Dd17 work won’t let her book some time off for her driving test

[Blueybingomum]

dd17 is currently doing an appearance in a nursery. She’s been there a year and absolutely loves it but the managers can’t be abit funny.

she passed her theory test last week straight away booked her driving test, now these are horrific to get atm and she luckily managed to get one in 11 weeks time.

she went to work yesterday and asked if she could book it off but manager has said it’s unlikely. She asked if she could just take the morning off as it’s at 11am but again, said unlikely. They told her she has to look at the staff rota and rebook her test. They have more staff than needed atm and are constantly sending staff home early.

Aibu to think it’s abit harsh.

That's ludicrous. I would just take the time off anyway, they can't sack her, unless she doesn't have a permanent employment contract. (Then they could get rid of her.)

I failed my driving test several times, but on the one I passed, I took it at 8.30am some 30 years ago, in the rush hour in a big town that was bloody busy. I rang in at 8am, and left a message on the answerphone saying I had an emergency, and wouldn't be in til about 10am. (I was meant to start at 9am.)

I passed, and confessed I had fibbed, as I didn't want anyone to know I had failed (AGAIN) if I did. They were so chuffed for me that they didn't care that I had lied! 😆Next time @Blueybingomum your DD should just claim she has a medical appointment and not tell them that she is taking her driving test.

A good employer would encourage her, and allow her the time off. She needs to start looking for another employer. The one she has is not nice or kind.

Has she been able to take the leave she is legally entitled to?

If not then I was be seeking legal advice on employment law and how she was being exploited and denied her legal rights.

I do wonder if they don't want her to do a driving test, because if she passes she can get another job and tell them where to stick it.

Employers who behave in these draconian ways need to consider the cost of repeated recruiting, as against retaining staff by treating them like actual human beings with lives outside work.

I don’t think people who pull sickies are cunts, your boss doesn’t care if you live or die. If you died on the job, most places would take your uniform and give it to your replacement before your body is even cold.

OP's DD is trying to do just that. She doesn't want to have to resort to such tactics. She needs that day off, has given 11 week's notice. What else is she meant to do?

It seems ridiculous but was she told there was no annual leave to be taken on the apprenticeship? Is the rota already done?

This is absolutely ridiculous. I would be looking for another job.

Did you pick up on the fact that her inability to book annual leave correctly is due to the fact that her employer will not allow her to book annual leave in case someone else (who has not already booked) wants it that day?

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. (The prize is having to cover absence with no notice because you don't let your staff book annual leave so they call in sick.)

Also arguably age discrimination.

I would make it clear that she will be taking the half day or day off, whatever is needed, and attending her driving test as appointments are like the NHS these days: you take what you get.

She is entitled to annual leave, and this is more than enough notice.

It depends what the process is

It sounds like the process is "OP's DD requests leave months in advance and is told they can't guarantee she can have it because someone else might want it".

tbh I think she should have checked before she booked it. She works in an industry that legally requires a certain number of staff on at any one time. How far in advance she books it is irrelevant. If I want to book a holiday for a years time (nurse) I need to check that that week isn’t fully booked. If her being off means that they are then below the number of staff required for the children they have, what are they meant to do? Send kids home? Just go under the legal ratio? It’s unfortunate but I think it’s a learning moment for her that she has a real job now and has made a commitment to that and needs to plan ahead.

This is completely unreasonable. They should have an organisational policy and something in her contract - I bet they don't and I suspect gets shafted because she's young and they see her as not having commitments. She can't pull a sickie now she's asked for it but I'd be taking this as high as it can go as they're being unreasonable. Especially with driving tests as it's not easy to rebook. They need a clear operational reason for refusing leave and it doesn't sound like they have one. 'We don't do the rota that far in advance' is not a legitimate reason, and neither is it being winter. People get ill all the time and they need to plan for that possibility or put in people's contract upfront that nobody gets annual leave between October and March.

