To think it takes real strength for a woman to stay single, in a world where so many people settle just to say they have someone?

[TheRubyMentor]

I see so many people rushing into relationships that don’t actually make them happy, just so they can say they’re in one. It feels like society still values having a partner over choosing the right one and a lot of people end up in situations they’re not truly happy in.

Meanwhile, a woman who stays single because she refuses to settle, often gets questioned, pitied or told she’s “too picky.” But isn’t it actually a sign of strength to hold out for something meaningful rather than just grabbing onto anything?

Has anyone else noticed this or do you think I’m being unfair?

@JHound What about if he earned the same? How would things look then?

This….. tenfold!!

If you took children out of the equation, I'm sure women would be pickier.

I'm not sure it's about being picker but more about working from a different set of criteria or at best additional criteria.

Though how much reproductive time there is probably dramactically affecting how much compomising goes on.

I aksed at young age and early on in relatonship if DH wanted kids - as I knew I did though not for a long time - but I wanted someone who'd be an enthusiastic parent and while he could have lied changed his mind etc I found it helpful to know if this could be long term as we had common life goals.

That tends to get frowned on till you are late 30 early 40 - I've seen that on here and in media - but it does explain how there are semi frequent posts from that age range who finally asked their DP/DH and found they never wanted kids and are devastated.

It doesn't help women ambivalent themsleves about kids obviously - but more directed communication could help men and women who know they want kids ending up pairing up with people sure they don't and then facing tougher choices as lives have slowly entwined.

I'm also odd by MN standards - I've lived by myself and know I do better living lwith others even with compromises that entails - though doesn't have to be a romantic partner - not sure that makes me weak but more self aware of my limitations.

I was single for 10 years between my late 30s and late 40s. And happily so.

I wouldn't say I felt pressurised in any way to find a new relationship.

People generally didn't comment but I had fewer people suggesting that I should be in a new relationship than I did who were positive and supportive about it.

I'm not really sure why I'd be influenced by the opinions of others anyway?

I did meet someone eventually as it happened but I wasn't looking, I didn't settle and I would be perfectly content to end it if I were no longer happy.

I don't fear being alone or desire approval from anyone else.

More money into a household is always nicer.

But my point is just because somebody prefers more money it does not mean they are not financially self-sufficient.

For a partner, I'd pick my husband.

If I were picking a father for my son, I'd probably still pick my husband.

Picking a perfect coparent? I'd want to pick one of my friends' husbands. Guys who are very into cleaning and cooking, early risers and neither of them much into sport. Very practical and hands on with household tasks without a grumble.

(My husband is reasonably good at doing household tasks but boy does he fanny about and grumble.)

Someone being great at all three is somewhat of a unicorn. Well, for a man, anyway. Fortunately we're just about able to stay friends through the tough bit of parenting, whilst grousing at each other about the daily grind.

In my experience, I don’t think women settle straight away as it were. By that I mean I think when women pair up with a man they do think he is the perfect one for them. I don’t know anyone who entered a marriage thinking, well he will have to do.
However, I do think a lot of women stay in poor relationships. They know it’s very flawed, they know their oh won’t change. They know he doesn’t respect, value, or love them as much as he could but they tolerate it.
Why do they tolerate it?
Often due to children, societal pressure, self esteem, background, finances or whatever. But they absolutely do stay in bad relationships so they must believe it’s better than being single.

I’ve no doubt it does but I’m going on my own experience (now happily divorced)😊

It depends what 100% happiness means to you I suppose. I don't mean natural ups and downs, we all have them

I mean more of the people I know that

One has a husband who has lost his job 3 times, made it so they've had to move several times.... the financial insecurity and stress he brings his wife consistently..... I could not live with that

One has a partner who constantly messages other women, doesn't help her with the children.... again I couldn't live with that

One has a partner who uses his excuse of working all the time to come home and not help with the house or the children... again not for me

They all claim their happy...... but their not. Every single one of their partners bring them stress and upset.

I literally do not know a single person whose partner hasn't hurt or brings them stress frequently. Other people can look past it or try and work through it..... I wouldn't want that.

For me 100% happiness isn't life's up and downs, it's stuff like the above.

Actually, I do know one couple who are genuinely happy. They are an older couple almost in their 60's and have both as far as I'm aware always been supportive of each other. But that's one couple out of God knows how many

I know too many people willing to look past or out up with bad behaviour over the pretence of being happy or in a happy relationship. I couldn't do it

@SusanSHelit this was me to a T. I say “was” since on 29/10/17 I met my husband, a widower, at Sunday lunch at my school pal’s. She only invited/texted me that morning, returning my call of a few days before. Had I not called her there’s no way that she would’ve invited me to lunch on that day, in a kind of “sliding doors” scenario

I was adjusting to my new normal after my mother’s death six months previously and had only recently started socialising. He, on the other hand, had been widowed 3.5 years before and had not been in the dating pool since 1989! I would not be with anyone had we not met because I had a happy and fulfilled life

I do remember many pitying looks & PA comments from smug married women WRT my single status and it was infuriating. I realised that some were jealous which was a lightbulb moment

Eh?

