to move to get ds out of trouble even tho we can't really afford it

[GreyPigeons]

hi sorry if this is all a bit of a mess im just really really struggling and not thinking straight half the time anymore. my ds is nearly 17 and hes gone totally off the rails i dont even recognise him anymore. i KNOW its county lines now not just guessing. hes got new phones hidden all over his room and clothes i know i didnt buy. money goes missing from my purse and he never has any answers just shouts or slams out or laughs in my face. hes barely here half the time but when he is its horrible walking on eggshells doesnt even come close

hes violent not just moody or teenage attitude but properly scary sometimes especially when dh is out working nights or earlys. he pushes me or grabs me or throws things, not like little tantrums its like hes so angry and im just there. last week he pinned me against the fridge cause i asked where he’d been and told him his little brother had been up crying waiting for him. then he just let go and walked off like nothing happened. i shake writing this but i dont know what else to do. dh tries with him but hes not his dad and its always been tense between them recently but that hurts extra cause they used to be so close. dhs been in his life since he was 2 and used to call him dad when he was little. they were proper close before. now its like all thats gone and he hates him just for being there

he used to be such a sweet boy really loving and gentle always looking out for his younger siblings and polite and chatty with people. but it all started to go wrong around year 7 like slowly at first just attitude and answering back and skipping homework then it just got worse and worse. he finished year 11 this june but it was a mess. he was barely going in most days and then he walked out of his english exam halfway through said he couldn’t be bothered. hes meant to be starting college in september but i honestly doubt he’ll show up at all. he dont care about anything anymore except his “mates” who are all trouble

we got 3 little ones 8 5 and a toddler just turned 2 and theyre scared i can see it. the older two flinch when he walks in or go silent and the littlest cries when theres shouting which is most nights now. hes bringing bad people to the door and last night he came home covered in bruises black eye fat lip and just said “dont worry about it” and went to bed like that was normal. he wont talk to anyone. we got social worker and police and youth offending people involved ages ago but he dont care they come round and he lies or acts like hes misunderstood and they believe it half the time

im thinking about moving just getting out of this area and starting fresh but its not that simple is it? we’ve got no money to spare and the kids all settled in school and nursery and it would mean starting all over again. and part of me thinks he’ll just find more trouble wherever we go cause maybe its just who he is now but i cant keep living like this i really cant. its like having a stranger in my house whos dangerous and i hate saying that cause hes my son and i love him but he scares me sometimes and its worse when dhs not here cause then theres no backup and i try to stay calm and not set him off but sometimes just asking him to wash his plate sets him off

i didnt grow up like this and i didnt want this for him his dads in and out of prison and i wanted better i tried to do better but its like i failed anyway. i never post on here just read but i just feel broken now and dont know what to do anymore. aibu to think moving might help even though we cant afford it and it might not even change anything? i dont know what to do

sorry for the long post and if it makes no sense im just so tired and sad and scared most of the time now

You are also right to be concerned about the trouble he is bringing to your door. When these people want their money you and your family will be in danger. Sorry op it is very frightening.

Call the police, surely??

Is he in contact with his dad? Do you think being in with criminals is what he wants to emulate?
Is there any times when you can talk to him? Ask him if he'd like a fresh start?

a few people have said he needs to go but hes only 16 i cant just throw him out. hes not 18 til next august and no one will take him anyway. social worker already said there’s no foster carers who would and tbh i dont blame them the way he is right now. but that dont leave us with many options does it

the violence is always worse when dh is working. hes on shifts and when hes not here i feel like im constantly on edge. last week ds pushed me when i was trying to stop him from storming out and dh came home and just saw red and hit him round the head. i know that was wrong and so does dh he felt awful after but its all got to boiling point now and dh said out in the real world if he shoved someone like that hed be getting way worse than a smack. its just a horrible mess and none of it feels right

we’re in a council house so moving would be a nightmare. new school for the younger ones new job for dh who’s the only one working i dont work cause of health issues and i wouldnt even know where to start with a move like that. but staying here just feels like waiting for the next explosion

random lads turn up at the door all hours of the day and night asking for him and its not the mates he used to have from school that i knew. these are older lads or ones who look rough and they look at me like im nothing. i left a message with the social worker today about him coming back beat up last night but they havent called back yet. i just worry they’ll say im not keeping the younger ones safe and take them away. and he just dont care he really doesnt

we dont have much family. my mums elderly and not well and my aunt helps when she can but shes getting on too. dh’s family mostly live abroad now except his sister and shes got a full house with her own kids

im just tired and scared and dont know what else to do.