If she's an apprentice, and being able to drive would be valuable in her future career, she could also raise it in one of her progress reviews so it's been noted that the employer is being unhelpful.

FGS, have you read the OP's posts?

Her DD previously tried to book leave with 10 months' notice and was told no. Not because other people had already booked the same time off, but in case they wanted to.

This time they haven't even said, "No, you can't have that morning off because three people have already booked that day off and everyone else is on the rota." They've said it's "unlikely" she can have that time off, which probably means that if they approve her leave request for that day it will be fine, they will just have to say no to anyone else who subsequently requests the same morning off.

Her manager just isn't willing to commit to her taking annual leave off at any given time, in case they later decide they want her in on that day. This is completely incompatible with her being able to book a driving test, or, for that matter, a holiday at anything other than the last minute.

If you can't cover an apprentice being absent for three hours with 11 weeks' notice, perhaps you and the apprentice should swap jobs because you are clearly incapable of doing yours properly.

Do apprentices even count towards the legal ratio in a nursery?

You accuse the OP's 17 year old daughter of not planning properly in advance (as if it's so easy to plan the availability of driving test slots) and yet apparently an adult manager who cannot plan for the absence of their most junior member of staff for three hours with three months' notice isn't held to the same standard.

short term - tell them she's rebooked it for a day months in advance and try to get that day off. sounds like they will be arsey about that as well given the holiday example but doesn't matter. The most important thing is they forget she was ever trying to book this day. Then when it comes up pull a sickie, not for the driving test but the day or two days before, so again it's not directly linked to it. Take at least 3 days off. They might remember or might not, either way they can't prove she wasn't ill. The most important thing is she gets her test. She can then cancel the unneeded 'fake' test day, or just have it off as a long weekend if she books it for mon or fri.

long term - look for another placement and/or after the test make a formal complaint to whoever oversees the apprenticeships.

They sound utterly pathetic. Can't book time off months in advance because someone else might need it. So what? If everyone followed that rule nobody would ever be able to book any leave. Just because she's an apprentice doesn't mean she only gets the days nobody else needs.

Or just walk away.

I worked in retail, someone I worked with requested time off for a medical appointment for tests, there were concerns he could have cancer. Was told no as it was a 20% off event. So he actually cancelled his appointment. Got a new appointment, asked for the time off and was told no again.

He quit.

Popped back in to see us a year or so later. It had been cancer, treatment had gone well at that point.

Right, but that's not really her employer's problem.

I would just call in sick that day. They are being completely unreasonable.

Or - go in and advocate on her behalf in this situation. They will probably back down if you talk about reasonable expectations.

It will be their problem if people just call in sick because they aren't allowed to book annual leave.

Yep. Or resign.

I would actually love to do this.

"Hi Sharon. Just wanted to let you know I'm handing in my notice and my last day will be 30th June."

"Why?"

"So I can go on holiday on 1st July. You wouldn't approve the annual leave request I put in last September in case somebody else wanted to be off that week, so I have no choice really."

"But how am I supposed to find cover for that week with only one month's notice?"

"I don't know. It would have been easier if you had approved my request, then you would have had 10 months' notice. Anyway...not my problem!"

It won't be a zero hours contract if it is an apprentiship As an employer you have to commit to a minimum number of hours per week to get apprentiship funding.

Yes but it is horrific to book a test now, you have to just take what is on offer when it is available and snap them up immediately. There is little choice of dates - she’s been incredibly lucky to get one within 11 weeks.

“Just rebook for Christmas” doesn’t work, they’re all already booked up and the tests now becoming available are the one-off last-minute swaps.

DS has been going through this process and getting the notifications, by the time he clicked on some (almost instantly) there were already thousands of people ahead of him in the queue just for one cancellation.

Sounds like the employer also has no understanding of this current situation, but regardless of the reason, denying a single day leave with 11 weeks’ notice is proper arsey. I’d look into her contract.