Children having their own seat on a packed train.

[user1493559472]

I am on a packed train. A child who is about 3 years old is sat in their own seat and not on the parents lap, would you ask to sit down and the child sits on parents lap? People were standing.
Thank you

Problem is my toddler sometiments doesn't really love sitting on my lap. If I put him on my lap, he starts climbing over me, looking behind him, tries to run off etc etc. So it might be easier for everyone if he does sit and is distracted with a book or the window or sth.

Maybe some trains have more space than others but there isn't room to do that on the local trains where I am. There's barely room for your two legs without children on them.

I wouldn't ask.....but I would secretly judge the parent for not having the awareness to see that others are standing, and move a small child onto their lap.

As a parent I would never let my children occupy a whole seat if adults were standing. I know respecting elders doesn't count for much nowadays, but it's what I tried to teach my children.

On short journeys I used to have twins on my lap (one on each knee) but longer journeys we’d sit 3 along a row of two seats as they fitted fine. I don’t think young dc should stand on a train as they don’t have the balance but my experience of taking 3 dc to London is train passengers always offering young dc their seats. My experience is very different to the one portrayed on mn.

Odd, twins I’ve been on are standard size and a healthy weight person who want super tall would fit with a dc on each leg. Wouldn’t want to do it for a 2 hour journey mind. I would give my 2 dc the seat to share and stand myself at that point.

Not everyone would manage fine.

It isn't just Autism either, my son is physically disabled and can't stand. Sitting on my lap wouldn't work either due to issues he has with his legs.

On a busy train with his wheelchair folded, he just looks like a typical child who isn't disabled.

I still haven't seen an answer as to why an able bodied adult is more entitled to a seat than a child who got there first. It seems to be just an inherent sense of entitlement, and the view that children are a public nuisance and not full members of society with their own rights. And the parent should suffer to make sure everyone else is comfortable as a punishment for daring to exist in public with children. "In my day" is not really a valid reason. As the parent, you have a right to sit comfortably, especially if the child is already safely seated. There’s no moral obligation to make yourself uncomfortable just to satisfy someone else’s perceived “need” for a seat, or feeling that a child does not deserve it. Posters comparing children to bags, and calling them "it" only reinforces what I've written.

Why should a three year old give up their seat for a pregnant or elderly person and not a health adult who is actually able to reach holds, won’t be fallen over, won’t get wacked in the head by luggage, or badly scalded by a spilt drink, doesn’t tire so quickly, and is able to judge for themselves how to deal with people passing by?

I am shocked at the lack of manners and sense of entitlement. My children would have been on my lap. Now they are older, they would willingly stand so an adult could have a seat. It is about manners, respect, and kindness. These are important life skills.

Exactly this!

As I clearly stated - you paid for a ticket. So no, I’m not selfish. Selfish would be the idiots who think they’re entitled to something that I have paid for, and got.

It isn’t a lack of manners!

if practical I would have out my children my lap absolutely but if I knew it would cause a tantrum or they would be especially wriggly and disturb others I would have taken the view that it was politer to everyone else that he was quiet and calm in the seat. Chances are I would stand and let them have the seat and I’d offer my seat to someone else but not sure why I would be less deserving of the seat than another able bodied adult but I would do out of politeness.

I had 2 under 3 at one point and there was no way I could have had both my lap at the same time for more than couple of minutes whilst also trying to keep my bag in hand as well.

its a judgement call but it certainly isn’t safe for a 3 year old to be standing in a packed train so they should have a seat ahead of an able bodied adult. That should be a given.

So if someone demanded your seat with no further explanation, you’d stand up with no hesitation?

I have a hidden disability myself, so I’m not unsympathetic, but I think the person needing a seat at least needs to explain they need it because they are disabled / pregnant / whatever else is not obvious from looking at them, before they expect someone to relinquish their seat.

I wouldn't ask, no. However I do think the parent should take it upon themselves to realise that their toddler doesn't need a seat when a lap is a valid alternative and it would be good manners to offer the seat to a standing adult.

Really, given the outrageous cost of train tickets, train operators should not oversell seats. Everyone who has paid should have a seat. (The under 5 still wouldn’t have a seat but the op and every other adult would) More services should run at peak times and on popular lines.

Im not sure why we would rather bend over backwards to inconvenience ourselves and others when the answer is to tell train companies that enough is enough.

That’s exactly where the line’s drawn… those who think that we should have respect for our elders and those that do not. The former being of a, largely, bygone era and the latter clearly demonstrating why we live in a society where being inconsiderate, self-centred, thoughtless and entitled is very much the norm. Every man for himself and all that. Oh joy!

I challenge those who think it is safe for a three year old to stand on a train, to sit cross-legged on the floor of the aisle of a packed commuter train as people push by going up and down the train with luggage and drinks. See how vulnerable you feel. And you are considerable stronger than they are, treated with more respect as an adult and as you will be sitting, considerably more stable.

Wow, the mind boggles! Well done for staying put.

This, my daughter I'd put on my lap, my son who has ASD and ADHD is leave alone because you wouldn't want to sit directly next to a child having a screaming kicking meltdown.

Children under 5 have free tickets on trains specficially because they’re supposed to be sitting on their parents’ laps. If a child needs a seat then you do need to pay either full price or for an older child’s ticket. You should have reported it to the train manager & they would have given the option to the parent to purchase a ticket.

Children a full members of society, and as such your responsibility extends to them as well. I am not sure why or from where you get the idea that people who choose to have children should put up with being uncomfortable to make you comfortable. Why? Because you are more of a member of society than they are? That parents are somehow lesser and should be punished for having children? Some people will take their children to their laps if they feel inclined to, I probably would. But I wouldn't give into someone who feels like a superior member of society than a child, or a parent with a child.

Why don't manners respect and kindness extend TO children?

No I wouldn’t ask. I’d hope they would put the child on their lap as I would if the train was busy. Although possibly not if I were to be on the train for a while.

I think a young child should sit on their parent's lap but apparently that's totes unreasonable these days.

OP doesn't indicate that she knows that the child doesn't have a purchased ticket.