I doubt he would go with you OP, even if you said you were relocating. He would probably move in with a mate.

That. You'll have all the upheaval and expense, and he won't go with and you won't be able to make him.

I'm sorry, but you need to prioritise your other children, who are being damaged by growing up in fear and who cannot feel secure and safe in their own home. You need support to get him out. I know that sounds terrible, but he's one child and you have three other innocent young children being damaged for life.

You need to call the police and have him arrested for assault the next time he touches you. And report all the other times he's assaulted you, threatened you, etc. You need more support from police, social workers, etc or this is all going to end very badly.

I would be telling social services he can't stay there any longer as well. Pack his things and tell him he's out. It's not fair to your other children to let him stay.

He has to go OP what a dreadful situation for you. The best thing for him right now is prison and that will be the only thing that might kick him up the arse. If it doesn't I'm afraid you'll have to let him go. Moving won't solve a single thing, I doubt he would even go with you x

I wonder if there’s a specialist charity or something who can provide support and advice to you?

I know nothing at all about this so I don’t know the best way to deal with it.

My concern would be how to do the move, timings, and whether any of you are safe at home especially if some drug dealer finds out he’s leaving. Is it possible that he owes someone money for example? When it comes to selling drugs, don’t they give them drugs then collect the money after? If someone were to be whisked off while owing someone money I assume they wouldn’t easily forget it for example? Are there other family members around who you’d need to worry about the safety of? (Grandparents etc)

That invites questions of how far away you’d need to go, whether he’d still be contactable, and whether there are any ties to people he’d be leaving behind that could be used against him

I am not trying to scaremonger - I literally know nothing about it so I’m not saying any of this is realistic. It’s just the kind of scary thoughts I’d have in my mind that would make me want to be very careful and get very confidential advice rather than a big snap decision that may cause issues that you hadn’t considered.

If he’s coming back home beaten up and refusing to speak about it, I’d be worried about the safety of your other children where you are now.

Please don't move. You can uproot your family but the trouble will go with you if this is county lines - and it does sound like it is. I am afraid there are only two things you can do and you need to do both no matter that it breaks your heart. Kick him out, and tell the police why. There is support available for you and him, and the police are more interested in the bigger fish - but he has to want to change and unless he does you will not be safe.

Have you tried this charity OP?
www.catch-22.org.uk/find-services/county-lines-support-and-rescue/

a few people have said he needs to go but hes only 16 i cant just throw him out. hes not 18 til next august and no one will take him anyway. social worker already said there’s no foster carers who would and tbh i dont blame them the way he is right now. but that dont leave us with many options does it

He's your son and you love him despite everything. But that is not your problem. It's the social workers problem. They are bullshitting you. You tell him to leave and let them sort out where he goes. Tough love is needed. They are depending on you not being willing to go there. If you do they MUST deal with it.

Have you told the social worker exactly what is happening? They need a really clear picture.

Can you track his phone, does he leave bits and pieces around the house like train tickets that might indicate where he is going?

You need as much information as you can get, and that needs to be shared. Police don’t want to criminalise young people, but they do need to be able to figure out who is exploiting him to take action.

Ring Ivison Trust for support for yourself.

If it’s county lines, he won’t be able to just stop. They’re likely to have threatened to harm him, and your family, and he will know this is serious. He will be terrified and this leads into the behaviour you see.

Does he have a good relationship with anyone? Get them to spend time with him, just doing things and chatting, give him the opportunity to open up. If it was my child I would move them to the ends of the earth, but I know there is so much else to consider especially with the other children and the likelihood that they will either find him or he ends up in the wrong crowd again.

This is so tough, I really wish you the best of luck.

Just reread your update. Social care will not remove your younger children for this, exploitation is seen as harm from outside the home. You do need to explicitly tell them your worries for your younger children as a result of this though. There are charities that offer support for child to parent violence too, it’s worth a google to see what’s in your area.

