To think rich people steal money all the time and that’s often why they’re rich?

[MyAmusedOpalCrab]

We hear so much about “hard work” and “smart investments” but let’s be honest, so many rich people didn’t get wealthy by being ethical. From dodgy business practices to exploiting workers, tax dodging, insider deals and straight-up corruption, wealth often comes at someone else’s expense.

Governments bail out billionaires while ordinary people struggle to afford rent. CEOs cut wages and benefits while pocketing massive bonuses. Huge corporations find loopholes to avoid taxes while the rest of us get squeezed.

Obviously not every rich person is a thief but AIBU to think that a lot of them are? That the system is rigged in their favour and they keep getting richer by bending or outright breaking the rules?

Both should be stopped. There isn't any resources available to do so unfortunately.

It seems there are.

https://www.fda.org.uk/news/hmrc-announce-5000-additional-staff-following-fda-recommendations/

Great news! 😊

You choose one data set from a left wing think tank, published by a left wing ‘newspaper’, for a policy that was introduced 45 years ago. Please, be serious.

And for context, within 12 months, Labour are facing a GBP 51 bn deficit (including fiscal headroom).

That’s from the NIESR, the UK’s oldest independent economic research unit.

How many will be WFH?

So you bring us full circle. This was the point of the OP's initial post. So, how do you think it came about? And please don't blame a government that's only been in power for twelve months. What, in your opinion, happened in the previous 14 years?
You might also wish to expand on why there is no council housing available to those who need it and why landlords such as the recently departed housing minister can increase rents with impunity.

Lol! All of them probably 😂

Their workplace is of no relevance if they increase Treasury revenue.

Not quite so simple is it.

Productivity home vs office.
Revenue collected vs headcount costs etc.

Obviously. The bottom line is clearly the amount of money recovered.

farage always cites the population increase since Blair came into power. THE BIT HE MISSES OUT is that government tax revenue went from about £250bn to nearer £1 trillion in that time. Adjusting for inflation it is over a 60% increase. That is partly because immigrants add to the pot. You can blame population growth but maybe instead you should blame the lack of public investment with this money. Besides we need immigrants to fund an ageing population and last time I checked the people and corporations buying up the housing stock for profit were not people arriving on a boat in Dover.

I wonder if HMRC will be as successful at recruiting the 5,000, as the Labour government are at recruiting their promised 6,500 new state school teachers?

How’s that working out btw - please could you update us all?

Two things can be true at once. I guess they know about tax evasion because the businesses are paying at least some tax. The benefit cheats are just taking, taking, taking; what do they actually contribute?

So true 👏

Calm down dear, you're embarrassing yourself 😂

You should probably read the posts you're referring too before you go off on a crazy tirade.

I agree entirely. It's very entrenced though. Perhaps it's been going on since the Elizabethan Poor Laws or people being annoyed at others 'on the parish'. Victorian workhouses were certainly meant to be punitive. I do think that current politiicians of all colours (I have been disappointed at KS 'useless eaters' line) and legacymedia and social media whip it up for their own ends though so I don't see it getting better any time soon. I hoped there might be a re-set when 'critical workers' (bus drivers, shopfloor workers etc) were officially 'valued' during Covid but no, we've gone right back to where we were. And worse.

Okay.

How many of these departing millionaires are British born of British parents? How many are expats from somewhere else who landed up here for a while and are now moving on? Very different scenarios.

A few of the former will always have reason to move. Eg my British husband wanted to return here and we had a good opportunity. That will happen in reverse, there will be professional requirements, etc.

If people genuinely leave their hone country because of a relatively small rough patch, that is pretty damned unpatriotic and frankly to hell with them. I won’t go into detail but I know whereof I speak.

What we need is growth but who will provide it? The Tories never got beyond green shoots in nearly 15 years so please don’t tell me policies favouring their cronies again is the answer

Does it matter where people are from? The country is losing wealthy people; people who spend and invest in this country. Who do you think will pay for stuff when those with money leave?

Can you please source the statement that the people leaving are investing in the country? I know there are a few mentions on this thread but I would like a statistic. Rich people don’t spend proportionately to their income.

The UK has the lowest private R&D (Research and Development) investment amongst major Western European nations, and correspondingly pays out a greater proportion of dividends. Our companies focus on short term shareholder gains rather than long term investment.

There are exceptions, of course. But at scale, we often look to foreigners to fund them.

Even Sir James Dyson is back, presumably because he and his family missed the place. I do think it matters whether you have deep ties or whether you landed up here because London in the 90’s and 00’s was a happening place, with not many questions asked about the source of your money. Easy come, easy go.

Look around @usernamealreadytaken
They aren't paying for it now and everything is expensive. That’s at least partly because of wealth hoarding.

My dad used to explain it like this....

It's the chap (the boss) on £120k a year telling the chap (the line manager) on £60k a year to tell the chlap (the worker) on £25k a year that he won't be getting a pay rise because there isn't enough money to go around....

Seems about right still today I guess...

That’s a nice bit of deflection and mental acrobatics. Ignore tax evasion because they pay a tiny % of tax. Why can’t we just say they should be paying the tax rate, end of, and if we find ourselves in a better fiscal position it can come down accordingly

If people genuinely leave their hone country because of a relatively small rough patch, that is pretty damned unpatriotic and frankly to hell with them.

Yes, I’m not sure what I think about that. Certainly, given we have elections in UK every five years it would seem quite a palaver for families to move countries with all the effort that would entail - new house, bank account, schools etc. - because they don’t like the new regime and then to return again five years later if a government they approve of returns to power.

On mumsnet there’s a popular view that if you leave because of reform or Brexit then we don’t blame you, but if you leave because of a labour government - well bugger off.

You were quoting me. We were and are highly against Brexit but never considered it a reason for moving countries.