreme views on people in general and the current US administration have just leaped on it with full force to sow further seeds of distrust amongst americans.

😂 Calm down. He literally was saying lives would be lost because of abortion, black people, rape, guns… and he thought that was ok.

Yes I had heard of him, had seen some of his videos and our politics and views were on the opposite ends of the spectrum. Am 45 and nearly 16 year old DD had heard of him and was shocked.

Yes - I’m 61 - I’ve watched many of his debates. The Oxford & Cambridge ones are particularly good. He was an intelligent and articulate orator and when taken in context a lot of what he said made perfect sense. A lot like JK Rowling, his words are twisted, context removed and presented as an evil gotcha.

As he said, dialogue is key and if you just shut down your opposition, that leads to violent confrontation, which is not what he stood for. I am very saddened.

It’s actually baffling

Maybe I missed his inherent goodness. The bits I've seen of him are horrid. Rape apologist, would rather children give birth than access abortion, that black women are intrinsically less intelligent than white men, and that gun violence and deaths was a fair price to pay.

What is the good bit?

I find it rather odd how strongly some posters feel that nobody should admit to feeling like this. I think it’s a pretty standard response to someone you don’t personally know and who was an activist for causes that go against everything you believe in. Would I express such a view to his friends and family? No. About a public figure who didn’t exactly shy away from controversy on a forum? Not seeing the need for the handwringing.

It is. Like no one should be killed like that, but being killed like that also doesnt make someone who has said such terrible things a good person

My ds (17) told me about the video he saw of the shooting I feel at times I can’t protect him from such graphic content

I had heard of him from my ds and podcasts, he was an impressive political figure not that I agreed with his politics but he was certainly able to connect with young people

My opinion is as I stated.

I'm not trying to change opinions, I think people can make their own minds up.

I found him reasonable, his style was slow and he tried to express his opinions as well as he could.

I don't believe in perfection like many people do. In general, I liked him and respected him

No. I'm 50.

My 18yr old had heard of him. He'd seen him on tiktok.

Did you read what she said?

Why are people jumping to such conclusions?

Someone asked what there was to respect with him and I have an answer for myself.

He believed these conversations needed to happen. He believed opposing views being discussed ensured a greater sense of seeing each other as human beings. He believed these conversations were needed because once we see each other as human that lowers the risk of violence.

I respect that he started conversations with people he disagreed with. As we know all too well in Mumsnet those conversations are exceedingly rare.

No, never heard of him until now.

Now finally, someone I have heard of!

No I hadn’t, I’m 61. DH & DD had.

Put me where you like.

I would put you in the ignorant, hysterical, irrational idiot camp if I could be arsed, but I won't, because I can't be arsed and you aren't important enough.

Yes. Charlie Kirk was a highly intelligent, articulate person of deep Christian faith. He was a defender of free speech and believed that respectful debate was the way to reduce violence in society, because in discussion, you could see the humanity of the other side. He was ideologically coherent, so even if you didnt agree with his views, you could understand how he did. I thought he was an exceptional man and am deeply saddened by his death.

Are you not concerned at the attack on free speech?

I’m sad about the man, as well, despite not agreeing with him about much. You don’t have to be sad if you disliked him, but surely your concerned about the implications of this murder?