You need some support for you in this.

AdFam and NSPCC are a good shout. Also talk to a domestic violence helpline. You need all the support and tools.

You could move away, it may help, it may not. If you do move away, you would need to move very far away, so that going back isn't an option.

While it's tempting to want to control their behaviour where drug use is involved, you can't. You've done exactly the right thing by getting services involved and recognising the criminal exploitation of county lines. It can take a very long time for a young person to see that they've been exploited, there is a huge cognitive dissonance between recognising what it is and recognising that it happened to you. The ego has to psychologically protect you from seeing yourself as a victim. The way social workers operate is through persistent targeted contact to try and counteract the grooming. Are there any youth mentoring services that could link him to a male adult mentor?

What you can do is have your clear boundaries and when he is and isn't allowed in your home. You can let him know you love him but won't tolerate this. I am sure there are local youth or church drop ins that he can go to. Do not feel bad about calling 999.

https://adfam.org.uk/for-families/

https://www.nspcc.org.uk/keeping-children-safe/talking-drugs-alcohol/

Ring the free, 24/7, domestic violence helpline on 0808 2000 247.

If college looks unlikely would King's Trust courses in starting a business for young people aged 18-30 be an option:
https://www.kingstrust.org.uk/how-we-can-help/support-starting-business

I would move personally.
people saying to kick him out- no way would I do that if my child was on such a downward path. A move might well help- and it's worth a try rather than making him leave or just leaving him to it. If he is involved with drug dealers then it's u likely he can just get out of it where you are. If you're in a council house you could look into a mutual exchange

Is there a police youth worker you can contact?

Really sorry to hear of your pain and stress. Please don't blame yourself. As others have said now the priority must be to protect the younger children.
Sit him down with DH - ideally when the younger kids are out of earshot or elsewhere - and give him an ultimatum. Change or leave home.

Social care absolutely will look to safeguard younger children if the impact of that exploitation is having an impact on them, which this is. I very sadly (through work rather than acquaintances) know two families in similar situations to this, one where children weren't removed but moved area and one where very sadly there was a removal, although thankfully relatively temporary (but that doesnt make it feel any better obv).

You need to get out of the area. He may well refuse to come with you but that's sadly his choice to make. He will pull your younger children into it when they are old enough if you have not moved them out of reach.

Where are you please I worked a bit with some county lines kids there are some organisations that help but it’s not easy. My son was acting the goat when he was really young I took him to the Old Bailey to watch a trial of 6 15/16 year olds who killed a man unprovoked I also scared the absolute shit out of him by tricking him but he was alot younger than your boy

Following up PPs post with a link to Ivison Trust who look really helpful on county lines:

https://ivisontrust.org.uk/training-course/online-learning/

Gosh how awful for you, I’ve no words, but I’m sorry.

Sorry, I don’t think I was clear enough! What I meant is that if one child is being exploited, it’s not seen as the parents fault because the harm is coming from outside the family (assuming the parents are appropriately concerned, working with services, doing their best for all children and there are no other issues). So I was trying to reassure the OP that social care won’t see her as a ‘bad parent’ and seek to remove the younger ones. Yes if they are impacted there needs to be safeguarding put in place, but it’s usually either allowing the older one to come into care/moving them out of area/supporting the family to move. I don’t want this worry to put her off asking for the help she needs, hope that makes more sense!

I’m so sorry OP, this sounds utterly horrendous and you sound like a loving and deeply caring Mum.

Just a thought, could he go and stay abroad with your DH’s family for a time - eg a month - to try and break the pattern and give him headspace to think about his life and decisions? Would they do that for him? Could he be persuaded to go? (I know they’re not related).

It sounds like he’s in deep. If he’s also got a drug addiction and you move, it won’t take long for him to meet up with a shed load of more trouble in the new area.

With him coming home battered, it might be a good time to find out exactly what’s going on and if he wants to get away.

If not and this carries on, I think your only hope is the police and him leaving home. It might be the wake up call he needs.

Ultimately you must protect your 3 young ones.

It’s the worst thing in the world because you might not like him, but you’re his mother and you love him 💐