To think rich people steal money all the time and that’s often why they’re rich?

[MyAmusedOpalCrab]

We hear so much about “hard work” and “smart investments” but let’s be honest, so many rich people didn’t get wealthy by being ethical. From dodgy business practices to exploiting workers, tax dodging, insider deals and straight-up corruption, wealth often comes at someone else’s expense.

Governments bail out billionaires while ordinary people struggle to afford rent. CEOs cut wages and benefits while pocketing massive bonuses. Huge corporations find loopholes to avoid taxes while the rest of us get squeezed.

Obviously not every rich person is a thief but AIBU to think that a lot of them are? That the system is rigged in their favour and they keep getting richer by bending or outright breaking the rules?

Seriously??!!

😂😂😂😂😂

Or they are buying properties to live in, and the type of properties they are buying has no bearing on the price of a three bedroom semi in Newcastle. They pay their workers legal wages; blame the (Labour, and successive) government for putting in a floor which all employers can legally pay. They invest in markets, which funds companies to expand and develop.

The majority of MPs have second homes, as well as many being landlords themselves. It’s almost as though they are contributing to a housing crisis just so they can tax us more.

This isn't the level of rich being discussed here.

Yes, and In your case, the discussion extents to emojis 👏

British companies aren’t doing a lot of expanding and developing, per the Cambridge Industrial Innovation Report of 17 Sept 2024 and other sources. If they were, under either the Tories or Labour, the economy would show better growth during or after those times. This hasn’t happened.

Pretty much... yeah.

She didn’t embarrass herself. You jumped to conclusions to fit your narrow mind-set, and you got told.

Evolve from the mindset you had before you read her response.

Just as a point, if you contribute to a pension, that is tax avoidance. If you contribute to an ISA that is tax avoidance. Are you saying using these tools are unethical because you get not only a tax break on entry (for pensions) but get a tax break during too? And ISAs and pensions are used by ordinary people, not just wealthy

I didnt actually. If you look back at my post you'll see that I asked if her husband was a multi millionaire. Because I was making clear THAT is who I was speaking about. Tbh assumed - from the post that I was responding to -that he wasn't and that was my point. But that's ok. Feel free to "jump to conclusions to fit your narrow mind set"

In fact the basis of pretty much all of my posts on this thread is that we SHOULDN'T be increasing taxes on the "top 1%" only. Or else that group will be the next one to fall into poverty. I am of a view that we should be taxing wealth not work. Because the ultra rich are THE ONES HOARDING ALL THE MONEY AND BUYING UP THE WHOLE COUNTRY! Is that you? If not then I'm not talking about you. It's people with £50mln plus in assets (for example)

Yep, agree, there are very many benefits cheats out there, but also so many 'money savvy' people who know how to make their work / money work for them. Not 'cheating' the system - but abiding by the rules. And no, I am not either of the above mentioned - just work all day, every day & just getting by. 🌹
Tax evaders is a whole other thread surely?

Absolutely, this.

At the moment, it’s the Saudis, Qataris and Emiratis buying up discounted super prime property in Mayfair etc. They benefit from the four year non-dom rule. They all over Knightsbridge and the west end shopping and dining.

I see this now, because they are all around. I was out for dinner in Mayfair on Thursday night, and so were they, en masse.

.

Most companies, whether owned by the ultra-rich or Joe from down the road, pay at least some of their staff minimum wage, because the government says they can. Does that mean most companies are pretty shit? Funny how increasing min wage never seems to reduce the need for in-work benefits though, huh? The bill just keeps increasing.

Raising wages/benefits fuels inflation so people are never any better off.

Staying factual will improve the tone if the debate. The top 1% is very unlikely to ‘fall into poverty’ according to any reasonable or literal interpretation of the phrase.

Dining, shopping and employing household staff is lovely for individuals but does not constitute meaningful ‘investment in the UK’. And you might ask why those properties are super discounted. Labour hasn’t had time to make that kind of impact yet.

Funny how that’s never a concern for the wealthy.

Addressing high end property - its very simple.

Its largely an fx play, or a country/political risk play, or a fiscal arbitrage. They are discounted for obvious reasons relating to Labour, and broader geopolitics - Russians leaving after sanctions, Chinese not welcome etc.

I am half inclined to look beyond this Labour shower - UK PLC may well become risk-on again once they are out.

Incidentally, I am comfortably in the top 1% (said with humility but to prove the following point). Last week, I calculated how much I have reduced my tax liability since Labour came in to Government.

With some simple measures, I have already reduced it by over 50k, and I plan to go further. This is basic behavioural economics, and many people have already taken similar steps to mitigate their tax exposure.

The last really strong economy the UK had was under Labour. It was Lord Mandelson who articulated that Labour are happy for people to become rich, as long as they pay their taxes.

Why didn’t you do that during the years of Tory government? Why the sudden imperative now?

I think doing what’s within the law is fine. No reason why not. I think some loopholes should be closed, however.

Very happy to answer you - from the head and the heart.

Labour came into Govt on a wave of vitriol, including against PS of course. They are stupid as well as vindictive, and with a few notable exceptions in the public sector, have targeted a number of socio-economic groups.

To me, they have made it personal - I will not pay them a penny more than I have to - legitimately.

Talking to a colleague last week, he mentioned he has seen more contractors dealing in cash - it’s no surprise that the black economy appears to have made a comeback (I dont condone).