Do people really think PIP claimants are fraudsters?!

[Greedybilly]

As someone with a chronic illness in the middle of claiming PIP I think it's important to point out it's very stressful to go through the process and actually get the benefit.
To those who were inferring it's an easy blag - I would say yes there will always be a few scammers who claim fraudulently ( though god knows how tbh?) the majority have to struggle for years/go through appeals/give up.
Just saying this for balance as I feel MN is turning slghtly into the Daily Fail.

They're not free

I don't know if people think people are fraudsters as such more that some people including those in government think that pip shouldn't be given for conditions like depression, anxiety, adhd and to people with less severe autisim.

It's very much a question of degree. I've successfully appealed at least 2 cases where the sole diagnosis was ADHD. In both, the clients' ADHD was so severe they couldn't effectively complete anything vaguely complex, and one of them had had 2 accidental fires because they had got distracted by something while cooking. Their ADHD was so bad that their executive function was completely shot most of the time, and they had such difficulty following the thread of a conversation that they scored points for the "communicating with others" activity (although they wouldn't now, as some fairly recent case law has moved the goalposts somewhat). Iirc, they both got the lower rate of the mobility component, too, because they couldn't cross roads safely or remember where to get off the bus.

The self-neglect that can stem from significant depression often means people need prompting for real basics, so score points for preparing food, taking nutrition, washing/bathing, dressing/undressing and engaging with others.

Anxiety is a huge spectrum too. I've had a couple of clients where their anxiety is so severe they can barely string a sentence together. Working with them is incredibly challenging and time-consuming, because they are so anxious that they can only take in or relay small bits of information at a time. Doing a PIP application normally takes me around 2 hours. With clients with severe anxiety, it takes shedloads longer, and I usually have to do them over 2 or even 3 2-hour sessions, because they just fall apart unless I take things very slowly and gently.

Correct not ‘free’ but paid for by PIP, including tax, insurance, maintenance, breakdown cover, a blue badge, oh and a bus pass. Once you get certain benefits it seems to unlock more and more. Don’t forget PIP is not means tested.

Pip has nothing to do with a blue badge

It can do. If you score high enough on mobility you can absolutely apply for a blue badge.

Anyone can apply for a blue badge

Im sure there are loopholes

In many councils if you have high rate mobility you automatically get a blue badge - I know this because this is how I qualified for one.

It’s fascinating the amount of othering in these threads. Those that hold strong beliefs about all the ScRoUnGerS may be benefit claimants themselves, but they are the genuine, worthy ones of course. The people I have known who strongly believe the benefit scrounger narrative, have been recipient to the same benefit. The system causes so much distrust that even people who should have empathy and common ground with each other, are at loggerheads. Isn’t it important to think critically about this? Isn’t there a better thing to stand for and fight for, other than reducing disability benefits?

Our council doesn't but a disabled person can absolutely apply for a blue badge anywhere in the country without being on benefits

Why are you writing scroungers in an odd way?

Probably.

@DipsyDee And another obtuse pointless comment from you that adds absolutely nothing to the discussion. I guess it must make you feel included 😂

so you don’t know why you wrote it this way? And what did your comment add to the value of the thread? You really are coming across as incredibly aggressive

But why DID you write scroungers like that?

I know one person claiming it who in my mind would be better off actually finding a job. She has depression and anxiety, but doesn't seek treatment. She would be so much happier if she went on antidepressants and actually found a job.

I also know someone who should be claiming some kind of benefits but isn't.

But the plural of anecdote is not data. The statistics say we have a high ratio of people claiming compared to other first world countries, and not just because we have an aging population. It's been reported that there is a sharp increase in young people with mental health issues preventing them from working. Whether they are honestly claiming or not, the whole country needs to tackle this.

the plural of anecdote is not data. The statistics say we have a high ratio of people claiming compared to other first world countries, and not just because we have an aging population. It's been reported that there is a sharp increase in young people with mental health issues preventing them from working. Whether they are honestly claiming or not, the whole country needs to tackle this.

Well put.

Which makes sense. No point in having the car from your PIP or child's DLA if you can't afford everything that comes with it.

So many people on this thread that seem to be able to diagnose both physical and mental health just by looking at others. Never mind the DWP, they should be working for the NHS no need for all those pesky expensive tests then..save the taxpayers a fortune.

One point:it's not just a matter of 'going out and getting a job'. It's also a matter of someone being willing to give you a job! Many people with mental health problems could work, if employers were willing to employ someone who might need to take more time off sick than average; to give more handholds than average; to put up with somewhat odd behaviour. Maybe there need to be more incentives for employers to employ some such people.

PIP, however, is not linked to unemployment. What might reduce some people's need for PIP would be more provision of assistance on public transport. The recent abolition of ticket offices in many stations has made it more difficult for disabled passengers to locate assistance, even when it's provided in theory. Of course, the provision of assistance- and ensuring that there are working lifts at all stations - might end up costing more than it potentially saves, but it would IMO be a good idea, for elderly people as well as younger disabled people.

Of course I read it; but that’s only part of the story. It doesn’t really talk about large corporations. See for example

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/dec/11/us-multinationals-underpaid-56bn-in-tax-in-uk-last-year-hmrc-believes?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Large companies use transfer pricing to transfer their profits in the UK to lower taxed jurisdictions.

Another example - companies take over large chains of care homes, by loading them with debt and then transfer their property to off shore subsidiaries - the company is then having to pay rent (thereby transferring profits to tax havens) and interest on the debt, which are allowable for tax.These increases in costs have to be covered in the fees paid by either self funders or local authorities.

Ditto children’s care homes being taken over by private equity investors to make massive profits at the expense of UK tax payers and local authorities.

Look up Vat carousel fraud - complex schemes to avoid VAT.

See Shein and Temu

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c078j4kylz3o

How has privatisation of the water and energy companies benefited British taxpayers - now paying dividends to shareholders on top of the costs of the water and energy, they were paying for before?

Yes - why not go through the records of a lunatic asylum in Victorian times and see why people were admitted. I have done, trying to find one of my relatives, who disappeared from public records around the 1850s. It’s illuminating.

Anyone can apply for a blue badge. a BB has nothing to do with PIP. And getting PIP does not get you a Blue Badge either. my DC receives high rate mobility on PIP and does not qualify for a Blue Badge.

so much BS is sprouted about on here - I guess mostly by posters who never applied for PIP in the first place

What did people with physical disabilities do in the days before benefits?

I’ll tell you how it needs tackling, but everybody knows already.

SEN needs to be given proper provision and funding in schools.

CAMHs needs proper provision and funding so children don’t continue to go untreated and enabled to get worse causing a bottle neck in adult services.

Transition between CAMHs and adult mental health needs to be a whole lot better.

Adult MH services needs proper provision and funding so patients aren’t left to get progressively worse. The current situation is dire. Very ill patients get next to nothing other than patching up p temporarily in crisis.

Treatable conditions are turning into far more complex and difficult to treat conditions.

The Tories decimated all the above so we are now left with the situation we have.

Ignoring MH and SEN doesn’t make either go away, it makes them worse.

If physical conditions were treated the same there would be a national outcry.