I'm very happily single, and I can assure you that it takes no effort at all. When I've been in relationships, it took way more effort to stay in them than to walk away.

I'm late thirties and have never had a boyfriend. I've also always lived alone. So I think I can speak with great authority on this 😅

I actually don't see it as a strength, or a weakness. It's neither better this way nor worse, it just... is. It has always been this way and i don't know any different. It's not like I wake up every morning tired from the fight of resisting the urge to hastily find a man and declare myself taken, I just... get up and make my coffee and go about my day.

People honestly don't grill me either. The dinner scenes with the "smug marrieds" in the Bridget Jones films are funny but honestly not my experience. I can only think of two instances in my 19 years of singledom that I felt awful at being single:

1. A funeral. Aunt and uncle died within 24 hours of each other, two months before their daughter's wedding and it was a double funeral. Looking around everyone had someone - mum and dad had each other, sisters had their husbands, cousins had their bfs and gfs... I took comfort from the stone arch of the doorway. The limestone didn't say much, but it did an okay job nonetheless 😂

2. I don’t quite fit into the group dynamic of the neighbours/friendship circle in the village — for example, gatherings naturally form around couples. To be clear, I don’t see this as anyone being unkind or deliberately leaving me out; it’s just one of those things that happens.

oh okay another one -

3 - When I had the extension built a sister really grilled me on what my plans were and kept implying that I didn't understand what it would be like when the works starts, and would be overwhelmed with the decisions to be made. We had a bust up about it! She definitely would not have gone that route if I had a husband standing by my side while saying "we have decided this haven't we darling" and "we will chose xyz nearer the time" etc etc It was Christmas Eve and I was embarrassed she made me feel so small at a party in front of people, ruined that Christmas it did. I stayed in alone the next day.

Does this just apply to women without children? I've been single 10 years and would like to meet someone now and most people seem horrified that I'd want to date again! And seem to think I should remain alone forever now

I’m delighted to learn from your post that my husband is that unicorn! Go him 🦄

Always? At what cost your freedom and peace of mind?

I haven't RTFT but I very much disagree. Maybe years ago it was like that but I'm not sure it still is. Or at least that its widespread.
I'm in a relationship now of almost a year, but I was single for over a decade before that.
I enjoyed being single, did some dating but never felt any pressure to settle for anyone. I'm only in a relationship now because I've met someone who feels right for me. If I hadn't met him, I'd still be single and not that bothered by it.
If women are feeling pressure from their social circle to settle, then I think they need to look at their social circle and the type of friends they have. I'd never expect a friend to settle when being single can be so much better.

I don’t find this true at all Op. Most of my friends are single by divorce so 40’s/50’s.

They generally try a bit of dating just because they miss sex but don’t want ONS and they like the odd cuddle. Theres also the cheaper holiday/household bills aspect. Other than that being single works fine.

I can’t think of anyone who judges them for not being in a relationship including themselves.

I don't know if this has changed in the 21st century, but my social life tanked after my first divorce. The dinner parties evaporated, even invitations to larger gatherings became less frequent. My women friends now met me for a coffee or a quick drink without their partners. I'd been relegated to some sort of small 'spare female' slot. My ex, meanwhile, was still invited to everything, including those dinner parties whose hosts had originally been my friends. I hosted more than he did, but return invitations were sparse.

I was quite unimpressed with myself for marrying XH#2, an obviously bad match although the sex was great - at the back of my mind was the thought that marriage would make me 'socially acceptable' again.

I really hope this has changed! But if you're in a couple and have found yourself leaving out your single female friends - please don't! It hurts.

Oh I see you are adding extra words not said. I was merely saying I would take more money over less and that preferring more money does not mean you are not self sufficient.

If you want to add more metrics to consider that’s a different conversation.

I don’t think the overwhelming majority of social circles do expect women to be in couples, though. I think that’s women in shit relationships convincing themselves that it’s better than being single, and that ‘everyone does it, it’s normal, it’s compulsory, any no one is that happy.’ Rather like women who think having children is just ‘what you do’, rather than thinking ‘Is this what actually want?’ and seem very triggered by the happily childfree.

I was looking for shared life goals and ablity and desire to work togther towards them in a husband just for me that including shared goal of kids - being up initally at least for same number and similar ideas on raising them or desire to talk though issues when we disagreed.

I wasn't personally looking for perfect unicorn as I'm sadly not perfect though he does clean and tidy cook like my Dad and FIL do (and actually even one of my granddads actually did )- so while occasionally we've needed to talk to share household tasks mostly we've muddled along just fine.

Maybe I got lucky and got a unicorn.