DH told two year old to hit back

[NachoChip]

Our two year old DS got bitten at nursery yesterday. This morning, DH told DS that if someone bites him, he should hit them back. His rationale is he doesn't want DS to be pushed around and that the child will soon learn not to bite him again.

AIBU to think this is way too young to totally confuse a two year old that you can hit in this circumstance but not in any other. And that returning violence - on a two year old who themselves are developing and learning - is damaging and ridiculous.

Also, AIBU to worry that even if I get through DH now, when DS is older DH is going to teach him to hit back at school etc. How do we approach this? I want to teach DS to be able to stand up for himself but not to fall into this toxic alpha male masculinity that violence is the answer.

Wise MN, what is your advice please?

I don’t think I would tell a 2 year old to hit back. I think he might be a bit young and it could be confusing for him.

I have told my slightly older children (girls - 5&8) to hit back if anyone hits them though.

I can see where your husband is coming from, but I do think 2 is a little too young for that advice.

Just when I think I’ve read the most depressing Mumsnet thread ever-this one comes along…

It would be great if teachers actually did things but you hear of ao many kids getting bullied. Teaching a kid to defend themselves is a necessity these days as way too many get let down by adults and often bullies have parents that won't accept their kid is a bully

Im team hit back.

Absolutely not!

My DC’s nursery had an aggressive child. They taught the other children to say loudly “No Ollie!” with their hand out and stepping back. It worked very well, alerted the staff and protected the child and it didn’t descend into a fight. Staff could then safely manage the child and his outbursts.

I also absolutely disagree with hitting back for older children. Again, it becomes a fight, your child is far more likely to get hurt than walking away and calmly yelling an adult. It also confuses the bullying situation and may end up with the wrong child being labelled the bully - or in fact most likely - as I have seen many times - the correct child is labelled the bully but the parents don’t believe this and they encourage their child to keep hitting back when their child is in fact the instigator.

Also children have poor understanding of proportionality - my own DC are examples of this. “He hit me” = he accidentally bumped into me. But child 2 pokes back, child 1 hits out, now they’re on the floor fighting.

In the street you might need to defend your life. At school or nursery or in my home - no, there is always an adult available to help resolve the situation.

Whatever your take on hitting back, two years old is far FAR too young to be telling a child to retaliate.

At two years old they cannot possibly reason when another child has hit them purposely, whether it was an accident, or just sometimes normal human contact in a shared space.

You run the risk of your child misinterpreting interactions with their peers and hitting out lashing out first.

I do teach my kids to hit back but with great nuance. And no they can't have that level of comprehension at 2. It's by about 9, when they have some understanding of who really doesnt possess the emotional regulation of their peers for whatever reason.

I think two is too young.

We’ve taught DD1(6) how to hold her hands out in front of her to block and defend herself if someone is going to hurt her. She knows that if someone is trying to hurt her she can use her hands to push them away. That’s not the same as hitting back in retribution for something though, which is what hitting someone after the initial incident happened is. At 2, they can’t really understand the nuance of defending themselves v just hitting because they got hit.

Jesus, aged 2! For all you people telling your 2 years olds to fight back you should be shot. When my son was 8 ish I told him to push the child away.

I never at bulled at school, but it had nothing to do with hitting back.

It's not the done thing but yeah I always told my kids to stand up for themselves physically if needed, when they were little. It's not "toxic masculinity" to defend yourself when you are 4 years old.

Out of interest, how do you know your kid didn't hit first and isn't in fact the bully?
I'm guessing no one who teaches their kids to hit and use violence can ever be 100% sure.

I think dc should be taught its sometimes OK to hit back. But not at 2: they are far to young to understand when its OK and when its not OK.

I feel the same about stranger danger. I was not amused when I lost my scooter -driving 2.5yo in Holland Park, and she actually left the park, scooted ACROSS Kensington High Street and down the road. When finally a woman stopped her and asked where her mummy was, she refused to answer because nursery had told her not to talk to strangers. In this situation ANY stranger was less risk than speeding cars, but she was to young to understand when you should allow an adult to help.

So you and your dh are both partly right, but I think 5 would be a better age for this than 2.

people should be shot for teaching 2 yr olds to fight back?

I’ve worked in schools for 20 years in auxiliary/supervision roles , in my experience when a child retaliates and hits back it inevitably turns into a fight as the first child will then retaliate, and so it carries on. Usually with a crowd of other pupils egging them on. From Primary through to Secondary. Whereas if they walk away and tell someone we can deal with it.
I do think martial arts / self defence classes are a great idea . Learn how to diffuse a situation, and how to fight back as a last resort.

It’s pretty rubbish to tell them to hit back. It basically says you don’t know how to teach them to deal with a situation without resorting to violence.

Absolutely violence breeds violence. All hitting back will do is escalate the situation.

And what happens when they get older? And they’ve spent their whole life being told it’s ok to hit back?
I work in the prison system I know lots of men who have started fights because ‘someone looked at them funny’ or other spurious reason, the victim has then hit back (‘in self-defence’) and the perpetrator sees red, goes in harder - beats them to a pulp, pulls a knife etc.

Research shoes that all children get bullied, pretty equally. The children who don't internalise this and remember comments etc into adulthood are those with a solid self esteem and a compassionate understanding of others experiences.

Meaning they don't blame themselves, instead they rationalise that the other person is having a bad time and it's nothing they did.

Exactly - the whole "snitches get stitches" starts with this mentality too - don't tell the teacher or authority. It's a literally vicious cycle.

Because the boy she hit back (after she had told the teacher and it continued) told his parents he had been hitting her. He also received consequences from his parents as they were shocked he had been hitting a girl

This a,two year old. Teach no or stop and to move away.
Self defence classes come later and first rule is walk away!

Well maybe not made to face a firing squad, but they certainly need to have a serious word with themselves!

It depends. My then 2 year old was pushed over by another toddler whilst we were on holiday. The other little one's parents immediately intervened, removed their child and told him off. They also apologised profusely. I wouldn't have wanted my 2 year old to immediately thump the other kid back.

Not sure where to start with this one…

I think hitting back is the wrong message. The way I approached this was to say if you can’t get away you can hit to make someone stop hurting you. I am not sure if a 2 year old would understand that though. I do think there is a big difference between hitting back, which is retaliation and illegal, and hitting in self defence.

I’ve taught both of mine that you can hit back in self defence but not in response to provocation or as retaliation.

Common sense and also the law.

I’m not sure how I’d approach that that with a toddler though.

I think a “no hitting” emphasis would probably work best a that age!

Two is a bit young tho I get it. My youngest kept being bitten by the same arse child. She used to shout I’m not food! And push him away.

By the time the children were older and hit mid primary we had very much a don’t hit them first but if they touch you hit them as hard as you can we won’t tell you off for it stance. Only ever had to be used once.